To feel sad I'm going to end up 'managing' another man

[twentyoneteacups]

Aware I might be setting myself up for attack by posting in AIBU for this, but here goes...

My dad's been sorting out his will recently, and adding a Letter of Wishes - things that don't go in the will itself but offer guidelines for how he'd like some other things to be handled.

One of the items in the Letter of Wishes is about his younger brother.

They come from a pretty well-off family, and this brother, my uncle, has lived his life accordingly. He recently got his first job (at 62 years old) after spending his life gambling, being funded by his mother (my grandmother), and chasing 'big deals with the Saudis' that never come to fruition.

A few years ago his 'luck' with the Bank of Mum ran out, and he's since sold his fancy Central London flat (bought for him by their parents), moved into his sister (my aunt)'s house for 2 years rent-free and then when she ran out of patience (she's a saint and takes beautiful care of everyone around her), a granny-flat in a neighbour's garden. He's got a job as a van driver and is earning now, which is good, but he's going to be in trouble when it comes to his later life.

He didn't like my mother, and so cut any meaningful contact with my dad when they got married. He's never sought any kind of relationship with me at all – contrasted with his relationship with my cousins (my aunt married 'well', so he was in their lives quite enthusiastically).

Which brings us to my dad's Letter of Wishes.

Dad has said that if I need money from his estate, I should put that need first. But if I don't, and his brother outlives him, he wants me to use the money to take care of his brother – not leaving him a lump sum (because he'll gamble it away), but to pay him a monthly stipend and cover his care.

Essentially, to make sure his brother is OK.

It's very 'my dad', wanting to take care of family no matter what, and I love that about him, AND there's a part of me that's pretty... miffed.

I've found myself repeatedly in relationships with men where I've ended up leaving because they started relying on my finances, borrowing and not paying back, expecting me to cough up for big purchases, doing the 'financial management' of our relationship for them, and this feels like a repeat version of this – but for a family member who has never taken an interest in me nor done much to take care of himself.

It's not that I want whatever money my dad leaves behind all for myself – I've worked damn hard to get to a place where I'm financially stable on my own and should be fine in the future without anything that my dad leaves me – it's more the mental and emotional load of being my uncle's financial 'carer'.

Yet again, it feels like, men get to do whatever they want, and in swoop the women (my grandmother, my aunt, and now potentially me) to do the work of rescuing and 'making it all ok'.

I feel guilty for being frustrated by this, because of course I don't want my uncle to suffer later in life - I don't want that for anyone. He's not been 'family' to me, but he is my dad's family, and I'll respect my dad's wishes, and honour his values. Heck - it may never even come to that point, but it is niggling at me.

So I guess I'm looking for either some validation for my feelings, or a good Mumsnet-style head-wobble... how does it all land with you? AIBU, or is it OK to be torn about this?

Do you have any other siblings?

I know your father is trying to be kind, but he had no business volunteering you to be the person taking care of someone who has never taken any interest in you, and has a history of taking advantage of other people’s kindness and generosity. Why is it always women who are expected to take of others, and not the other way round?

He won't know about the Letter of Wishes, so I don't foresee this myself – but you never know :)

@jumperround I'm perfectly clear that I CAN do whatever I want – and my sense of agency is equaled by my recognition that the money isn't mine yet, and that anyone's wishes about what happens to their estate after they die deserve to be respected.

This has all happened quite recently, and I'm working through my thoughts and feelings about it. I don't think in knee-jerk reductionist binaries, but that doesn't negate my understanding of my own autonomy.

I think this kind of 'wish' is mean and a burden BUT you don't have to do anything. The primary focus is you. He is giving the money to you. You'll never know when you may need the money in your life time so don't give it away. If that's not comfortable for you then just say to your dad you'd prefer him to leave some money to his brother

It awkward Op but it's better than a lump sum in your DF will. No one knows how much your DF will leave, care costs can eat up £1000s and a lump sum for his DB could become a huge source of family tension.
I'd ask your DF not to mention the letter to others, that way you can make the final decision when necessary

Sorry to hear that @twentyoneteacups

is your Dad open to conversations about how uncomfortable you feel about this based on your uncles behaviour? It’s like giving him a green light to ‘doss about’ if he knows via the cousins that there’s a pot of money to rescue him. I can see the job going etc if he knows he doesn’t have too put all the effort in.

OP, I have seen what happens when people leave money with strings attached, and it never ends well. Tell your father that he needs to seaparate any money left to you from your uncle - you say you haven’t been close to your DU: why should you now be privy to his affairs? What happens when, say, your DU comes wheedling to you for money that you’ve earmarked for, say, renovations to your house? How on earth do you balance your own needs against those of your uncle? What happens when the cousins get involved - and they will, if your uncle puts pressure on them. I’d be talking to your DF and saying that while these wishes are kindly meant, they could lead to a minefield down the road, and that you don’t want the money to lead to rows within the family.

@WilfredsPies I don't think those are likely outcomes – as I said, this isn't in the will, but in the letter of wishes, so there's no 'legally binding' anything and my uncle won't know what's in the letter.

My weighing-up is more internal – both wanting to respect my father's wishes and also recognising the frustrating situation they put me in.

This

Your dad should make his own arrangements or trust for his brother. Not leave it to you to do, and certainly not put anything in a document his brother may read that expresses any hint that you will take care of him if you don't need the money!

I know he'd be completely open to it – and any discomfort I felt, he'd act on immediately. My dad's a good person and loves me unwaveringly; I think I just wanted to untangle all these threads in my own head before going to him.

This thread and everyone's responses have been really helping with that; it's so easy to bounce around inside your own mind and not land anywhere useful!

It's good to bounce thoughts off other people. Sorry if my previous post came across as harsh towards your dad, I was just trying to boil things down to black and white clarity. Glad that you know your dad will take your discomfort on board

TBH, I think I'd make myself "very in need" with that money. Even if that "need" is "I need it to sit in a very long term ISA."

Your uncle has had 62 years of pandering. And if he hasn't mastered money management by now, then in all honesty, he isn't going to.

I'd tell my dad all that you've said in your OP. That with all due respect, you've no interest in taking on another wastrel man.
If you dad wants to provide for his brother after he's gone, he either needs to do a lump sum and accept it probably won't last long, or he needs to set up a trust.

I think this is a brilliant idea!

Not harsh at all – I get it! 🙂

Not appropriate- your dad is the one at fault here.

if he feels that strongly about providing for his brother, he can put things in place to do so. He is dumping this on you. He could fully take ownership of this situation and make his own provisions. This isn’t just financial responsibility he is asking of you, he wants you involved and over seeing his brother, or he would just sort it out himself.

Well, ignore the feeling! Don't meet trouble halfway as the saying goes. It hasn't happened and your Dad might outlive your uncle so it may never happen. And if it does happen then don't get involved in sorting him out. He'll get a lump sum and he can crack on.

Maybe you could consult a solicitor for advice on a solution which suits both you and your dad. And ask them how much letter of wishes counts. Maybe suggest a wording that doesn't imply you are your uncle's carer... and whether it commits you to care home fees for him as far as social services are concerned.

I think your dad has done this so he can say don't worry Uncle, OP will look after you and I think the Uncle will guilt trip you.
Why on earth should you take on responsibility for a 60 year old uncle with a history of gambling? Not sure it would help his gambling urges if he knows he has a relative he can apply to for an unspecified amount for an unspecified time period, just as he did with his parent.

Could you talk to your dad about drawing up a trust? Then it is the trustees problem not yours? (obvs have to make sure the trustee is not you!).

I'm irritated on your behalf.

Perhaps suggest he leaves a small lump sum to his brother that is to be paid out monthly over 5years and any unused goes to you/a charity or such like.

It's all to vague and wishy washy and opens the floodgates for manipulation and headspace. What you don't want to give is the headspace and complications.

Your dad sounds lovely but the wording could cause huge problems. At the moment, you’re financially independent and don’t need the money but things can change with health issues or accidents and, if you’ve set up a monthly payment for your uncle, you can’t just stop it if you suddenly and unexpectedly need the money.

I hope you and your dad can talk this through and he understands what a difficult, albeit well meaning, position this letter would put you in. Far better to leave your uncle a set amount, especially as he hasn’t even bothered to get to know you or support you at all in your life as a loving uncle

With respect (and I really do appreciate the force of you standing up for me here!), I think it's a little more complex than that.

What my dad wants for me is autonomy and freedom of choice, so I only take care of his brother on my terms and the inheritance is first and foremost mine.

The difficulty comes in, as PPs have highlighted, around the criteria of what I 'need' or 'don't need' and how I navigate that for myself, both morally and practically.

YANBU. It's endlessly frustrating that these useless men are presented as needing help. If you 'don't need' your inheritance it'll be because you didn't piss away your money, not because you have better fortune than your uncle. It sounds like the thing that's angered you is the expectation of a monthly stipend, which is completely fair - you're not his mum to dole out pocket money.

I'd just make your own peace with the fact that should the time come, you may give your uncle some money (putting your own needs first as per your father's wishes) but won't do anything like giving him a stipend or sorting out his care. Don't spend too much energy on it but be honest with your dad if he asks directly. There's a difference between sharing whatever is left with someone and taking on responsibility for managing their finances. If asked, say you're not comfortable with that and you'd rather your dad set up a formal trust so your uncle can manage his finances himself within the limits your dad wants to set.

It sounds like this is pushing some buttons for you - which is completely justified and a sign you should listen to your instincts, otherwise you'll only end up resentful. Stand firm and keep those boundaries OP!

If you give him any sort of lump sum he will fritter it and come straight back to you. It sounds like he has no qualms about leaning on others for money or life support. I would work out a reasonable and not overly generous monthly amount and direct debit it to him from your Dad's money but not get involved any further than that. Also I would find things that you 'need' to spend your Dad's money on to benefit you as it would be terrible to watch it being wasted by a relative who has never been in your life at all.

I have only read your posts, @twentyoneteacups, so apologies if someone has already suggested it, but, once you inherit, could you use some of the money to set up a trust for your uncle, with a lawyer as trustee, thus fulfilling your dad’s wishes without adding to your burden?

I think it’s a good idea to have an open and frank conversation with your father once you’ve had time to consider how you feel about it all.

It does seem unfair that your uncle should potentially be rewarded further for his feckless lifestyle.

But you mention non liquid assets which I’m guessing are property? If you wanted to explore further with your father the wider issues of what he may be thinking regarding housing your uncle in a property I would prefer to know his exact thoughts on this.

Normally people create a will which is clear cut, which this is but then he’s muddying the waters with a letter of wishes. I would ask for clarification as to how much support your DF thinks would be appropriate towards your uncle especially since he isn’t actually a beneficiary of the will.

On the one hand I can see your DF is expressing his wishes in leaving his estate to you, but he’s also asking you to consider his brother if you feel financially comfortable. But what does that mean? Also he’s not actually accounted for the fact that you then have to make decisions about your uncle that you’re not close to that could become very involved and uncomfortable for you to handle.

I think it's worth bearing in mind that a Letter of Wishes can often be a way for the deceased to kicked the can down the road and leave a messy and difficult situation to others to sort out after they've gone. Your DF can die happy, knowing he will have been seen to have done the right thing (care for his brother) while doing nothing and leaving it to you to sort out. I think in your shoes I'd wait to see what the situation is when your DH does eventually die and than make decisions.

Of course, if your father's estate trickles enough money into your DU's life to pay his basic bills, he probably won't be able to claim the pension credits and benefits that he's entitled to. It may be much more financially astute not to rescue him, see him housed in over-55 accommodation and get him to claim benefits. You could give him occasional gifts and help to make his life a little better but leave it at that. That will be your decision to make and I don't think anyone would bat an eyelid if you decided not to fund a lavish retirement for him.