Kids noise vs neighbours: AIBU to think that there is so much you can do when you have young children?

[karpouzi]

We have three kids, all under the age of four, and live in a period maisonette spread over the first and loft floor. Currently, our entire family sleeps in the loft. The eldest two share a bedroom, while the baby is still in our room. On the first floor, we have the kitchen and living area, as well as a double room, which is currently set up as a playroom. We’ve always had a strict rule that our kids are not allowed on the first floor before 8 a.m., unless they’re having breakfast in the kitchen.
However, our downstairs neighbor has been repeatedly complaining about the noise, especially on weekends, saying that it’s disturbing her sleep. She sends us long messages almost every week. We’ve explained that we have a double rug in the playroom, and that the kids are not allowed in that room before 8 a.m., even though they wake up around 6:30 a.m. We also arrange swimming lessons to be at 9am in the weekend so the kids are out of the house. Unfortunately, this is all we can do to minimize the noise. Now, we face a new challenge: the baby will soon need his own room. Our plan is to move him into the boys' room in the loft, which is fairly small. We also plan to get new beds for the eldest two and convert the playroom into a bedroom where the boys will also have space for their toys. The boys typically wake up between 6:30 and 7 a.m., and with this new setup, they will need to stay in their bedroom in the mornings. I’m really concerned that the complaints from our neighbor will escalate. What do other people do in situations like this? I feel I m getting fed and I will start ignoring her messages.

Note: When we renovated our kitchen we did add floor noise insulation but we don’t have the money to do any further renovations at this stage.

Move yourself into the playroom, the boys into your loft room, and the baby into the boys room. That way it's you in the downstairs room and you presumably are capable of treading softly not to disturb the neighbour.

I think the main thing you need to do is be stricter with your children over their noise. You can't necessarily stop the baby crying but the older ones should face punishment for disturbing the neighbour. Every time there is a complaint they should face consequences for their actions.

With 3 kids under 4 in a small space, noise is basically an inevitability but be realistic, OP, would you be thrilled to live in a house with 3 kids under 4 upstairs? No, you probably wouldn't. So I can see the neighbour's point of view, too. Intrusive noise is incredibly stressful.

I agree with the above poster about trying to maximise distance between neighbour and children. I don't agree with punishing the kids every time there's a complaint, but you and DH will need to closely monitor them to ensure they're not running, throwing toys, engaging in loud play etc.

You say you have a rug,is that on hard floors or carpeted? It would be awful if you have no carpet even without children.

I can see it from both points of view. I agree with maybe moving yourselves down to the playroom. Or make it a rule that the kids come up to your room to play quietly before 8am if you do move them down there.

Could you ask the neighbour what they can hear specifically? Is it voices, stamping around on the floor? What is it? That way you can try and target it.

You are never ever going to eliminate every noise 3 kids under 4 make, but I think you should continue to try and mitigate as much as possible.

Move the playroom into a loft bedroom

As much as you may not want to you need to move yourselves down stairs not the boys .

I agree that you need to discuss with the neighbour, and possibly have one of you be downstairs in theirs, one of you upstairs, to work out specifically what is making the noise. Is it shouting? Doors closing/slamming? Footsteps? Then you can work out the solution.

They will also feel more heard, which is half the battle.

I remember the day our upstairs neighbour swapped their carpets for hard floors. All of a sudden we knew exactly how many steps they were taking from living room to kitchen. And breakfast can be quite noisy too - cupboard doors and drawers closing, spoons clanking, chairs scraping.

What time are they bugging her and what noises does she complain of - before 8am getting breakfast or after 8am running around? You are not going to be able to mitigate everything but I think if you have hard floors (even with a rug) and let them in the kitchen at 6.30 she might have a point. Specific mitigations will depend on what she complains of exactly. It's about showing willing and best endeavours rather than completely eliminating the noise.

PP suggestion to move downstairs yourself is a good one.

I would ask your neighbour to record the noise so you can work out how bad it actually is. If it's just the normal sounds of living below a large family, I'd then ask them to stop complaining to you or you'll bring a harassment complaint and complain to the council instead, as you are entitled to live in your home. If it's really bad, you may need to look at carpet/other solutions.

Put carpet down, give it a couple of years and they will quieten drastically.

Tell your neighbour to wear ear plugs, you are already taking reasonable steps to mitigate noise. Ignore her, she can't do anything about it anyway.

I would discuss with her what exactly she can hear and at what times of day, face to face.

If she’s complaining about movement or voices after 6.30am, I’d tell her to do one. She has chosen to live in a flat with people above her, she’s going to get noise and if she lives alone and in relative silence that will be magnified! Not your fault at all.

She could have a childless couple hosting lots of social events late into the night living above her.

You have already massively gone out of you way to keep noise levels down, if what she’s complaining about sounds unreasonable, you need to be quite forthright and tell her if you keep receiving these letters, you’ll report her for harassment.

You need to be able to live as a family without walking on eggshells.

They should face punishment every time OP gets a complaint?!

You and your kids are entitled to live normally in your home. Period conversions are notorious for poor soundproofing and the neighbour sounds throughly unreasonable to expect not to hear noise. You sound like really considerate neighbours who have gone above and beyond what most people would do with your rules about not going downstairs until 8am and arranging the swimming lessons with her in mind! She could have sharers or a young couple above hosting a lot of late night gatherings and playing loud music. Moving yourselves into the playroom and having the kids upstairs is a good idea. Beyond that I would honestly stop trying to appease her because I get the sense she’ll never be happy so long as she’s living in a mid floor flat. So get on, enjoy your home and let the kids play normally.

Like what? How do you suggest teaching small kids not to make small kid noise?

And how do you suggest punishing under-4s? That in itself is often a noisy undertaking as they often tantrum and scream at even the mildest consequence.

Tell her she needs to move ... it sounds like you've been more than reasonable trying to sort this out. Your kids should be able to make normal kid noise in their own home. As long as they aren't charging about and screaming.

It's tough luck, your neighbour shouldn't live in a place like that if she is so noise sensitive.

We live in a very old converted house and we're conscious of the noise we make. DS isn't allowed to run or jump around (although we're less strict in the middle of the day) and we all talk quietly in the mornings, TV turned down, etc. He's grown up understanding and being reminded that people live downstairs and it seems to work, as the neighbours have said we're the quietest family that has lived there in many years.

This.

I’ve lived in one of these places. Most of us were reasonable about it - we accepted the way the buildings were meant we would hear each other sometimes.

There would be some that moved in, complained about everything and moved out again. It just wasn’t the right building for the silent life they wanted, but they thought everyone should tiptoe around all day everyday for them.

I don't really understand people who move into ground floor flats of converted houses and expect to hear no noise.
Unless your kids are being really loud and excessive, I don't think that you should have to tiptoe around your own home in fear of upsetting the neighbours.
It sounds like you've really done as much as you can but some people will never be satisfied and are not suited to living in flats like this. Imagine they lived below shift workers who were cooking themselves a meal in the middle of the night.

It wouldn’t be possible for us to go to that room as it will only fit bunk bed or trundle bed in that room so it has to be the kids room.

You can sleep in a bunk bed ?

When she moved in, she was aware we have 3 kids so it came as no surprise. No, there are no excessively loud but it’s an old house. Kids are in school nursery 8-6:30 Monday to Friday. So home only weekends.

It is not possible unfortunately for us to get the room as it only fits bunk bed or trundle bed. The kids are in school/nursery 8am-6:30pm and only home in the weekends.

The thing is that she knew when she bought the place that we have 3 kids under 4 so it came as no surprise. The kids are not excessively loud but it’s a very old house so noise travels through like crazy.

Get carpet in addition to the rug if you haven't already, otherwise there's not much you can do. It's very considerate for you to not use the whole house until 8am already. I would just copy and paste the same reply each time - I'm sorry that the house doesn't have good soundproofing, we're doing everything we can by keeping the children upstairs until 8am and encouraging them to play quietly.