To think that women are still doing the brunt of childcare even on holiday?

[Binman]

I've just returned from a half term holiday with grandchildren and I am genuinely sad at how much of the childcare still falls to the women. I can honestly say that my observations around the pool and the restaurants it is the mother who is changing, feeding, applying sun cream etc. The father may get in the pool for a while but is mainly chilling while the mother does the main care.

I know there are hands on dads out there but the more I noticed the more I observed and so many of the fathers only did the fun bits in the pool or the quiet time, which was mostly the child on a phone or iPad.

It was the mothers sitting with the child on the plane or carrying three hand luggage's while the father carried the child. While waiting for our flight a woman I was talking to said she was dreading the flight as she was exhausted, when I asked her why she didn't sit in the 4th seat and leave the 2 children to her DH on one row, she said he won't do that.

I suppose my AIBU is that should the fathers not be stepping up, where both parents need a relax and respite from their usual daily grind?

My mum used to say 'going on holiday is just doing the same washing up in a different sink' 😢

Yes I do remember some self catering holidays when I was a child and my mother arranged and did everything and my father just came along with us kids.

More than half a century later and for some families nothing has changed.

Interesting to read the theories on here though.

Because they can get away with being lazy selfish sods

We went to Disneyland recently, with 5 kids. And I realised I was the only one up at 6am sorting clothes, the backpacks, snacks etc for the day before we would head to the park while everyone else slept. Including my husband. I was the one doing the baths, bedtimes etc too. It takes the good out of the holiday a little as he could have even let me lie on a bit one of the days until the kids were up but he didn’t want to as he was “on holiday”.

I had this initially, but I think some of it was of my own making. Now that DC are older and I'm disabled, DH has shown himself more than capable of taking on the extra work. He's taken DC on holidays without me, does all the taxiing to and from activities, checks homework etc and does at least 50% of the housework. I think when DC were younger and I was more capable, I "decided" things would be done my way and DH was kinda pushed aside. The only area DH doesn't pull his weight yet is in relation to the mental load, but I guess that's partly my fault too.

It's not your fault @MaybeIamJealous.

When I go on trips with female friends it's so relaxing. They organise stuff without being asked!

I was divorced with tween dc when I met my now dh. First marriage was awful and I was solely the carer for my dc. Exh did nothing at all.

So when dh mentioned having a child with me I initially refused. But we come to a compromise. I did want his baby but I was not going to be sacrificing my career and burning myself out this time around. I went back to work when baby was six months and dh became a sahd. And the attitudes and comments we had from people were appalling. His friends thought I was a controlling witch, his family felt so sorry for him because raising a child is so exhausting!. Like i didn't know lol. When I got in from work everything was 50/50 and it worked very well for us. When dc went off to school dh went back to work but he got broody again lol. So he did the same again but also I supported him to retrain in a new career. He wanted that quality time with his dc. His old career was too longer hours and travelling. He was a very present father.

And the relationship he now has with his dc is lovely to see. They go to him for help/advice just as much as me. They are close. They value his opinion. There's a lovely respect there.

It's a shame that people's attitudes to dads hasn't really changed and so little is expected from them. But I think we have to just be firm when we have dc and insist on them pulling their weight.

Wasn’t there someone on MN who said “I’ll relax a lot more when you relax a lot less” to their husband while on holiday?

But I think a lot of women prefer that. I can count the number of families I know where the man is the primary carer on half a hand.

Do they or is it the case they know that the father will resort to what is easiest for them (making them the “fun dad” who lets them do whatever they want as long as they don’t bother him) than what is better for the children and/or that the fathers will have family members stepping in, typically a female family member, often being their own mum or sister to take over?

I noticed the opposite when I was in Tenerife at NY, the dads were very involved. However, thinking about it, they weren't English, maybe that makes a difference although it shouldn't.

DH used to do 4 long days at work when our DDs were little and had a day off mid week. Used to take them to toddler groups etc and everyone used to say how amazing he was! 🙄

I do remember one flight though when they were about 3 years old ... we boarded late and there was a single seat at the front and 3 further back. He leapt into that seat faster than I'd ever seen him move .... headphones on, book out, whilst I was wrangling two tots. I wasn't happy. He didn't even offer to swop half way.

What happened on your holiday in terms of childcare Op? Or did you take your GC alone?

@Misaster I took them with my DH. We both mucked in, though the GC are old enough to wash and dress themselves and choose their food. Either one of us would be in the pool with them or we both would but I lay around a lot, read two books, dozed and people watched, obviously 😊. Mornings I sorted the the pool bag and DH took the stuff to the pool. Evenings I got the GC sorted while DH got dressed and then they went for 'cocktails' while I got ready and joined them.

If one of us wanted an early night the other stayed out but it wasn't the same adult each time, it was a brief discussion.

I don't disagree with you OP. I am definitely the default parent at home because he's out most of the time. But on holiday we split everything 50/50. Never discussed it, just did it. We're both there so we both parent and we both get a break. I'll sit and read while he goes in pool with kids, I'll play a game with them while he works out, he'll cook dinner and I'll do bedtime. I wouldn't stand for anything less - we both deserve a break.

I often wonder how many dads are dads because they wanted it and how many just went along with it as it was what the woman wanted. I know its negative thinking but I do wonder about it sometimes.

What’s the dynamic like between their parents

Oh this was half term! What made you start the thread today out of interest?

@Misaster Not sure what is behind your questioning but if you read my opening post I have just returned from a holiday at half term. Our schools were off last week and returned today hence the reason for starting the thread.

That’s such a shame as I know how difficult it is. My husband and I both work in very male dominated roles, engineering/construction, and it’s tough taking time away. It’s still unusual and I’m so proud of him for taking a stance on it and allowing us to both have time with our baby and progress our careers equally. Things are changing and I have seen more men doing this, hopefully it will soon be the norm and not an exception.

Yes

what made you start the thread today over a week later? Just being nosy!

Lots of women make poor choices when they marry.

I simply don’t understand this. Why are you allowing him to be a lazy arse? You’re enabling him and then resenting him and I see this with friends and their useless husbands too.

The gift of martyrdom
That is what people like this get out of it

@Misaster it's not a week later? It's the end of the week so it's my observations over half term, how could I start a thread a week ago when I hadn't witnessed any of this?

Schools have been back a week

What I find really quite interesting is - the comments that say "ahh a man being lazy (and somehow in the same breath subtle or otherwise) implying it's because of the women in their life allowing it"

Technically speaking you were allowed to rape your wife, beat her with a stick looking back a few decades and some men chose not to do that and it wasn't the women in their life's that influenced that either way . It was the man and the choices he made or didn't make.

If a man's lazy in a relationship or parenthood it's because as a society the blame doesn't fall squarely on his shoulders but the women in his life too.

We really need to stop blaming women for the failings of men if we want anything to change..

Varies depending on where you are