Party, child with visible difference

[donttake]

Was 8 year olds birthday party on Saturday,
Some school friends, some out of school friends and some family were invited. First time doing a mixed party like that and the different groups kind of kept together so Dd was a bit pulled around but otherwise everything went great .

One of DD’s cousins who was at the party has a significant facial difference, purely physical and had no effect of their behaviour or abilities. I’ve had a message from a school friends mother saying thank-you for the party, dc had a great time etc but that she would have appreciated a heads up about dd’s cousin. That her dc were scared and upset and she doesn’t know how to deal with it so could I give advice.

I’m not being being unreasonable to think that’s outrageous, am I?

I have no idea what to reply

I would act confused. "Sorry, I don't understand. Are you asking me for advice on how to let your children know that people have different bodies? I'd have hoped you'd taught them that by now!"

Short and sweet.

I totally agree that berating would be utterly wrong. Was that what happened? Or is this about adults feeling awkward because this is a difficult subject?

I also think that parenting is often about having specific chats. We don’t say: inappropriate touch is wrong. We teach the underwear rule. We don’t say: take care when out. We teach how to cross the road. We don’t say: diversity is our strength. We teach about Diwali (etc). We don’t say: use the toilet. We teach what and how. We don’t say: embrace difference. We teach about specifics. So I don’t think having a talk about facial disfigurement is as silly as you are trying to make it sound.

Not really. The chat wouldn’t go like: I must warn you about Billy’s existence. Not unless you’ve already decided this other parent is awful.

As for whether the child will feel more shit being avoided at parties, or learning when they are older that their parents had had chats, that feels a bit speculative. They both feel potentially hurtful but only one has a young child as the hurtee.

As I’m saying, I’m not pushing back at people saying Not Unreasonable. But the extreme condemnation in many answers seems like a privileging of adult comfort over child experience. That’s not the parenting deal.

I've had conversations with my DC about disability ,(whether visible or hidden,) from a very young age. It's always been an open conversation owing to the people with disabilities in our social group. Children's books and TV programmes deal with disability. The paralympics is a prominent sporting event.
It is not the op's responsibility to help the other mother handle this. It should be within one's skillset as a parent to teach a child about disability so that they are prepared , accepting and aware of the broad experiences of people as a general rule. I've never had to tell my child in advance that they are about to meet 'a disabled person.' They just meet [insert name] and that's that.
My DC may ask questions after the meeting, interested in the circunstaces; but they soon loose interest in 'the disability,' especially if you as the parent focus primarily on the person, not the disability.
A final note - the details of another person's disability is none of our business.
We have no right to know what their condition's called, how long they've had it, or how it happened.
It's very easy to not know one detail of a person's disability and just interact with them as a person.
It's also very easy to teach your child the same.
And if you are curious about a disability , educate yourself. Disabled people and their families do not have an obligation to teach you.

I don't know how any child can get to eight years old without their parent needing to have that chat with them.

My DC was only three when she asked me very loudly 'why that man was walking funny'. The man who appeared to have CP just gave me a big grin and left me to have the chat 😂

I thought most kids had done that and had the conversation well before starting school.

@RejoiceandSing

I do occasionally get comments on my social interactions, stims, atypical behaviours etc, and I would much, much, rather that than have a friend warn someone about my condition ever again. It feels dehumanising.

I think that’s a relevant parallel. I think it’s different though in that you are an adult (so a. more likely to be able to handle any questions or adverse reaction yourself, and b. most other adults you talk to won’t be scared of you).

My main thrust is that adult norms don’t read across well to young children, because their knowledge base and reactions and norms aren’t the same.

Even if we take the parallel though, I presume you saw your friend as clumsy and perhaps hurtful, not as abhorrent.

Well, yes. Short and sweet.

And how would you feel to get a text like that the next time your 8 yr old behaves in a way that’s inappropriate for an adult?

“I’d have hoped you’d have taught them that by now!” Yeah, don’t we all. That’s parenting.

How old are the children? I do think this is relevant. With my charitable hat on, I wonder whether she meant she’d have liked to know, so that even if she’s talked to them about differences before, she could mention it to her dcs, and make sure they know not to stare or say anything upsetting.

I'd reply with the classic mumsnet line, "give your head a wobble"

Imagine thinking it's ok to send a message like that!

this is really upsetting to read what a vile woman

I don’t think she is worthy of an answer

Because it’s awkward for adults?

You have misunderstood.

The mother who sent the message said her daughter was scared. However the OP who was actually at the party saw no sign of her being scared at all.

There is no suggestion that the child with the facial difference was scared.

My child with a visible difference (not facial) dealt with intrusive questions and idiotic comments from adults all the time, Never from children.

The OP is not the mother of the child, she is the aunt and the party host. If my child had been invited to a party and the host had sent a ‘heads up’ to other guests I would have felt that my child was being othered and patronised. Both myself and my child (by the age of 8) were very well able to deal with both the intrusive and idiotic, and the innocent reactions.

Yes, I saw it as misguided; I think the stronger reactions are probably because this is about a child with whom the mum does not have an existing relationship, which is different again.
I also agree that it's not helpful to demonise people who say shitty ableist things, because they won't learn. However, it is not the responsibility of random disabled children and their parents to always react with grace and educate, there's plenty of books and resources online nowadays. And it's also important to be able to react strongly when shitty ableist things are said. I don't think the person saying them is evil, because I fundamentally don't believe any person is evil, but that doesn't mean what they said isn't awful and shocking, and disabled people and our families can react as such.
I do see your point about adult norms not extending to young children, however I would argue that 8 is old enough to have learned 'don't comment on other people's bodies' and 'sometimes people look different from us, and that's ok' so that they aren't scared at a party. I think it could actually be counterproductive to set up certain people as someone that we have to have a chat about in advance. Also, OP says the woman's kids didn't actually seem to be scared or upset at the party, suggesting that at most they just asked their mum something about it that she felt unequipped to answer.

@RejoiceandSing I agree with a lot of what you are saying, though I think the reading of the parent’s comment as a shitty ableist comment is only one possible reading, and not the most natural one.

Of course it’s possible that this was a very minor issue for the children and it’s the parent who has made this a thing. I think that’s wrong too.

I don’t have personal experience of being visibly different, though I do within close family. The approach I grew up with was closer to the having-chats one. I think both approaches/frameworks are reasonable, and it’s not really my position to have a strong view on which is best. It’s the extremes of the condemnation for this parent who was, as far as we can tell, wanting to avoid a bad situation for the child/ren that I’m having a problem with, I guess. The condemners (I’m not counting you in this really) I’m sure think they’ve done their parenting perfectly and this couldn’t have happened to them. But I think the more likely outcome of that kind of mindset is one where disability/difference just gets avoided, because at the end of the day who needs to be called vile, snarked at, cut off, etc. Or it gets discussed in the abstract and in story books but never in the particular. That doesn’t feel like a step forward.

How pathetic...how is she going to prepare her children for life experiences?

Yes, something like this - plus recognition that SHE DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO DEAL WITH IT 🤨🤨🙄😲🤬 by way of patronising advice and a link to a book.

The utter twat.

She doesn’t need to know specifics to explain we are all different but included.

Why would you humiliate a disabled person, or their family by essentially putting a trigger warning on a party or any other social invitation ? Their disability isn’t a prompt for anyone to ‘explore the issue’ with their own kids. Parents should be teaching their kids about disability and inclusivity anyway, at a level they can understand.

What ?????

But she didn’t have to involve OP at all. She wasn’t equipped to explain disability or inclusivity to her own children. That’s on her, not OP.

This makes me furious!!! Did you SEE anyone shocked and upset at the time? I suspect not.... It's probably just HER being nosey and wanting to know the reason he has this. Some people are actually like this. I'm not even sure what I'd say to her though, as everything I think of is angry and rude. Maybe blank her, and don't invite her kids ever again. Is she likely to approach you personally with this? It's just appalling.

The Mum clearly needs to educate herself as she is the 'mature' adult here. She isn't 'vile' I'd say more ignorant and stupid. The need for her to text you was very very rude, it did not require a mention. I don't think it's unreasonable though for young children to observe and comment on differences however, that's where and how we educate the young (and old too!) on those differences.

Personally the Mum (though not vile) would not be someone whose company I would not want to keep. I hope she does not pass her behaviour or attitudes down to her children. Now that would be 'vile'.

Why are you trying to intellectualise perfectly simple, basic facts ? It is not the responsibility of disabled people to educate others about disability. It is not for others to use any disabled individual as an example for a teaching moment. It is part of parenting to equip your child for life - and that includes explaining disability and diversity at a level that’s age appropriate and easy for the child to understand.

There is plenty of literature out there to help as well as references from childrens’ TV that can be used to educate, without dehumanising a disabled child and disregarding their, and in this case their family’s, feelings in the way this woman did. That’s the reason for the almost universal condemnation here.

It’s absolutely fine for them to have questions. What’s not fine is for their mother to be so unequipped a a parent that she felt justified in sending that text message and essentially blaming OP for the fact that she now has to answer those questions.

The text as described in the OP did berate, yes. Not berating would have been not messaging at all and dealing with her herself like an adult and a parent.

”We don’t say: inappropriate touch is wrong. We teach the underwear rule. We don’t say: take care when out. We teach how to cross the road.”

what?? I am not a parent so forgive me but do parents really not teach in general terms like “take care when out” and “inappropriate touch is wrong”? Really???

At this point I can only assume you are wilfully obtuse or incredibly goady- either way, going to bat for the woman scared by a child with a facial difference isn’t really a good look.