For stopping a man taking his daughter in swimming pool changing room?

[Anotsolittlemermaid]

I am a regular user but changed name for this as I’ve spoken to a few people about it so it could be outing. I apologise it’s quite a long post but couldn’t cut it much shorter as context is needed.

I have a monthly subscription to a gym with a swimming pool that’s part of a hotel, on a Wednesday there is women’s aqua aerobics from 7-8 then adult only time from 8pm till 10pm.

Yesterday evening I got to the pool at about 8.15 after aqua aerobics and there was a man who was just arriving at the pool with his young daughter who was about 4/5.

He was being quite annoying letting her disrupt people by jumping in where people were swimming, getting in the path of other swimmers, throwing floats used for aqua across the pool and he was picking her up and throwing her.
The little girl was shrieking and screaming and a few people gave annoyed looks over at him but he carried on getting in everyone’s way.

In the end after about 20 minutes a member of staff came over and asked the man to leave the pool as children’s hours had finished, he argued a bit saying he was trying to tire his daughter out so she would sleep but the staff member was firm and said there had been two sessions of children’s hours for 2 hours at a time earlier in the day that he had been welcome to use but people who wanted to swim properly deliberately avoided them and came later.

The women’s changing room was still busy after aqua and it was mostly women swimming in the pool who had stayed after aqua to continue swimming. The changing rooms are right next to the pool so you can hear when people are in them. The men’s seemed empty but the man and his daughter were also hotel guests so he could have wrapped a towel around her and gone back to the room. He had towels and a hotel robe for himself with him.

When he got out of the pool he put the robe on but took his daughter by the hand and walked towards the women’s changing room obviously intending to go in.

The changing room is open plan with only one cubicle, it had 8 showers, 4 are in cubicles but the other 4 are open, when I had undressed before swimming the changing room had been busy with lots of women using the showers and changing after aqua, there were obviously a few women still in there as I could hear chatting and the hairdryer going.

I had been swimming lengths at the edge of the pool opposite the changing room entrance so when I saw him heading to the women’s I called out to him “sorry but that’s the ladies and it’s busy, you can take your daughter to the men’s I’m sure it’s empty or can you not just put your towel around her and go to your room?”

The man glared at me and said he wasn’t taking his daughter into a room where men might be undressing and he had taken her into changing rooms before where no one had ever had a problem.

I said it was more likely they did have a problem but didn’t feel comfortable saying so, I was getting angry at this point so I said I’d go and get the member of staff to see what he said.

The man obviously knew the staff member wasn’t going to approve this and started ranting about how awful it was that first his daughter had been asked to leave the pool and now he couldn’t even get her dry and dressed again because of busy bodies sticking their oar in. Another women who was swimming and had overheard backed me up that it was completely inappropriate and no one over 8 is allowed in the opposite sex changing room. The man wasn’t happy but wrapped his daughter in the towel and took her his hotel room as I’d suggested. As he was wearing the robe I have no idea if he had planned to use the women’s changing room to shower and get changed himself or not.

I hate confrontation but the other women thanked me for saying something, I spoke to the staff member when I’d finished my swim and he agreed that the man should have used the men’s changing room where there was a free cubicle. He said he’d been cheeky enough bringing his daughter during adult hours when he’d been told earlier he wouldn’t be allowed when he’d asked about it.

I assumed most people would agree with me but my friend said I was completely out of order, she said the little girl was the one who was important and it was much safer and more appropriate for her to get changed in the ladies, she said most mums would be understanding about a father bringing his daughter in and could have got changed under a towel, when I mentioned he had also been in the pool and was possibly planning on getting undressed himself she said “well no one has to look if they don’t want to”
I didn’t want to keep discussing it with her as we had argued before years ago about her bringing her 11 year old son and nephews into ladies changing rooms and I realised she was the wrong person to mention it to.

I also mentioned it to DP and he said that I was right to stop the man going in the ladies but he equally feels uncomfortable when men bring their daughters in, he also swims and said the previous week a little girl had been running naked round the changing room whilst her dad was looking at his phone and he would never allow his daughter to do that as you just don’t know what other men are thinking.

There are no family changing rooms as it’s not really a kids pool with it being attached to a gym and it’s mainly set up for members comfort. The majority of people who bring kids are hotel guests who have rooms.

I don’t feel IABU really but after hearing my friend and DP’s opinion I just wondered what others thought about it. Was I wrong to suggest the man takes his daughter into the men’s changing room? On this occasion a cubicle was free but if it hadn’t been then do some people really think that women should be expected to get showered and undressed in front of a man when he could take her into the mens changing room?
I’m just interested in others thoughts.

There is also a disabled changing room but only one and in my opinion it’s wrong to take that over if you don’t have a disability.

I don't understand why he couldn't change her in a cubicle in the men's. Has the world lost its mind? I went in the men's with my dad when I was little. I took my sons in the ladies with me until they were old enough to go in the men's alone. This is normal. A man changing his dd in the ladies. No way!

My DH takes our daughters swimming all the time (it’s my break!). While I would never be happy for them to go into the men’s changing room. He just dries them down at the side, sticks a towelling robe on them plus a coat and then straight into the car. Why should women or indeed young girls have to tolerate a man in the room while they are changing.

I think it would be helpful to have a family changing room though!

Wow. Now I’m stupid, and too dumb to be a parent. You really are something. I’m sorry you are struggling to hold the discussion but there is no need to resort to personal insults.

I would have replied that at least I wasn’t a dick.

Yes I agree ... I think we could do with a bit of the German attitude, that bodies are just bodies, with all their weirdnesses and wobbly bits, they're nothing to shy away from in an everyday environment like a changing room.

If a small child did feel such a strong aversion to seeing people naked, hopefully they would say so and make a fuss before going into the pool area (mine certainly would have!) and the parent could change their plans accordingly. Dryrobes might be an option for skipping the changing room altogether.

If you look back over my previous posts I’ve answered this exact question already

And if there had been other children in the women's changing room is that okay also? That a strange man is getting changed in front of them. He wanted to protect his child from strange men but was happy to be 'the strange man' in front of women and possibly girls. Double standards.

But where does he get changed?

I had a membership at a?club where families could add a carer, nanny or au pair to the subscription. The issue then was that boys had to be under 8 to use the changing facilities. Tjis was the same rule at the cricket and tennis club At that age boys could be curious and especially around oregnant or breast feeding mums. I think for various reasons a changing area with cubicles might be safer and appreciated at all facilities.

Surely the most sensible answer is to use the disabled changing room and be quick about it.
Not ideal, but better than the 2 alternatives.

Well I think privacy from the same sex and privacy from the opposite sex are very different things, which is surely why separate sex changing rooms exist in the first place.

I don’t like using them with my family, no, so I do avoid them. And I think I have a right to feel that way (despite being massively insulted for doing so by a certain other poster on this thread!)

If they’re going to have kids sessions they need family changing cubicles, all our leisure centres do. I wouldn’t want my girls in the men’s, but also completely agree about men in the women’s changing rooms.

No taboo. I just think there's a time and a place. I don't feel sad about it.

It's odd logic for the dad not to want a girl to change in front of other men, but expects other girls to change with him there.

Children until 6 years can change with their parents. After that they go to their own changing rooms. It's not difficult.

oh goodness, what a lot of shambles

She protected the women already in the changing room.

You and all your handmaiden chums don't get to decide for the rest if us that men come into our spaces

No. Not now, not ever.

In their hotel room? He brought her outside of the family/children time where there may have been more flexibility.

Obviously the ideal solution would be for the venue to have some sort of family changing room for such scenarios but they don't. Given that the women's changing room is open plan, I can't see how it would be in any way acceptable for an adult man to be present in there, regardless of whether or not his daughter was changing.

No it's not

Unless you’re a man who can’t take their child into a changing room and protect them I am not referring to you

What is your answer?

You are a truly unpleasant person, I have reported you last post for personal attack. People like you bring mumsnet down into the gutter.

But to answer you question about the boys - I have no problem with other people’s boys up to the age of 7 coming into the women’s changing rooms (as you say this is the convention). But if the parent of a boy felt this was inappropriate for her child at an earlier age, I would respect that decision, and not accuse her of being a stupid, half-wit paedophile. Sound reasonable?

As a hotel guest, he didn’t need to use any changing room.

I do feel sorry for him and his DD though. This highlights why hotels with pools shouldn’t be trying to make more money by selling memberships as if they are a gym/pool for the locals.

A hotel really shouldn’t be making it impossible for any children to swim in the pool from 7pm onwards every night. It means most hotel guests with children won’t get to use the hotel pool at all.

They should also have family changing rooms for these situations instead of assuming that children will only have a mum with them- so sexist and really makes it hard for fathers to step up.

But what is the time and the place if not a communal changing room?!

And while I accept all families work differently I genuinely get it hard to get my head round the logistics of trying to avoid young children seeing their own parents naked.

The reality is, if you stop children seeing any kind of incidental nudity at all costs at some point they will be a teen who has seen only one kind of adult naked body: those belonging to people who are paid to be naked (actors, models, porn). I think that's a really damaging thing.

Why aged 7!

I am it accusing anyone of being a pedophile, just stupid

You stated "I don’t think a little boy in the women’s changing room is quite as much of a safeguarding issue as a little girl in the men’s. For obvious reasons."

So you do think it is different and no, the reasons are not obvious to me. Can you please explain?

The child's parent would presumably, protect them from any inappropriate actions by the other people in the changing room. The child would presumably to changed under a towel so the other people in the changing room would see considerable less than they would be able to see in the pool and on deck.