She wants the gifted money back

[HereForItMaybe]

I'll keep it short - DM very kindly gifted myself and my brother £50k each, 5 years ago.

She has now asked for it back. My brother has not been asked.

AIBU to say no?

I can see how that would happen. In my city if you moved from a four bed in one not so nice area to a three bed or a bungalow in another nicer part there would be a gap of £££ between the value of the two.

You need to keep saying no! It's not fair at all.

Please Please Please Do not offer your Mother your Gifted money back today, I'm uneasy you feel " it's morally right" to see she has what she needs
NO Your morals are intact. Your DM has NONEi
Do not make yourself homeless just to appease her
It's legally documented the 50k was a gift so you can't give it back anyway, but the mere fact she has asked you for it is despicable, assuming she has capacity.

There is absolutely no way you can put your precious home in any risk just so your mum, who is in a fine position and has her own money, can get an upgrade. It is morally wrong of her to ask this. Keep saying it to yourself, like a mantra.

We've been able to give my adult kids a lump sum each when we moved to a smaller property, and are very clear that gifts are not loans and do not come with strings. If you were to sell your house, would you buy a smaller house? Have you calculated how much moving house would cost? Solicitors' fees, EA's fees, removal fees, stamp duty etc? You'd be significantly more that £50k down.

I would be telling your mother you will always be grateful for the gift but you are not in a position to reciprocate and give her £50k of the value of your home.

Imagine if a friend of yours came to you and said "My mother wants me to sell my home to give her money."
Would you think that was a good idea, from your friend's perspective?

Does your mother realise for you to give her £50,000 you'd have to sell your home?

That is insane. There no emergency, there's no pull on the brother. She thinks she can bully you and you'll bow down to her.

Why do you even think it's morally right to give back a gift to someone who doesn't actually need it, whilst you end up without your lovely home and your brother isn't asked?

She can’t possibly say she didn’t have capacity when the gift was given. It was a legal process to declare the money a gift, both to comply with money laundering laws and to satisfy the mortgage provider that no-one but the mortgagee has a financial interest in the property. The solicitor who drew up the paperwork would have had to satisfy themselves that the gift giver was of sound mind and not being coerced in any way, and DM would have signed a declaration to that effect. Legally, not a leg to stand on, so she’ll try to guilt OP into returning it.

This is what happens when a person who's selfish wants something from a person who's too nice.

The fear! The guilt! The obligation! The hand-wringing stomach aches of anxiety, the self-doubt (I am familiar with all this).

OP the answer is no.

It's not even no, it's HELL NO.

Ask your mother how she’s getting her gift back from your brother. If she says well he spent it all say that you spent it all as well. You did so because you spent it on your house. If she continues say ok I’ll give you back your gift back but I’ll need to sell the house and this will take time. I’ll inform the tax office so you can pay your taxes correctly. I’d actually say to inform the tax office right now so that they can check her out. Is she claiming any benefits? Report her to the benefits office so that they can check. Let all friends and family know that you’re forced to sell up whilst your brother is left alone. Obviously you’ll be NC after this.

I do worry you're going to be severely guilty tripped now OP 😔

Apologies if I've missed this in the thread but have ou actually said, Mum, do you really expect me to sell my house to raise the money and if i do, where do you propose that i Live? I can't quite believe that anyone, let alone a mother, would think that it's an acceptable request.

Why would you jump straight to thinking she’s a benefit cheat ? She made gifts to the tune of £100k which would have attracted taxes on payment. DWP and HMRC share information.

I'm so sorry you are in this situation. Do you still have the legal paperwork she signed declaring she had no claim on the house? Because in effect that is what she is doing now, trying to claim on your house!

Good luck today!

Good point. Hopefully OP will still have it, but if not, it will be on record with the mortgage provider.

It’s not really about the legality of this though, is it? There is no legal leg to stand on and they both know it so I wouldn’t even go that route. This is all about how her mother is treating her. The only excuse I can think of is if her mother is thinking she still has the cash in a bank account and does not realise it’s gone into the house. However based on what OP has said, this isn’t really the case. The one morally wrong is her mum.

@HereForItMaybe Is your brother a homeowner, or does he rent?

If he owns his own home then he still has the money as much as you do. It doesn't matter whether he put the £50K towards his house purchase or not (e.g. if he already owned his house when he received the money). He can still sell his house to pay her back. If that's the case, why isn't she asking him to do that?

If he isn't a homeowner and frittered his £50K away whilst still renting, I'd ask your mother why you think it's fair to punish you for having used your £50K wisely, to buy a house, whilst your brother who wasted his isn't being asked to pay anything back.

It seems to me that right now, everyone has a roof over their heads. Your mother doesn't actually need to move. How is it fair to expect you to give up the roof over your head just so she can live under a different one?

Either way, hold firm. The answer is no. A gift is a gift. You're not selling your house in order to give your mother £50K. You're not selling your car, you're not taking out a loan. The answer is no. Your mother can still downsize if she wants to; she'll just have to choose a less expensive postcode to downsize to.

And tell your aunt to piss off. If she feels that strongly she can give your mother £50K herself. But your finances are absolutely none of her business and she needs to butt out.

OP I really hope you read this thread before you go and meet with your mother. Some really useful replies for you here.

Please remember something (and I realise this is both harsh and hard but also true) that the two of you cannot possibly have a good relationship. I say this because nobody would do this to someone they were in a good relationship with. How can she stand there and ask for this back on such a whim without any regard to how it would affect you? I mean I can't imagine being that person in any situation but even so.....and your aunt? What has to got to do with her? Has your mum suddenly declined mentally and isn't understanding now what happened to the money? Because if it's NOT through mental decline (this behaviour) then it's intentional and that is a horrid thing to do to her own daughter.

As people have said this is illegal and more importantly immoral. From a mother to her daughter purely over the fact that she has decided she would now like the money with seemingly no regard what happens to you.

I fear you are being walked over due to your seemingly empathetic nature. This is all so very very wrong. Please protect yourself and I agree to leave if your aunt is present. There doesn't have to be drama or shouting. Just leave.

She is trampling over you to get what she wants and it's actually really bloody awful.

OP you said that after your mum decided to give both of you this money that your brother took her personally to the bank the next day to get his share. That was a red flag to me instantly. You also said that due to the property situation that you got yours 5 MONTHS later. If I had promised my kids money one would not be getting the money 5 months after the other one. They would both get their money within hours. There is a pattern here and you will come to realise that eventually. Now is the time to stop resentment years down the line. I honestly believe its all because he is male. Dont go to the meeting today. Find that document and then send her a copy. No discussion it was a gift 5 years ago, all legal and that’s the end of it. A gift that you had to wait months for but your brother got immediately. The clues are all there OP. Your mum knows what she doing, if you give this money back the resentment towards both your brother and mother will eat you up. I tell you this there is no way on earth I would make these differences between my kids. No, that’s all you need to say. No idea if your brother has got back to you but he’s not the boss either so I would ignore him. He is looking after himself, you do the same. Did he ask mum when you were you getting your share, when he got his the next day? Any problems from him and he joins the mum camp in my mind. Please don’t continue on this dutiful daughter mindset. You are an adult, she is being ridiculous and you know it. You have been well taught with all this guilt. Everyone here can’t be wrong now can they?

I don't think there is anything strange about the language. Nobody buys a home. They buy a house which then becomes a home.

This. And also…could your brother be the one pressuring your mum to get the money back from you?

Did your brother return your call OP?

I sincerely hope you are taking someone with you to meet your mother, because it increasingly sounds like you'll be too easily brow-beaten on your own!

Is there a DP in all this, if so, what do they they think?

I split my small inheritance with my 3 DDs. No way would I ask for it back. As it is one of my DDs still has it in savings and i could probably do with half of it back but no way would I ask. A gift is a gift and it's not fair anyway to ask you and not your brother. She's making choices about where to live based on preference not necessity.

"I asked if she was sure and I do remember asking her to think about it for a while before deciding, but it was only a week or so later that she said my brother had his lump sum deposited in his account. I think he went to the bank with her to transfer it in person."

Your Brother walked her straight to the bank.
You asked her if she was sure, and she had a week or so to consider....
Please do not suggest selling your house.
Say she signed legal documents saying it was a gift, it all went into your house, that you WON'T be selling.