To feel sad I'm going to end up 'managing' another man

[twentyoneteacups]

Aware I might be setting myself up for attack by posting in AIBU for this, but here goes...

My dad's been sorting out his will recently, and adding a Letter of Wishes - things that don't go in the will itself but offer guidelines for how he'd like some other things to be handled.

One of the items in the Letter of Wishes is about his younger brother.

They come from a pretty well-off family, and this brother, my uncle, has lived his life accordingly. He recently got his first job (at 62 years old) after spending his life gambling, being funded by his mother (my grandmother), and chasing 'big deals with the Saudis' that never come to fruition.

A few years ago his 'luck' with the Bank of Mum ran out, and he's since sold his fancy Central London flat (bought for him by their parents), moved into his sister (my aunt)'s house for 2 years rent-free and then when she ran out of patience (she's a saint and takes beautiful care of everyone around her), a granny-flat in a neighbour's garden. He's got a job as a van driver and is earning now, which is good, but he's going to be in trouble when it comes to his later life.

He didn't like my mother, and so cut any meaningful contact with my dad when they got married. He's never sought any kind of relationship with me at all – contrasted with his relationship with my cousins (my aunt married 'well', so he was in their lives quite enthusiastically).

Which brings us to my dad's Letter of Wishes.

Dad has said that if I need money from his estate, I should put that need first. But if I don't, and his brother outlives him, he wants me to use the money to take care of his brother – not leaving him a lump sum (because he'll gamble it away), but to pay him a monthly stipend and cover his care.

Essentially, to make sure his brother is OK.

It's very 'my dad', wanting to take care of family no matter what, and I love that about him, AND there's a part of me that's pretty... miffed.

I've found myself repeatedly in relationships with men where I've ended up leaving because they started relying on my finances, borrowing and not paying back, expecting me to cough up for big purchases, doing the 'financial management' of our relationship for them, and this feels like a repeat version of this – but for a family member who has never taken an interest in me nor done much to take care of himself.

It's not that I want whatever money my dad leaves behind all for myself – I've worked damn hard to get to a place where I'm financially stable on my own and should be fine in the future without anything that my dad leaves me – it's more the mental and emotional load of being my uncle's financial 'carer'.

Yet again, it feels like, men get to do whatever they want, and in swoop the women (my grandmother, my aunt, and now potentially me) to do the work of rescuing and 'making it all ok'.

I feel guilty for being frustrated by this, because of course I don't want my uncle to suffer later in life - I don't want that for anyone. He's not been 'family' to me, but he is my dad's family, and I'll respect my dad's wishes, and honour his values. Heck - it may never even come to that point, but it is niggling at me.

So I guess I'm looking for either some validation for my feelings, or a good Mumsnet-style head-wobble... how does it all land with you? AIBU, or is it OK to be torn about this?

Rather than viewing this as a chore I would view it as your dad's legacy, kindness and love for family continuing. Just set up a monthly direct debit and it won't take much maintenance,

Do you have kids?

That would be a complicating factor if you and your dad both die and the cousins have to act as executors.

If you're gone, you don't need the money, fine.

But if you have kids, you want it directed towards them, not the uncle.

If you don't have kids, I think it's much more straight forwards. Your dad sounds like a good man and wants to look after people once he's got. Let him die happy that that is what he is doing.

I would then set up a monthly direct debit and think no more about it. Or put a lump sum in a trust and set up the cousins as trustees. They can therefore bear the mental load of dishing out money to him when he needs it / making sure he doesn't gamble it away.

As he has not been a presence in your life, I would make this a fairly small amount and I would not feel guilty about it.

How much is your dad's estate likely to be?

Your father needs to grow a backbone - he either provides for his brother or openly chooses not to. He is putting you in a position of either being guilt tripped into managing his brother, or being the baddie, so that he can depart as the benevolent, blameless one. Do not allow yourself to be put in this position.

Dad wants me to put my needs first, and only if there's money I don't 'need', then to use it for my uncle

That's all very well, @twentyoneteacups, but the difficulty is that your uncle's likely to take a very different approach and obseving the "wishes" is likely to create ongoing angst

I agree with so many PPs who've said to explain all this to your dad and recommend either leaving a lump sum - which will doubtless be wasted - or just laying this on someone else

“Dad wants me to put my needs first”

Maybe financially, yes, but his ‘wishes’ are playing pretty fast and loose with your need not to be saddled with responsibility for a feckless uncle you barely know.

His ‘wishes’ burden you with the emotional and administrative stress of dealing with his brother’s finances and wellbeing in perpetuity, which would be a hell of an ask even if he was someone you were close to.

Agree with others you need to discuss with your dad. If it’s that important to him, he needs to put a sum in trust to be administered by one of your cousins, or another family member closer to the brother in question. No way should this be landing on your doorstep, it’s very unfair to make you feel duty bound to deal with it.

If your Dad dies and there is spare money you could buy an annuity in your uncle’s name with the money you feel is reasonable for him to have. Then an insurer will pay him the monthly stipend for his remaining life and you don’t need to do anything else.

Dad has said that if I need money from his estate, I should put that need first. But if I don't,…

I’d make sure you do ‘need’ the money and I would have absolutely no qualms about keeping it from the brother.

If you have children or are planning to then you could say your priority is your children, not an old man who has spent his life gambling away other people's money and being selfish.

If you don't have children then you could say you don't want to parent an old man! Ask your dad why he cares more about his selfish brother than you, his child. Is the letter of wishes legally binding?

Yes to this totally , no way should you take responsibility for this man , and it would be a responsibility because there would be a lot more than his finances that you would become involved with over time.

That is a load of crap. If he wants a trust arrangement he needs to put that in his will. The letter of wishes is unworkable because how your "needs" are defined are vastly open to interpretation. Some people might think their needs are met if they have a roof over their head and bread and water. Others would think needs include a nice house, car finance and a holiday every year.

If you don't want to challenge your dad on this, then when the time comes you'll have to decide what works for you. I think I would allocate a lump sum I felt comfortable with and let uncle get on with it, he can set up his own trust if he wants to honour your dad's wishes.

I personally would count mental wellbeing under 'need'. If when the time comes remember that your mental wellbeing is also a need and treat the situation accordingly.

I don’t mean to be horrible here but here goes…

Often the reason the women are left to do the cleanup is because they allow themselves to take on the caretaking role. Many single men who are able to take care of themselves will revert to a mother child relationship if a woman comes into the picture and accepts his behaviour. We see this with relationships on these boards all the time, this may not be a romantic one but it’s still a male/female dynamic stereotype.

You need to be assertive and say frankly you will not be the carer to this Uncle of yours and it’s up to your dad to set up a trust that automatically pays him. You need to ‘woman up’ my lovely and not accept or be guilted into it.

It depends on the sums.

If he’s renting an annex then he can claim rent from the government - anything you give him will be counted as income and he will reduce any benefits:

His care will be taken care of by the government.

Depends in how much you are thinking here and what the pot adds up to - it could be a holiday with his family each year, or you could set up a bills account and pay his electricity bill, my uncle did this for my grandad - so he didn’t worry about the cost.

You could set up similar for a phone or gas - these things run themselves! You keep the account topped up by monthly DD.

You could for example have a Munzo account from which he buys food or holiday etc or even just fun money each month.

Been around a similar situation and fair play to your dad for making a will and not putting his brother in it.
People can get very ‘misty eyed’ when making wills and have all sorts of wishes, often based on emotional pull rather than practical needs.
You are the sole beneficiary and that’s pretty clear.
This is my advice and may sound harsh, but when your dad is no longer here, it is entirely up to you what you do.
If you set yourself as your uncle’s benefactor, he will come back again and again. It’s who he is.
But he walked away from his own brother and your family. He has no right once your dad has passed to ask for anything.
Your dad in his own way just wants to be generous, but at the end of the day, when his estate passed to you, it’s yours. It is yours to do with and manage as you see fit. You are his daughter.
I would probably see a solicitor for advice just to go through the will and this letter to see exactly where you stand.
And then I’d park it.
Let your uncle carry on being him because he clearly doesn’t care who he steals from and who he hurts.

@thebignewtvsbroken I don't have kids, no.

I do, however, have a young man in my life who was once my stepson, and who I've been considering in my own financial planning for the future.

As of right now, he's who I'll be leaving my own estate to should I die, although I appreciate that's not as direct and uncompromisingly clear as if he were my own child.

Your "need" could be the nest egg the inheritance can afford you for your retirement, not just immediate needs. As that is ALL you will get from that wealthy side of the family.

@twentyoneteacups has your mum already passed? My only thing is if she has - this is their joint life’s work that you would be inheriting and then the audacity to ask to financially prop up some work shy shyster who’s only working now in his 60s out of desperation as everyone has had enough of his entitled behaviour would really upset me.

he didn’t approve of your mum and stopped any effort at relationships with his brother and his brothers family yet your dad wants to ads this burden to you.

if you can I’d tell your dad you love him but you’d rather he just left your uncle some money so you don’t need contact with him or any involvement going forward. If he blows it - that’s his problem. Frankly there is always benefit system to fall back on after that or some other sucker in the family.

I know a few people, my df included, who have ridiculous wishes that they want their family to carry out after death.
My attitude is if the wishes are going to cause me unnecessary pressure or upset then I won’t be following them.
If you ask someone to execute your will then it should be simple, efficient and above all fair.

@TheCatterall no, my mum's still alive, but my parents are divorced, and she and I no longer have a relationship. I don't even know where she is at the moment.

Surely you can just claim you need the majority of the money yourself. Then offer him some kind of peppercorn sum like £200 a year, just so your dad's wish is being adhered to, to an extent.
I don't think your dad's estate should pay for this blokes care fees. That's too much. He has done nothing for himself or the family in his entire life. So the state will have to fund it.

I voted YABU - not because I think you should support the brother, but because in all of this you sound very lacking in your own sense of agency. You have a right to say no to this, do not feel you have to follow anything you don't want to.

I suspect the uncle will develop a sudden interest in you once you inherit, OP, and be pestering for help from what he’ll se as ‘his brother’s money’. Ask your dad to set up a trust or annuity and make it clear this is all he’s to have.
Though if it’s not enough for a world cruise as you said earlier it all seems rather a worry over nothing. That sort of money will disappear soon enough on your needs.

I wouldn’t. Either say to your dad that you would rather any such arrangement is informal as uncle or cousins may cause trouble based on the letter of wishes or just ignore it when the time comes. As you say, “needs” could mean anything and I doubt the uncle would bother to go to court (or get anywhere if he did).

Just tell your dad sorry but you’ve got enough going on in your own life without sorting a grown man’s finances……assuming you have children or will have children at some point too just tell him you do not have the time nor do you want to be his babysitter……..

I haven’t read the whole thread, so I’m sure I’m not the first person to point this out, but as well as saddling you with all of the financial care, your DF is also ensuring that your uncle will constantly be nagging at you for the rest of your life. He’s going to see the will, or at least discover what’s in it. And I suspect his assessment of the importance of his ‘needs’ versus your needs will be vastly different. I think he’ll feel entitled to know the ins and outs of your spending so he can judge whether or not you really need something or whether you should be handing the cash over to him so he can live the sort of life he was previously accustomed to.

It’s all such a woolly arrangement and open to complete interpretation. What happens if you need it all, and give him nothing? Or give him less than he felt he needed? Will he attempt legal action? I mean, he might not have a chance of winning, but if he gets a solicitor who’s willing to take his cash, you’ll be faced with so much extra aggravation you just don’t need.

In your shoes, I’d tell your DF your concerns and that, if he wants to leave a trust for your uncle, he needs to get that set up, rather than rely on his brother being sensible and not money grabbing.