Periods at school but no toilet pass

[PyjamaFiasco]

Hello hive mind.

What's the policy at your/kids' secondary schools about going to the toilet in lesson?

Ours is "no toilet breaks in class without a toilet pass." A toilet pass is issued when you can provide evidence of a medical need.

My daughter is on her period this week and yesterday unfortunately leaked through her pad onto her trousers and onto the chair after she had a flooding incident. She had asked to use the toilet and was told no and didn't feel comfortable saying to a male teacher in front of the whole class "sir I'm on my period." She's feeling embarrassed that the person who went to use the chair afterwards would see it.

When you go in between lessons the toilets are rammed with students all trying to go at the same time and the 5 minutes between lessons isn't long enough to then get to the next class. Going at break or lunch is fine but when on your period you mind need to go more often/ change it more frequently.

She said she felt she had 3 options: do nothing, walk out and go to the toilet anyway and get a detention or be late to the next lesson and get a detention anyway.

@Walkden

You seem to resent the way that teaching has changed, as well as reflecting outdated views on the right of equitable treatment for women.

Have you considered a career change, or maybe moving to work in the LEA? I honestly think you’d be happier.

Absolutely not helpful and sadly inaccurate.

More resentment for people who lack understanding of the job from posters of what teachers role is in this day and age

"reflecting outdated views on the right of equitable treatment for women"

How so?

Okay? Sorry but the protection of my own children’s health and well-being is my only concern. It’s why I do hard things like hold them to high standards of behaviour. Other people taking advantage of teachers because they can’t look after or parent their children is of significantly less concern to me than my child suffering through problems related to being denied access to the toilet and missing out on learning time because they are either desperate to go or worried sick about potentially bleeding through their clothes.

You should probably stop doing things that are outside the scope of your job, like washing the clothes of children whose parents are neglectful, or policing when well-behaved children access the toilet.

Any parent who would let their own child suffer so a school can more effectively discipline future criminals and career benefit claimants isn’t fit to have care of children. A child who already blends into the background because they are mentally well, never misbehave, hand in their homework on time, and have parents who feed, clothe and parent them appropriately should not have to suffer any more than they inherently do due to poorly parented children, who already rob so much from their education just by sharing a classroom with them.

@batt3nb3rg I would suggest that a child age 11 or older with no medical issues should be able to wait for an hour to go to the toilet. If they didn’t need it at break, it’s highly unlikely they’ll be absolutely bursting within an hour. If they are, there may be a medical issue, in which case they can get a toilet pass.

As I have said repeatedly, teachers tend to use their professional judgement, particularly with girls. But surely anyone who has ever been in a classroom (even as a child) can recognise that just allowing anyone to get up and go to the toilet whenever they want doesn’t work. It would be chaos.

This.

Absolutely this.

It's shameful. Deeply shameful.

Threads like this always distinguish between those who get it - who've experienced really heavy periods and flooding - and those who haven't. What do all those minimising the problem think the answer is? Are girls supposed to not go to school one week in four? Because that is where this is going.

That's before we get to the embarrassment and shame they will feel drawing attention to this perfectly normal bodily function. They are absolutely entitled to complete privacy and dignity - as are we all as women.

This is so wrong and it needs sorting now.

wear a sanitary pad if you know your period is due, etc. And for those girls with irregular periods - just how many days do you expect her to wear a sanitary pad just in case her period starts?

And how do you match that with medical advice for hygiene which advises not wrapping your private parts in a hot moisture inducing pad for days on end?

"or policing when well-behaved children access the toilet"

Seeing as doing this is a prerequisite for keeping my job and maintaining the well being of my own family I will continue to do so, exercising the discretion allowed me as a professional.

When a child goes to the toilet is in a similar category to what a child’s packed lunch contains. It is generally not any of a teacher’s concern, and if they have an issue, it isn’t appropriate for them to open a discussion about it with a child who is not related to them. If they feel compelled to discuss it, it should be with the child’s parent only. Toileting is a private matter and isn’t appropriate for a teacher to open dialogue with a child on.

Genuinely curious then- you think in a class of 30 kids, they should just be able to get up and go to the toilet whenever they like? And you don’t see how this might impact their learning or cause behaviour issues?

Hopefully the common sense you presumably possess as a teacher would enable you to know when a dispute won’t end in a victory for you. I am certainly a person who supports a teacher’s right to discipline bad behaviour in my children, but when they start interfering with my parenting, they will be politely and firmly rebuffed.

"When a child goes to the toilet is in a similar category to what a child’s packed lunch contains. It is generally not any of a teacher’s concern"

The government disagree with you as they see it as vital to miss as little learning/ lesson time as possible. Furthermore keeping children safe is a safeguarding issue.

No teacher would open a dialogue with a student about their toileting needs; usually it is the other way around.

I'd just like to say, I am a rule keeper by nature. I was Head Girl at school.

@Anothermathstutor I completely agree with this poster. You have the imagination of an amoeba, and you should be deeply ashamed of yourself. Please educate yourself and reflect on this as a matter of extreme urgency.

I am not given to hyperbole, but it is no exaggeration to say this attitude is torturing girls.

We allow our students to the toilet when they want. We record in their planners when they leave class and when they re-enter. I have taken to buying a “toilet” stamp as I can sign up to 10 planners a lesson!

Badly behaved children should be harshly disciplined. Children who have form of causing issues in and around toilets, or of saying they are going to the toilet while actually going wandering, should be prevented from going to the toilet during lesson time. There is no issue with having different rules for children who behave well and children who don’t. If only well behaved children are allowed to use the toilet during lesson time, then presumably every lesson one or two hands would go up, permission to go to the toilet would be requested and granted, and one child would quietly get up, exit the room, and then re-enter five minutes later, with everything continuing as was when they were gone, and with the child in question skimming quickly over whatever section of the book the teacher had been teaching from.

FFS, yes, as adult women we could make it work, be prepared, use double protection, etc. But remember being a secondary school girl, you don’t always remember everything, you get caught up in things at break time and you don’t have time to make it to the loo before it’s time to go back to lessons, you don’t always place your pad correctly when your friends are waiting on the other side of the door, and so on.

"There is no issue with having different rules for children who behave well and children who don’t."

Wrong.

If only well behaved children are allowed to use the toilet during lesson time, then presumably every lesson one or two hands would go up, permission to go to the toilet would be requested and granted, and one child would quietly get up, exit the room, and then re-enter five minutes later,

You presume wrong!

with everything continuing as was when they were gone, and with the child in question skimming quickly over whatever section of the book the teacher had been teaching from.

This shows how little you understand of modern teaching methods...

My DC's school is on a split site, and the railway station is on the walk between the two sites.Also from Y10 upwards, students are allowed off site at lunchtime. Apparently the KS4 girls run into the station toilets while changing sites because their toilets are always locked, and they even have to queue to access them at break!

Are you sure she’d get a detention for being late to one lesson? Ours is 3 lates in one day.

Ours is a sanction for being late to one lesson.

I was in secondary school less than a decade ago, so I doubt things have changed that much.

It also matters little to me if I am presuming wrong - that’s how my child would behave in class, and they won’t be penalised because other people can’t or won’t raise children who can be trusted to use the toilet when their body signals that they need to.

What is the sanction?

" won’t end in a victory for you"

How teachers implement toilet policy in their school is not a matter of victory or defeat.

We don't keep tally charts of how many times a pupil gets out of lesson. They have either got a toilet/ medical pass or a reasonable reason why they need to go during a lesson. If they don't have either they they don't get my permission. How you parent your child doesn't come into it. They are free to walk out and I tell them so but this has its own consequences and toilets are locked outside of break and lunch in any event

As a parent, if you want your "well behaved" child care blanche permission to go to toilet in lesson send them to a school that allows it or speak to the pastoral team.

This!! @batt3nb3rg I can’t even begin to explain everything wrong with what you just said. And we don’t teach from books anymore!

@batt3nb3rg sorry I was typing quickly, I realise that sounds unduly harsh. But with all due respect, what you are suggesting just wouldn’t work. At least not in any school I have worked in.