Tony Blair says we need a national conversation about MH as its costing too much

[B0xes]

Tony Blair said recently on Jimmy's Jobs of the Future Podcast (clip available on youtube) that we need to have a national conversation about mental health. Why are we spending so much on it. Why are people self diagnosing. He believes people are being encouraged to view everyday challenges we all face as mental health issues.

Is he being unreasonable? In one sense, I'm inclined to agree to an extent, in the other, I believe he led the charge for so many of the social changes that have made us less resilient and many of these issues are due to individualism which led to atomisation and loneliness and being encouraged to see the market as the entity that fulfills our needs rather than strong families and robust social networks.

YABU - Blair can do one.

YANBU - He might have a point

It's a tough one. Like with everything people will use mental health as an excuse not to be able to do things. I suffer with mine and have done terribly since loosing babies. I've also worked a lot with services to try and get better. I've never missed a day at work because of it even though at times I've felt like it. I feel like in coming out of the other side of it now apart from where the ptsd is concerned but this is sporadic so I can live with it.

My partner struggles from childhood trauma and likely adhd but refuses to be tested. Our young daughter is struggling terribly. We need help. I hope we can get it.

I think the only real root out of capitalism is to create our own little parallel societies that people can apply to opt into. The Amish have been great at this.

No. And I don't want to stop work. I love my job and it's great for my mental health.

But having a diagnosis gives me access to extra support in the areas I struggle with. At the moment, I would have to pay for that, which I can't afford to do (as the autism means I can only work part-time).

As someone with multiple, diagnosed MH issues and who is currently on the pathway to being diagnosed with autism, he can fuck off, quite frankly.

^

What difference will an autism diagnosis actually make though?

There’s certainly been a severe lack of political responsibility IMHO.

Absolutely. And every thread where someone is a bit of a dick is accompanied by an army of comments “is he depressed?” “is he autistic?” “Does he have ADHD?”

Some people are just dicks. Why is there this constant seeking to label people and excuse away behaviour under said label.

Of course it's a positive thing that there is no longer a stigma attached to mental health, years ago people would be scared they'd get sent to a mental asylum.

The problem is it's gone too far the other way. Everyone at some time in their life is susceptible to mental health problems but the answer to that is to work to overcome it with the help of counsellors if needed so that they can get back to living a happy fulfilling life. Avoidance us the worse thing for anxiety. It doesn't help solve the root of the problem.

I honestly think giving children the tools to help control anxiety practising relaxation etc should be on the national curriculum.

He's got a point.

I entirely sympathise with people who have genuine, complex mental health problems. But I also think, sadly, that talking about mental health has become so widespread that there are a lot of people who use it as an excuse to justify poor behaviour, or get out of doing things they don't want to do.

Some people seem to let their mental health problems become such a part of their core identity that they don't actually have any interest in getting better and living a normal life. And the concept of 'mental resilience' seems to have entirely disappeared.

I genuinely don’t understand (sorry skim reading on lunch break)
skewing the stats? But the stats are the stats? 3.3 million as of this month, with 1 in 6 only in paid employment

thats 2.8 million out of work on pip, doing no kind of work

There’s 40.5million estimated ‘adults’ in the uk, therefore 1 in 16 over 18’s are on PIP and not working whatsoever

Who is going to pay for all these people who are out of work because of increasing mental health problems?
I'm fine because I worked hard (in a job involving psychiatry) and could afford a decent life for my children and, now, a decent life.
I pay my taxes and so, now, do my DC and their spouses.
But the fewer people that can work because of Covid, the government, whatever means there are fewer people who can pay taxes.
Where will the money come from?

Of course it is. I've volunteered at a food bank, I know I have a level of privilege that I've never needed to have to use one.

Blair clearly is significantly more privileged than any of us on here and so I don't believe he has any real concept of the issues.

Well, given the government could afford to spend millions of pounds during COVID on "hospitals" and whatever, I'm sure they could come up with something.

He’s not talking about people like you.

What support would it entitle to you that you can’t get without a diagnosis? Just interested
as There’s no medication for autism, just coping strategies and therapy, which you can self refer for anyway?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/adhd-diagnoses-risk-ignoring-potential-76chz99qc?utm_

It seems like every man and his dog these days is after a 'diagnosis'

3 year old child won't sit still?

Autistic.

Can't organise your life?

ADHD.

I don't think we are doing ourselves any favours whatsoever here

It's just making excuses for the realities of life

So you seem uncomfortable with the question "Has he a diagnosis?" in relation to behaviour.
How do you feel these annoying behaviours?
(a) Your partner starts to have a short fuse, seems irritable and ignores what you say, you think they are not pulling their weight.
(b) A teenager starts sleeping through their alarm, starts missing school, complains of stress headaches but is miraculously normal again once they have sat up and got out of bed.
(c) A work colleague seems to have stopped speaking to you as much, and often gazes into space when you speak to them and seems a little lacklustre and lazy.
Would the diagnosis of brain tumour (a) and (b) and epilepsy (c) be a help or a hindrance?

This is it, there isn’t any more money. Hence why the govt are (I had better say allegedly) planning to cut the welfare bill.

I think Blair has a pont, but much as I utterly loathe the man I don't think any of his policies are particularly to blame.

Rather that society - for whatever reason - has for some time been raising children and young adults with very little resilience and an inablilty or reluctance to face certain everyday challenges without seemingly falling to pieces.

It's an american book but I'd recommend anybody interested in this apparent phenomenon to read "The Coddling of the American Mind" by Greg Lukianoff and Jonathan Haidt. In fact I'd recommend anything by Jonathan Haidt

@@MyLadyGreensleeves

Or how about vascular dementia (a), ADHD (b) and clinical depression (c)?

It gives me access to support that's currently inaccessible to me - the main two being certain kinds of therapy on the NHS and self-employment support for the things I struggle with. I currently can't afford to pay for either as my mental health and autism both mean I cannot cope with working full-time...

5 in 6 people on pip are out of work because more people who are out of work apply for PIP than people who are in work.

For example, let's take someone with autism and adhd. They are in full time employment and so, although their MH is terrible, they don't apply for PIP as they have sufficient money to survive and pay for therapy.

They find themselves out of work due to autistic burnout so they decide to apply for PIP so that they can continue to pay for therapy and hopefully re-enter the workplace in the future.

Not sure why that is difficult to understand?

Vascular dementia has a quite specific physical cause, it’s not a mental illness, nor is Alzheimer’s.

I think the language of mental illness has leached into general discourse with terrible consequences for the general population.

Makes no difference to what I’m saying.
pip claimant rates are rising (at an enormous level, each year) not going down
so your argument makes no sense whatsoever
the figures are the figures. Not that hard to understand, either :)