For stopping a man taking his daughter in swimming pool changing room?

[Anotsolittlemermaid]

I am a regular user but changed name for this as I’ve spoken to a few people about it so it could be outing. I apologise it’s quite a long post but couldn’t cut it much shorter as context is needed.

I have a monthly subscription to a gym with a swimming pool that’s part of a hotel, on a Wednesday there is women’s aqua aerobics from 7-8 then adult only time from 8pm till 10pm.

Yesterday evening I got to the pool at about 8.15 after aqua aerobics and there was a man who was just arriving at the pool with his young daughter who was about 4/5.

He was being quite annoying letting her disrupt people by jumping in where people were swimming, getting in the path of other swimmers, throwing floats used for aqua across the pool and he was picking her up and throwing her.
The little girl was shrieking and screaming and a few people gave annoyed looks over at him but he carried on getting in everyone’s way.

In the end after about 20 minutes a member of staff came over and asked the man to leave the pool as children’s hours had finished, he argued a bit saying he was trying to tire his daughter out so she would sleep but the staff member was firm and said there had been two sessions of children’s hours for 2 hours at a time earlier in the day that he had been welcome to use but people who wanted to swim properly deliberately avoided them and came later.

The women’s changing room was still busy after aqua and it was mostly women swimming in the pool who had stayed after aqua to continue swimming. The changing rooms are right next to the pool so you can hear when people are in them. The men’s seemed empty but the man and his daughter were also hotel guests so he could have wrapped a towel around her and gone back to the room. He had towels and a hotel robe for himself with him.

When he got out of the pool he put the robe on but took his daughter by the hand and walked towards the women’s changing room obviously intending to go in.

The changing room is open plan with only one cubicle, it had 8 showers, 4 are in cubicles but the other 4 are open, when I had undressed before swimming the changing room had been busy with lots of women using the showers and changing after aqua, there were obviously a few women still in there as I could hear chatting and the hairdryer going.

I had been swimming lengths at the edge of the pool opposite the changing room entrance so when I saw him heading to the women’s I called out to him “sorry but that’s the ladies and it’s busy, you can take your daughter to the men’s I’m sure it’s empty or can you not just put your towel around her and go to your room?”

The man glared at me and said he wasn’t taking his daughter into a room where men might be undressing and he had taken her into changing rooms before where no one had ever had a problem.

I said it was more likely they did have a problem but didn’t feel comfortable saying so, I was getting angry at this point so I said I’d go and get the member of staff to see what he said.

The man obviously knew the staff member wasn’t going to approve this and started ranting about how awful it was that first his daughter had been asked to leave the pool and now he couldn’t even get her dry and dressed again because of busy bodies sticking their oar in. Another women who was swimming and had overheard backed me up that it was completely inappropriate and no one over 8 is allowed in the opposite sex changing room. The man wasn’t happy but wrapped his daughter in the towel and took her his hotel room as I’d suggested. As he was wearing the robe I have no idea if he had planned to use the women’s changing room to shower and get changed himself or not.

I hate confrontation but the other women thanked me for saying something, I spoke to the staff member when I’d finished my swim and he agreed that the man should have used the men’s changing room where there was a free cubicle. He said he’d been cheeky enough bringing his daughter during adult hours when he’d been told earlier he wouldn’t be allowed when he’d asked about it.

I assumed most people would agree with me but my friend said I was completely out of order, she said the little girl was the one who was important and it was much safer and more appropriate for her to get changed in the ladies, she said most mums would be understanding about a father bringing his daughter in and could have got changed under a towel, when I mentioned he had also been in the pool and was possibly planning on getting undressed himself she said “well no one has to look if they don’t want to”
I didn’t want to keep discussing it with her as we had argued before years ago about her bringing her 11 year old son and nephews into ladies changing rooms and I realised she was the wrong person to mention it to.

I also mentioned it to DP and he said that I was right to stop the man going in the ladies but he equally feels uncomfortable when men bring their daughters in, he also swims and said the previous week a little girl had been running naked round the changing room whilst her dad was looking at his phone and he would never allow his daughter to do that as you just don’t know what other men are thinking.

There are no family changing rooms as it’s not really a kids pool with it being attached to a gym and it’s mainly set up for members comfort. The majority of people who bring kids are hotel guests who have rooms.

I don’t feel IABU really but after hearing my friend and DP’s opinion I just wondered what others thought about it. Was I wrong to suggest the man takes his daughter into the men’s changing room? On this occasion a cubicle was free but if it hadn’t been then do some people really think that women should be expected to get showered and undressed in front of a man when he could take her into the mens changing room?
I’m just interested in others thoughts.

There is also a disabled changing room but only one and in my opinion it’s wrong to take that over if you don’t have a disability.

A) If you’re worried about men saying, what about the women and girls in THEIR changing room they’re supposed to be in having to put up with the starey man who’s barge ships way in? - this makes no sense

b) yes girls are fight about bodily autonomy so how is it fair to have to put up with a man int heir changing room? - this makes no sense either

c) so it’s not appropriate for little girls to change in front of men…unless those men want to use the ladies changing room then the girls have to STFU because his little princess is The Most Important - no men shouldn’t be allowed in women’s changing spaces. These should be protected at all costs. It should be mandatory that safe spaces are also provided for children and their parents

d) So women and girls have to tolerate men in their changing rooms because they might be pedophiles? Can dads not be pedophiles?
Easiest solution is for everyone to change int he changing room according to their sec and kids under 8 go wherever their parent goes - see above

right, and an able-bodied man with an able -bodied child is neither disabled nor a baby, so those facilities are not for them.

I absolutely understand that for the girl. My point is that the boy can be just as innocent.

Should have said:

A) If you’re worried about men staring, what about the women and girls in THEIR changing room they’re supposed to be in having to put up with the starey man who’s barges his way in?

b) yes girls are taught about bodily autonomy so how is it fair to have to put up with a man in their changing room?

It should be mandatory that safe spaces are also provided for children and their parents

You keep saying this but what happens when that isn’t an option? Also kids do have safe spaces - wherever their parents are.

Exactly, privacy between opposite sex adults is much more important than between adults and small children of the opposite sex.

Really?

What about a 9 yo boy where should he be? Still with mum and the girls?

DH takes 6yo DD to swimming lessons every week at a hotel pool. He's always taken her into the men's changing room, he'd be shocked at the suggestion of him going into a female changing room, and it had never occurred to me that it would be an issue for her to use the men's. He often takes her with him into the men's toilets as the queues are far shorter.

How does him being innocent justify him being in somewhere he doesn’t belong where his prance would make girls and women feel uncomfortable? They don’t know him from Adam, don’t know he’s innocent. And even if someone said “Oh it’s ok he’s an innocent boy” it doesn’t make it any better

But I haven’t once said that I think men should be allowed in women’s spaces so why are you asking me these questions? I’ve repeatedly said that they shouldn’t be. He did have a safe space, he was able to take her to his hotel room. In the absence of a safe space I don’t know what the answer is.

They were actually the most wonderful employers- more like family. Still in touch after several years. Not controlling at all. I respected them and they respected me even more. I wanted nothing more than to keep their children safe and I did so. The boys were never in a room with a girl who was undressed. How awful to suggest. The swim change rooms I frequented had separate showers and separate cubicles. They never walked in amongst naked people of any gender. There was a separate room for changing that the elder boys never entered. I had the younger ones in there though, and some older women did complain to me. I was merely saying that I didn’t allow my charges to enter a men’s change room alone before the age of 11 to keep them safe. I heard of a very real story of a ten year old boy being abused in a male toilet cubicle in a shopping centre when I was 13 and it never left me. I kept my kids safe….

FFS how do we need to be so clear about this. Women and young girls need to feel safe when undressing.

There isn’t an absence of a safe space. The safe slave for his daughter is with him, in the changing room he belongs in - the men’s

FWIW ever heard of a "chowel?" I'm an athlete and lots of us used them at comps when facilities weren't available.

I mean obviously yanbu. It’s a women’s changing space and neither he nor his daughter are women.

the other women were wrong to complain when the oldest child was 7 years old and under
you were in the wrong to keep them with you at 8,9,10 and (unbelievably) 11 years old!

by saying 'nobody else complained' you are essentially saying that you expected an 8, 9,10 or 11 year old girl (who, say had come swimming with her father and followed the rules correctly) to stand up and tell you, a grown woman, plus 4 boys that she felt uncomfortable. Yet your 11 year old boy was an 'innocent kid' who couldn't even be expected to get changed on his own.

Blimey a lot of a naive posters here!!

A man staying in a hotel wants to go into a busy female open plan changing room, where there will be only adult women?

Oh I wonder why?

God help his wee girl.

Sheesh. The #BeKind is strong in this thread!

9 and 11 year old boys should not be in the female changing room.

this is the reason I cannot use the local hotel pool with my son: he’s 9 years old. I am not comfortable with him being alone in the male changing room with strange men. But it is also unfair on him and other women/girls for him to use the ladies changing room. So we don’t go there. It’s a bit shit: but that’s life

It’s a pain, but I simply don’t take my 9 year old son where there is only communal changing rooms. He’s too young to change with strange men, and too old to come into the women’s with me

Ok I agree and my own 8+ yr old boy will not get changed in a female room when the time comes. At the time I thought I was doing the right thing. Wanting to keep four kids together and safe! I feel for future child givers though! Especially of multiples.

That's exactly what I was thinking. They must have had clothes somewhere

but facilities are available in this case, so how is that relevant?
That's like saying 'ever heard of a hose? You can use that if showers aren't available.'
In fact, why bother going to the swimming pool at all? Ever heard of a bath?

I use a changing towel when I'm at the beach and there aren't any other options.
If I'm at the pool, where I have paid to use the facilities, which include the changing room, then I want to have a proper shower and get changed, including putting on deodorant, cream for my excema, etc., without fumbling awkwardly under a robe so a random man doesn't see me naked. Which doesn't seem a particularly unreasonable ask IN THE WOMEN'S CHANGING ROOM

apart from which, you can't wear a 'chowel' into the showers, as surely the 'towel' part requires them to, um, remain DRY in order to perform their key function?

Child carers**

How are these men not even a tiny bit embarrassed? You couldn't pay me to walk into the men's changing rooms and I'm pretty sure DH would rather die than get changed in the womens!

Now you're fighting about towels, fgs.

Yeah @latetothefisting why can’t you just #bekind STFU and behave like a lady!