13 years, mortgage, 2 kids... No proposal!?

[Faith27]

Hi, super new here, just after some advice..
Been with my partner 13 years in April. We have 2 wonderful children. It's never been a secret that I want to get married. He's always said he'd "never say never" or "yh one day* ..
3 years ago a random, chilled, no pressure, marriage discussion happened. The end response from him... "I don't want to get married, I don't see the point in it!" ... Would anyone else be furious??? :(
We are off to Paris for our 13 years together anniversary in April.. which I planned! He never says he loves me first, never a cuddle or a kiss unless I get one from him myself. But he can be kind and makes me a cup of tea every morning and helps with chores, he pays all the bills. But he's the most unromantic person ever! :( he says he's happy when I've asked. I Just feel lost and lonely and wish for the ultimate romantic gesture from him. What would you do?.
Will he ever propose?? Xx

I think @blubberyboo meant why did you spend your savings on maternity leave instead of the DC father contributing?

I think you need to ask your dp why he won't marry you, this leaving you feeling unloved, vulnerable and literally vulnerable financially. It's not grabby or selfish to want to be more equal considering how much unpaid labour you do looking after his children and household.

And mothers have the sole legal right to do that.
A father can petition the courts and they usually then double barrel but its always the mothers choice what name goes on the birth certificate.

OP, he's not a good man.
He let you run down your savings for mat leave while he has loads of savings?

He's scum.
Only mean scum do that.
If you had an ounce of self esteem you wouldn't have sold yourself so short.

Focus on being financially independent because he is not a good decent man.

Are you doing the majority of household duties and childcare?

Stop doing any wife work for him.
Stop doing laundry.
Think of what you are modelling to your children and what you want them to see.

Don't rely on him.
Him allowing you to run down your savings says EVERYTHING about the type of loser he is.
Scum.

A proposal is not the only way to show romance. You've known he is not romantic for 13 years - why didn't you bail years ago? Why have two children with him? I don't understand why people who want to get married go ahead and have children first. I know quite a few people who had children first and none of them are married years and years later. (Well one did get married but that was to make it easier to live in their partner's home country for a while.) I know a lot more who got married and then had children.

A 'proposal' wouldn't mean anything and I don't understand why women put such unrealistic importance around them.
He could plan out the proposal you want, keep you happy for a few more years, and still never have any intention of marrying you. It is literally for social media these days.
What grown ups should do is discuss marriage and go do if it is something you both want to do. If marriage is important to you, bypass the excuses about not being able to afford the wedding you want ie big party, and do the bit that is most important. At least then you know if he ever had/has any intention of marrying you

He thinks him paying the mortgage for a house that's signed 50/50 is enough. I do the everything else, cooking, cleaning washing school runs etc. He's does help if I ask though.

Ok so if he doesn't want to marry a different approach would be to ask him to ensure your equal financial stability through paying into a pension for you and replacing a fair share of the savings that you spent on maternity leave. Fair share of childcare costs and sharing the load of housework etc to enable you to make a strong success of your business. Naming you in his will (less impactful as it can be changed)

He might not believe in marriage but given he seems to be good with money he surely should see the benefit of the mother of his kids being financially secure.

His response to all of this will be the answer you need. If he loves you he'd want you to have some security. If he gaslights and belittles this then you know he's hoarding his resources as his money is more important than you are. And maybe he doesn't expect to be around forever

Is it a wedding he doesn't want? Would he consider a civil partnership? It gives you all the legal protection a marriage does but feels less like an event.

Ask him for a civil partnership?

Tell him you don't want a marriage but you want to be protected with a civil partnership.
Make it sound less romantic but more formal

I had this conversation with my DP of 13 years yesterday. He is against marriage, hates a fuss, and isn’t romantic. I’m not particularly bothered either, but as we’re getting older and have reached the age where freak illnesses can certainly happen, I told him it’s time we had some legal protection so our assets can be accessed upon death and to be legal next of kin if caring duties or medical decisions need to be made. Our finances are scattered and not particularly straightforward so it makes it all easier. I suggested a civil partnership with no fuss - Gretna Green or something. He said he’d be okay with that. Maybe your partner would feel similar? Or is it the big white wedding you’re after?

You have two main issues here and this is the big one, you are not financially equal and you should be. Marriage would help with this.

The other issue is the romance bit. I’m not romantic so would hate the idea of a big wedding. I don’t think he is being unreasonable if he doesn’t want to marry for romantic reasons and it’s up to you how important that is.

But if he doesn’t want to marry for legal issues you have a bigger issue if he’s not financially supporting you which it doesn’t sound like he is.

Ask him if he’ll do it for you then. If he’s not bothered either way.

I wouldn’t have kids unless married as not enough protection legally. You need to get this sorted.

propose in Paris?

Ask him to make a formal agreement that covers all of the financial security a marriage would otherwise give you.

If he refuses then you know where you stand.

Unfortunately it sounds like the romance ship has sailed, I’m very sorry to say. Anyway, it’s hard to feel romantic in a relationship that has a massive power imbalance.

Wow he’s not a keeper really though is he. I mean he got you pregnant, you used up your savings on growing his children and now you’re the free childcare.

He doesn’t want to marry you for financial reasons, never mind about romantic reasons.

I spent all my savings on mat leave. I have a pathetic pension

What man lets his partner during pregnancy expect her to finance it?! Awful.

Why would he propose? He’s got all the benefits of having a wife already with none of the downside.

What you’re describing here isn’t about a proposal. The proposal and marriage won’t revive your relationship. This is a relationship that isn’t fulfilling you and that’s what you need to work on with him.

Not everyone is a hugger, even with their loved ones. Can you accept him the way he is or do you need him to change? The spoiler: he can’t change who he is.

I get no money if anything happens to him. He's put all his funds in the kids names.

Why don’t you have joint savings ? You shouldn’t be using all your money while he’s sat on a pile.

This is your answer. He won’t marry you because he doesn’t want to risk his pension and savings and this way it keeps you financially reliant on him.

This is the bit you need to sort out. Not the lack of romantic proposal. Explain to him how financially unequal your relationship is because you did this without the security of marriage.

Consider why you’d want to marry someone like this. You deserve better!

How do you know money is in the kids names and what does this mean?

He’s with you. He’s had children with you. Getting married doesn’t make it romantic or more loving. God only knows the number of posts on here that demonstrate that is the case, including one just the other day where people were sharing stories about how they forced other halves to get married and how it then ruined the relationship. My best friend left a good relationship because her boyfriend just didn’t see the point of getting married and two failed marriages later she regrets that decision.

be careful what you push for and what you imagine this might give you

One thing I would say, though, is that having wills in place and agreements around money, etc is important. You need to know where you stand financially.