Woman 19 dies in dog attack

[Matrixremooted]

Woman 19 dies in dog attack in Bristol

Apologies if there’s already a thread on this, but how many more lives have to be taken in these horrific attacks before the Government admit that the current measures are failing. It surely has come to the point now that all XL Bullies should be euthanised.

I do not think as many people love dogs as you might think.

Increased dog ownership to the point that 1 in 3 of us own one would suggest you are wrong.

Once you account for those unable to own a dog for whatever reason, I’m confident more people like dogs than don’t.

Una Stubbs liked them.

Given how many dogs are in the UK, I think you are outnumbered.

Yep. If banning dog ownership ever went to referendum, I doubt it’d would be a close run thing

People said that about Brexit.

The point I was trying to make is that it wouldn’t be like brexit 🙄

Brexit went to referendum. Banning all dogs never will, so dream on.

they could be used for breeding the next generation of useful dogs

Oh my word.
I have to assume now that you have no understanding of genetics, or that you are winding people up for the LOLs.

You don't breed your second-rate animals - the ones who lacked the physical hardiness for the job, or who didn't have the drive, or hadn't the biddability to respond quickly to the training, didn't have the brains or the nose or whatever, or hadn't got the confidence. You breed the ones who are proven to be the most capable. This obviously depends on the training, but most people training a working prospect have at least some idea what they're doing (and the big organisations have all sorts of protocols in place). Some just won't pan out (maybe 25%), but the majority of well-bred animals will. Breed the second-raters, and you'll be looking at a 25% success rate...

This is why, when I go looking for my next puppy, I'll be looking for lines with field trial and working test winners scattered through them, and will want both parent dogs to be, at the least, proven workers. Because no amount of training will turn a rubbish dog into a good worker.

Think of cows. If you want to increase your milk yield, you'll keep the offspring of the higher-yielding cows and breed them (and you'll also keep an eye on their overall health and soundness too). Same with crops.

Or did you not do the agricultural revolution at school?

Are you suggesting that all eg. guide dogs are bred from working guide dogs as that is just not true

Well, no: I would imagine that guide dog organisation hold back some good dogs as breeding stock, or select dogs from outside their own kennels who show the desired traits.

People who work their dogs preferentially breed from, and seek puppies from, dogs who are proven in the job (capable, sound, healthy etc).

But do you understand genetics at all?

Edited to add, quote from Guide Dogs website:
https://www.guidedogs.org.uk/about-us/guide-dogs-centres/what-the-national-centre-does/#
'Crucial to the success of any breeding programme is the quality of the dogs brought in to replace any guide dog mums and dads that have retired, or are withdrawn, from the breeding programme. It's Guide Dogs' aim to make sure the selection process is rigorous and comprehensive, so that only the very best dogs are added to the programme, in terms of their health, behavioural and genetic merit. We have dedicated staff whose role it is to supervise this process throughout each stage of assessment.' (My bold).

Don't feed them. It's like arguing with a 2 year old, stay well away.

Yeah, I got to that point!

@EdithStourton

"But do you understand genetics at all"

Can i ask why you're speaking to me as if I'm 7 years old?
What part of my posts would say I have no idea of the agricultural revolution or of genetics?
Just peeves me how horribly rude people on here are .

I haven't advocated banning all dogs anyway.
My solution would be to have a number of allowed breeds and that's it.
All dogs bought from registered breeders of the allowed type,
No cross bredds so no confusion on what sort of dog it is etc.
All dogs registered/ licensed

As you are aware, this would very quickly mean a coefficient of inbreeding that would be quickly unsustainable and cause huge problems to the species.

You are advocating for a monopoly of dog breeding. Ridiculous suggestion.

Sucked back in...

I asked if you knew anything about genetics because you were writing as if you had no idea at all about heredity or inbreeding.

When I did the agricultural revolution at school we taught about animals being selected to be bred on the basis of their attributes - which implied that the second-rate animals (the low-yielding milk cows, the undersized plough horses) were not bred.

And again - and I am being polite here - your suggestions don't seem to reflect an understanding of genetics.

My solution would be to have a number of allowed breeds and that's it.
All dogs bought from registered breeders of the allowed type,
No cross bredds so no confusion on what sort of dog it is etc.

You've made it plain that you want only 'useful dogs' to be allowed, and it has been pointed out that, never mind the rights of people who enjoy owning pet dogs, there needs to be a population of pet and sport dogs to underpin the working dog population (to absorb the ones who aren't suited to work, to provide advances in training, to keep a wide gene pool, to preserve traits not currently wanted in the working population but which might one day be useful etc etc).

As for never allowing cross-breeding... if the world's various kennel clubs don't wake up to the dangers of shrinking gene pools, they are going to back a lot of breeds into a corner, which might please you as breeds would go extinct. If you constantly breed within a closed gene pool, deleterious alleles have a nasty habit of becoming more concentrated within the population. These are usually recessive
(because the dominant ones make the animal sick so are usually more obvious and can be bred away from) and by the time the realisation dawns that a new disease is popping up, a large proportion of the breed can already be carrying the problem allele. However, various KCs do seem to be waking up and there are various sanctioned outcross projects popping up around the world.

I agree about inbreeding to use a crude term but also like your suggestion it may lead to extinction of many breeds.
Never thought of it as being an advantage before!

Yeah, advantage unless the recessive trait happens to be aggression-focussed and you make generations of dangerous dogs.

Or if the trait involves a painful disability or susceptibility to disease.

I know you hate dogs, but do you really want litters of puppies born deformed, or family pets succumbing to painful deaths?

Genuinely don’t understand how people can hate animals so much because some shitty human doesn’t clear up dog poo or they have some entirely misguided understanding of hygiene.