Is it really that wrong to want for your country what Trump stands for?

[Anniedash]

I know that there are plenty of threads on Trump at the moment, but most of them are designed to rubbish the guy. That’s been done to death in the last 10 years.

He has still won two presidential elections so perhaps it’s time to move the discussion on a bit.Let’s put aside Trump’s personality, bluster, and whether he will deliver or not, for a second.

Is it really so wrong and bad to want to go for what his core message is? Why is the far right label used so liberally and will we ever see a government in this country which can tackle this madness -

A stop to or huge reduction in illegal immigration

Putting your own country first ahead of internationalism. It’s not a novel idea and certainly not a byword for automatically wanting war. In fact Trump’s argument is that war is bad

Saying no the climate hysteria. Climate change is real but climate emergency seems to be a made up concept to simply tax people to death to re distribute taxes to government lobbyists. Why should people accept being poorer in the name of this dangerous ideology

Putting a stop to woke madness. When did it become ok for state sponsored mutilation of children? Men pretending to be women in prison and hospitals getting access to women’s spaces. People being sanctioned do not using the correct pronouns

Driving the economy forward and putting a stop to endless freebies for those who have no intention of contributing to the system and refuse to work because they are sad.

The fact that someone as eccentric as Trump has to fly the flag for common sense ideas shows you just how batshit the political discourse has become.

Who is “upset”, “middle class”, a “twat” and “obnoxious”?

He did not.

For all the things I quite like about Trump, he is a massive step into the unknown.

He is crass and unpresidential.
He is creating an oligarchy around him, with the slightly psychotic Musk being oligarch in chief.
He has just freed a bunch of far right hooligans convicted of real and serious crimes, including violent crime.
Some of his rhetoric is scarily similar to Hitler’s.
He has generally appointed poorly qualified yes men into supporting positions of power.

Now, if I were suffering full Trump Derangement Syndrome, I would be sure he was trying to do a full fascist takeover. I’m not sure-but it is a risk. Maybe a lot of what he says is a negotiating position and ‘transactional’ as people love to say. But what if it isn’t? He has created an apparatus around him which could enable him to do a lot of harm.

So, much as I enjoy seeing the liberal elite being given a fit of the vapours, I think it is a dangerous time.

Seems a global truism, left-wing, liberal, more prgressive politics tend to do better with better educated people.

Why that is would be interesting to see.

Opening up more places for drilling for oil. Removing women from their commands in the forces.
Pardoning the 6th January insurrectionists...

Not really. Look at US history this is fairly consistent. It’s only been a democracy for about 60/70 years.

But that’s what they voted for. Not my circus, not my monkeys.

Pardonning 1,500 rioters is a “win”?

I did enjoy him also saying those who attacked police officers had been punished enough.

I guess we can finally accept Blue Lives Don’t Matter! 😂

I've not read the whole thread and it looks like it has unsurprisingly turned into bit of a bunfight, but OP I don't disagree with you.

Things in the UK and Europe are absolute shit. Unapologetic managed decline. I've never been anti-immigration but the sheer numbers are not sustainable. Every day there's another news story about how middle earners are going to be further shafted to pay for it all.
Housing shortages, interest rates up, cost of living crises.... and no glimmer of hope at all from Starmer or the Labour party.

No wonder voters saw the opportunity for something different, something positive, and grasped it with both hands.

How it will turn out in practice, I have no idea, but I totally understand people wanting a bit of hope.

It’s funny because without US immigration Trump would not be in the US (being the grandchild of 4 immigrants) and would not have 2/3 of his wives!

Watch the video.

Your point is assinine.

Surely the answer is somewhere in between. Trump says many attractive things and that is why he is elected. I wish we could have some of the positivity and optimism that he is projecting over here in the UK- a drive for people to work together to make the country more prosperous, instead of the dreary British handwringing and dependency on state handouts.

But, Trump has said and done terrible things. He may do more terrible things.

The problem with all of the discourse is that it is all so black and white. He is not pure good and he is not pure evil. It is more complicated and nuanced than that.

Oh yeah! Your right. He did strip women of their reproductive right to choose over their own body . Leading to scores of women dying from birth complications. And he did imprison those children - literally putting them in cages.
It's quite mad to me that you act as if he these horrendous things never happened. And Trump is just a blustery guy.

Exactly!! How often do Yanks comment on Britain, how often was Trump having twitter strops over Sadiq Khan?!

Err what about the rape charge?

Not thanks

It’s a ridiculous system totally abused by all.

What does he stand for? Whatever suits his own self interest at that moment. He ran for president to stay out of jail.
The best description I’ve heard of Trump is that he’s the embodiment of the seven deadly sins.

OK - I'm gonna start up with the sticky point. He only won one popular election- 2024. In 2016 he "won" because of the Electoral College system. Hilary Clinton won the popular vote.
Is what he wants so bad - yes. He is a cheat and a liar. Also a convicted criminal.
The biggest drain on public funds are corporations not people.
I'm just going to touch on one more point. Missing children - many of those 'unidentifiable' children were taken into the foster care system and were adopted. Biden kept those who entered with their families.

reduction in illegal immigration

You do know that the majority of the country is populated by illegal immigrants who siezed it from the indigenous peoples?

I just can't get on board with anything you're saying because it's churning out the media rhetoric where actual facts are lost in the name of sensationalism. Sorry.

My memories seem to be different to many. I recall Trump had America booming before COVID hit. All countries took a downturn then. I don't recall Trump taking America to war. Despite before his first term in office the hysteria about him being a war monger. It was under Obama the US went to war with Iraq.

This 👆 and as for your narrow minded comment about people who don’t contribute anything to society “just because they’re sad”. Clinical Depression is a major cause of death amongst otherwise healthy adults. It is a very distressing condition that ruins lives and damages the children of those suffering from it!

Excuse me - Bush #2 was president when aggression against Iraq started, March 20, 2003. Six months after 9-11.
Obama was president from 2008-2016.

You lost me at "climate hysteria" then again for good at "woke madness".

People keep presenting him as this incredible win and representative of the vast majority of Americans. As you point out this is the first time he won the popular vote and even then with fewer than 50% of votes.

The country is split down the middle.

@Anniedash

He did win two elections but only one the popular vote once on less than 50% of the electorate.

As for : A stop to or huge reduction in illegal immigration

He did not do this in 2016 so why do you think he will manage it now?

I’m guessing she’s American. It’ll be Fox News!