An update to all who responded to my thread about dropping out of uni...

[yakamoza]

Firstly, I'd like to thank everyone who has given me advice on my thread about my son wanting to drop out of uni. And, of course, I am here again to give an update on that and ask for more advice on how to cope with what's happened since my last post.

Since my son wasn't responding to our texts or calls, we decided to reach out to his gf and she told us he's not been going to lectures at all and generally had no motivation to do anything. She told us that even when she suggests doing various things at the weekend, he isn't that enthusiastic about it and doesn't want to do anything. She then told us that they decided to split and therefore wouldn't be seeing as much of each other as before.

After we spoke to his gf, I was extremely concerned by what she told us as this was a completely misaligned with what he had been telling us before Christmas. He himself wasn't responding to my requests for calls or my texts, so last week my husband and I decided to drive up to his uni accommodation to see him. You probably will not believe it but a) his gf was in his room with him and b) out of embarrassment or something else, he refused to open the door and speak to us!

I had to call my sister and ask her husband to speak to him since my son always had a good relationship with him. In the end, he informed even him that he decided to quit uni and focus on YouTube. My BIL told him it wasn't acceptable to keep ignoring your parents and refuse to open the door and see them after they drove to see you for 2 hours and suggested that he calls and apologises. He did call in the end but rather than apologise told us that it was always our idea for him to go to uni rather than his and he doesn't want to pursue that anymore. At that point, my husband informed him that we would respect his decision but also would have to stop funding both his accommodation and living expenses and he'd have to work something out himself. He said fine and that's how that conversation ended.

I don't really know what I am here to ask or what I expect to hear. I know that we have likely gone badly wrong somewhere and failed as parents but I am still so heartbroken and sad about the level of deceipt that we have uncovered as my son was telling us throughout October, November, December and even January that he really understood how important it was for him to study and how he was spending all his time in the library. He asked us to help him buy a new laptop in November as his old one wasn't working well. We did buy one as we really thought he needed it to study.

I am now just completely shocked that he has essentially been lying to us for months and pretty much doing nothing while we have been funding his accommodation and living expenses and he has been incurring debt on his tuition fees while doing absolutely nothing as described by his girlfriend. I do realise that he may be suffering from depression and I did tell him that we can get help if he is depressed and that we would always be there for him too. He just ignored all that, and I am still really worried, concerned and at the same time disgusted by all the lies he's been telling us about studying while accepting our money for living expenses and accommodation and essentially wasting it all on nothing. I also discovered he took out the maintenance loan from the Student Loan Company despite the fact that we have been funding his groceries and rent. I have no idea where the money has been going and what he's been spending it on as he doesn't buy clothes, gadgets, go out or does anything else that could explain his expenses.

I know that I shouldn't be making this about how I feel and that I should be working out how I can help him but I just can't stop thinking about his deception and wondering where I went wrong as a parent while also worrying about his future. I also can't stop feeling deceived and disgusted with the whole situation and can't stop blaming myself for doing an abysmal job as a parent as we evidently went very wrong somewhere... I don't really know where and how to find a way forward from this and what to do, so I am hoping to hear some advice from other parents.

He can get a job like other adults his age. YouTube is not a job reality. Being in employment will get him on his feet and active with a schedule. There are jobs that don’t require experience such as factory, construction labour, farm work. This will get him references and a wage.

@minerva7 I'm so sorry about your child's housemate. So tragic and traumatic for all concerned.

I do understand your dilemma, and sympathise with your frustration but reading this,
"When I ask him even general questions ... he has no answers. He doesn't know who would be interested in the type of content he is thinking about etc, etc. Just basically totally clueless about the realities of YT and the number of content creators out there that nobody is interested in."
I can see why he doesn't want to discuss his ideas with you.
He may be clueless, many people are starting out, but this approach isn't working.

If he's really keen on YT and video work, training is the way forward. Some people have successfully self taught, but that is the hardest way to do it. He will probably need collaborators, people to bounce ideas off and is more likely to meet them on some kind of course. If he did a production course he would have all those ideas and advice - be able to make those early mistakes and come out with some kind of show reel and it is possible to find practical courses which are coursework based, which he might enjoy more.

Lots of good idea on this thread, OP. I know that I tend towards cynicism, as I have a close friend who's dealing with her DD (25 this spring) who changed universities twice costing her parents a shedload of money and is now at home doing very little. Meanwhile her parents (mid-50's) are working very hard to pay off debt accrued to finance a degree that she didn't complete (we're in the US where student loans have to be cosigned and repaid regardless of the student's lack of income) , plus they're also supporting her younger sister through uni.

Some young adults do seem oblivious to the effects of their actions, but their parents can't crumble under the stress, because someone's got to work to pay the bills! Your DS may not be like this, but just be careful to support, rather than enable him.

Re the deception and your disgust - his brain is not fully formed yet, and the ability to really, truly understand the consequences of actions is affected by that. Depression or any mental health issues also affect how much we can think forward. Rather than deliberate deception, I would see this as head in the sand behaviour.

That's his issue to sort out, and unfortunately the only way to do that is by him putting in time at the university of hard knocks.

I'd suggest to him in a letter or email that he officially withdraw from his course. He needs to be realistic.

I would not give him any more money after the lease ends. He could come home on condition that he gets a job and pays rent that is more than a token contribution. Again, it's important for him to be realistic.

It seems from your posts that he feels that what he has to say deserves an audience and that he has the talent to develop one. YT is the place to put this idea to the test. As you have observed, though, he does not seem to have the willpower or skills to put his aspirations into action.

I'd say what's going on is that he feels his intellect hasn't been fully appreciated in university so he's basically decided to take his business elsewhere. I suspect he is seriously lacking in a realistic picture of his own strengths and weaknesses, and also lacking in resilience. The dawn of reality will be painful for him if he doesn't have a smart plan or the discipline to carry it through.

YT is a crowded space. His best bet is to pick some niche topic and get very familiar with it - Napoleon era fortifications, stained glass windows, ancient moss-covered churchyards of Herefordshire, sea glass, the world of Gilbert and Sullivan, cleaning flats destroyed by tenants - is this likely to happen? Commentators on social issues are two a penny.

He has a hard road ahead.

If you're planning to withdraw some financial support I would give him a warning rather than do it cold turkey so he has some time to prepare and plan. I worry those advising to stop support by the end of the month won't give him enough time to get a paycheck before rent is due. In the event of possible mental health struggles, those will need to be addressed first rather than have him sink or swim.

@Bigcat25
We have told him that we would stop funding his separate living since he no longer wants to study and reminded him that the rent is paid until the end of the month. We also said that our home will always be his home and we are here if he needs help and support but beyond that will not continue interfering with his plans.

In my email to him, I also told him that if he needs any support with his mental health, then my health insurance from work covers such support (he is a part of my plan) and if required, either we can help arrange that for him or he can do it himself.

Beyond that, I don't really know what to do since he keeps insisting that he doesn't want any interference. I don't really know how to strike a balance between being a supportive parent and at the same time not perpetuating the situation where he doesn't learn to to plan and manage his life in such a way that he starts taking responsibility for both his decisions and the consequences of his decisions. I know that if we continue paying for his accommodation and funding his living expenses, he will simply continue procrastinating as that's what he does with absolutely everything.

Some young adults do seem oblivious to the effects of their actions, but their parents can't crumble under the stress, because someone's got to work to pay the bills! Your DS may not be like this, but just be careful to support, rather than enable him.

@BruFord I fear that he may just be exactly as you describe. He seems to always blame everyone except himself for everything that happens. For example, this year, when he decided not to show up for the exam he felt he wasn't ready for, he tried telling us that he wasn't ready because the lecturers were late with something or other, and while I don't know what they were late with and how late, I know one thing: he has known about the January exam since at least October, so if the lecturer was late with anything, then he had plenty of time to ask questions about that. I assume that other students didn't fail to show up because the same lecturer was late.

Enabling him to continue this sort of attitude to life and responsibility is one of my biggest concerns among many others.

Can you negotiate helping him whilst he is job hunting.

@DuckbilledSplatterPuff In all honesty, as a parent I'd be willing to support him for as long as I possibly can. We are only taking the "tough love" approach in hope that only then can he actually start feeling the urgency of having to do something because at the moment from what I can hear he is just doing nothing as he now has no schedule to follow and no deadlines to meet.

When he called his dad, the conversation did not start with telling him off. It started with an explanation from my husband as to why we decided to turn up at his door. To answer your question, we did decide to turn up uninvited so to speak because I have been asking him to call us or meet with us for weeks. He's been ignoring our calls and texts. I have warned him once that if we continue to receive no response, we'd have to come up to check on him because we are concerned. He replied to that message by saying that if we turn up, he'd simply move away. This is when I started getting really concerned about what was going on. However, I did not turn up that week and continued trying to talk to him via text. Once he responded and said he'd call me in 3 days, which of course he never did. When his gf said they decided to take a break, we started worrying he'd be isolated and alone since he wasn't going to uni to study and frankly since he started living with her, he practically cut off all his friends and had no interactions with anyone except her. It was after our conversation with her when we decided we had no choice but to turn up. This may not have been a perfect decision or the right one but my sister encouraged me to do that too and so that is what we did. My husband started explaining to him why we were concerned and that we just wanted to make sure he was ok. He also explained to him that we didn't expect to find his gf there since she told us they'd be taking a break.

It was only later when they got to the part where he told my husband that he decided not to continue with uni that my husband told him we couldn't then continue funding his living in a different city but our home will always be open to him and we will, of course, help if he needs anything but beyond that he'd have to figure something out. He said he was fine with that and told his dad he intended to do YT till September!

We have spoken to him about changing courses before when he once told us he didn't like his current course. I encouraged him to look into that, identify something he may like to do and investigate what is required to change courses either in his current university or go to another. He never did anything about that.

I've said this several times on MN, but I do think schools need to take some responsibility for this scenario. University is pushed as the goal after sixth form and anything else is deemed a failure. Even if it isn't explicitly worded like that, the inference is.

My DDs went to a normal state school and this was the narrative there, so god knows what it's like at grammar/private schools, even more pressure.

One of mine went to uni, one didn't and she's now mid 20s and successful in her career. It's not the be all and end all, particularly with the fees involved. She definitely felt the odd one out though by not going down the uni route.

Best of luck to your son, bring him home.

If he's only been like this since he moved in with her, do you think that maybe she's coercively controlling him?

@Agapornis procrastination and lack of responsibility haven't started with her. He's always been like that.

It's only the complete break from everyone he kept in touch with before like his scool friends, which started since he started living with her.

I've noticed that he's also sort of become a bit more paranoid if you like. He seems to think everyone is against him. On the day we drove to see him, she told us his flatmates don't like them and he feels more embarrassed for the reason that we turned up and they will all see that now. He never told us that the flatmates don't like them. He only told us that everyone was fine except one couple who seemed a bit odd. He never said he didn't get on with others. So it was a surprise to me to hear that they all disliked them.

Previously, this sort of thing also came up in various conversations when he quite often told him that he thought this, that and the other in the street were giving her funny looks or that someone was racist (she is half black). In fact, this racist business was mentioned again by her in a text she sent us about his flatmates. She said they were racist which, again, he never mentioned to us before. She also seems paranoid about other things. To give an example, he told us that she advised him not to just walk around the street with his grocery shopping as someone might steal it! At the time, I made a joke of it and said I supposed anything is possible with the cost of living crisis but told him I'd never heard of anything like that. It's not clear to me where the racism of flatmates would come from as it seems a pretty multiracial group there: ok, there are no black people but basically pretty much all types of other ethnic groups, i.e. there is someone English, some guy from somewhere in Eastern Europe, Indians, someone Chinese etc. So it's pretty diverse as I would expect is normal in a flat of students from a large uni.

It is a possibility that under her influence he may also be thinking that his parents also have some motives that we don't actually have although I don't really want to blame it all on her.

Is he smoking a lot of weed?

@FrenchandSaunders In his first year, he admitted he was. Now he says he isn't but his gf says he does even though she asked him to stop on many occasions. He insists he isn't but I don't know to be honest. When he did it in first year, I could smell it on his clothes and everywhere. When he came home at Christmas, there were no signs of it. No smell and nothing else.

Oh dear she sounds like a wrongun!! They also sound like they're smoking a lot of ganja. You definitely need to cut him off financially, hopefully then he has no choice but to come back home hopefully without this one!

Sounds like weed paranoia, especially in under 25s. It will be massive affecting brain development.

"his flatmates don't like them"...does she mean they don't like her? I can see why... Racism in a young multi ethnic uni student household seems rather unlikely!

Hopefully they'll break up soonish and he'll be back to normal. Have you tried student support services? He probably won't engage but given them a heads up might be worth a go. Some unis are more pastoral than others.

Oh fwiw even if he has reduced the smoking, that first year of weed will still be affecting his brain. It's not the same for everyone but it can be really disastrous. Some guys I grew were like this - smart enough to go to uni, smoked lots of weed, now semi-vegetable.

Thank you for your advice. I didn't know that it causes paranoia as I've never smoked any weed myself and to be honest don't know much about it at all. Now that you have brought this to my attention, I feel that he maybe never gave up weed like he told me or if he did, it was for a brief period. I did contact the university welfare team but heard no response. I may try again.

It can also cause psychosis that is why it is important to keep in close contact with your DS. Paranoia and isolated oneself is the first sign. I am not saying this is what is happening but you need to be vigilant.

Yep - and the psychosis can come much later than you'd think.

Sadly most people seem to think weed is harmless, it's really not the case, especially for young brains. Not blaming you for your lack of knowledge OP - unfortunately the pressure for legalisation ignores these issues.

He would likely need to be staying in student halls and concerns have been raised by academics/ housemates, unless I misread the OP, he's in private rented. If he's in private rented, it's highly unlikely the university would be able to intervene (I have worked in 2 universities and also used to work in student accommodation).

@yakamoza its worth contacting the university's money/ funding team to get some advice, it'd be within his interests to formally withdraw ASAP if he hasn't as otherwise he will find himself liable for even more debt for the extra tuition fees for the whole year, as these are paid in instalments.

If the fee deadline has passed they may still be able to explore other options to get some of the funds back, such as 'compelling personal reasons' (e.g mental health reasons or similar). The advice team will definitely be able to help with this though. Good luck and I hope you get it sorted.

Well, you’ve been wondering where all the money has been going, so you may have your answer in weed/drugs. Would definitely explain the paranoia and lethargy.

He’s 23. Withdraw financial support and wish him well. You must allow him to reach the realisation that there’s no such thing as a completely free existence. He has to take responsibility for himself and re-engage with life. While you are enabling his current behaviour and lifestyle this will never happen.

If he's in private rented, it's highly unlikely the university would be able to intervene (I have worked in 2 universities and also used to work in student accommodation).

@Sw1989 he is in private accommodation but as suggested I will write to the university again to ask if someone could get in touch with him and offer him some guidance on support available (if any), fees etc. I don't know if they will do anything at all but I will at least try.

My sister suggested that I ask his gf if she could contact us if she becomes seriously concerned about his wellbeing but I don't know how well placed she herself is to judge that. My husband also seems to think it may not be a good idea if she somehow directly or indirectly controls him to give her more control and make her the so called gatekeeper between us and our son.

I am so confused myself but have to keep going and try to come to some solution.

@yakamoza I really do sympathise with what you are going through. The situation you are in is complex and don't think that there is one easy answer that will magically turn it all around. It's really something you may have to chip away at bit by bit.
I've seen similar happen to young people I've known. They get great grades because they are bright and teachers are there to supervise. That is the study skill system they have learnt to pass exams. Do this by that date. Make your answers like this and its not an independent one.
They probably get a lot of supervision at home ( by which I mean, you see them every day, they don't have to worry that much about cooking, cleaning, etc. ) .Maybe they are quite young for their age, or perhaps have not yet started going out independently etc.

Everyone is applying for uni, they don't know what they want to do. Parents encourage them to apply etc... They get there, suddenly they are in charge of making sure they know what's going on with the course. They have to drag themself out of bed after a night out for a 9.00 am lecture. They have to deal all the domestic stuff, with the social pressure of living in close quarters of all kinds of different people - maybe they don't get on, with the unwritten rule that they are supposed to be making friends and having the best time of their life.
Some are not able to adapt as quickly as others.
Once they've missed a certain amount, it becomes a hole that is really hard to dig yourself out of. EGThe friends son who dropped out of medical school (family of doctors) and became a sales man. He flourished in that field. Not what he or his parents initially wanted. I have also seen that they just needed time, a bit of a handhold and encouragement when they were looking for things. Eg, looking up opportunities along the lines of things they are interested in.

I completely understand why you were concerned when contact stopped. Anyone would have been.

I am not sure how much the tough love approach will work. I think it is a simplistic blunt and last resort instrument. You may not have seen it as your DH telling him off.. but you told him all you wanted was contact and to know he was OK. And whether he said it nicely or not, your son contacted as requested, and the conversation ended with an ultimatum. He tried to say what he was planning to do. This wasn't given much creedence and he was told Leave at the end of the month - 16 days away. He procrastinates, he won't be ready in two weeks. he will just go into a mad panic. It is not a reasonable deadline.

He was already in a panic when you turned up and he wouldn't let you in. It's actually piling on the pressure. Imagine someone telling you to find a job or move out in two weeks or else.

Yes. he needs to sort out his fees etc with the uni. Yes He does need to make a proper plan. Yes. He has definitely wasted time and money and resources and that is really frustrating for you but what is the best way forward from here?

There's no point blaming the GF since that is all speculation. He might be worse off if she wasn't giving him some kind of support, you don't know. Not getting on with uni flat mates is not unusual, especially if you are the untidy, disorganised type, coming across people in halls who are racist may have happened, again - you don't know if this is necessarily your son's fault.

I am being a bit of a devil's advocate here and I don't know exactly what the answer is either. If it were me, I'd try to find someone you can talk to about how to handle this, someone who works with young people/careers (perhaps via the uni) and not a relative (BIL) who didn't make much headway with him.

If you want to get on his wavelength, I'd also try to research his you tube idea. It might improve communications between you both, which I think is part of the problem. Who are his favourite You Tubers? It's not actually a bad idea Broadcasters want people who have shown they can make good social media content Every radio production job has this. Athough it is very competitive, but I know people who have got broadcast jobs by making their own reels. I know one kid who got a broadcast job because he did a tik Tok vox pop series in his local town asking peopleabout xyz..Although they had training first. but maybe there is a charity/political party (you said he likes politics) who could use some You Tube/social media help? That would be a start. There are websites like Mandy that advertise jobs like runners. This would help if applying for courses.
His uni careers centre should still give advice for a year or two after attending. He needs to get a proper appointment and get lists of companies that work with You Tube, apprenticeships and have lists of places to apply to etc. The big Broadcasters advertise some in Q1 of the year, so he'd have to be quick.
Linked in may help him research the kind of jobs he'd like to be doing in 2-3 years time and what they are asking for so he can plan to acquire those things. You/he can work backwards from there. There are unis with big media departments, who do short courses. _He'd be best off getting at least a one year course with a placement/portfolio element._It is surprising what they can achieve if they are doing something they want to do, rather than something they opted for when they were younger and didn't know.

I hope you find a way to get through to him and rebuild communications. It is a difficult situation, he is an adult and needs to become more independent but my best advice is put the last year's mistakes to one side, focus on what next and take it from there. Best wishes