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Brilliant article about the rape gangs in the UK

1000 replies

Petrine · 08/01/2025 10:07

I’ve put this on AIBU as it appears to be most read. A brilliant article about the rape gangs and the ensuing cover up.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/07/elon-musk-has-ripped-cloak-of-deceit-off-britain-scandal/

OP posts:
Thread gallery
17
foodforclouds · 08/01/2025 22:17

PaterPower · 08/01/2025 22:09

No, but I’ll see if I can find it if it’s worth a watch?

It really is worth it. It’s many years old now, but it goes through what happened that turned the mirror from a respected newspaper to something like a tabloid

HappyPanda613 · 08/01/2025 22:17

BananaAppleOrange · 08/01/2025 22:15

By locking up every who disagrees with him you mean?

It’s a start. The only way to put a stop to this madness is to show just how serious this government is about disinformation.

But ultimately, banning X and Facebook needs to be a priority at this point. We may even need an alternative social media that is better regulated to deal with hate speech and propoganda, and that is linked to people’s real identities.

OneAmberFinch · 08/01/2025 22:17

foodforclouds · 08/01/2025 22:05

They’re spreading propaganda. My guess is they’re on someone’s payroll

Attention online propaganda outfits: If anyone reading this wants to pay me for my efforts, get in touch! I need a house deposit...

C8H10N4O2 · 08/01/2025 22:18

HappyPanda613 · 08/01/2025 16:34

Applying the law without fear or favour is simply not possible in a pluralistic society. There are always going to be communities and identity groups that need greater protections from the dominant culture and that’s just how it is.

Yes absolutely and the group most in need of those protections are low status girls perceived by adult males (and pick me females) as accessable and unimportant. This is an orgnised crime of sex and class - the male sex class across every category has organised criminal abusers within its ranks.

These girls should absoltuly be protected from the dominant male culture which will find any excuse to make themselves victims to evade justice whilst abusing their victims.

Police (seen as conservative), social workers (seen as MC liberals), labour politicians, conservative politicians, liberal politicians have all been culpable in enabling and covering up the crimes of male violence against young, low status girls.

The common factors are "adult male abusers" and "low status girls". They prey on girls who are seen as disposable, whom noone will fight for or who have no powerful advocates. In Rotherham the abusers were substantially ethnic South Asian and whilst many of the victims were white, many were also ethnic South Asian girls who have been largely ignored and who face additional stigmas if they speak up (as per PP and Southall Black Sisters over the years). In other areas the grooming gangs are predominantly white and again prey on girls seen as "accessible".

The common factors are 1) men using their power to organise and profit from abuse of children 2) children who are not important enough to other men or professionals to merit even basic duty of care

Its shameful all round and rather trying to stop people talking about it we should be using it to promote the stories of other victims as well. Perhaps you could talk about why convicted sex offenders were allowed to return to the same area sharing the same streets as their victims instead of being required to move away or how the community could shun these predators (who in the case of Rotherham have broken Islaamic law as well as state law).

BIossomtoes · 08/01/2025 22:18

BananaAppleOrange · 08/01/2025 22:15

By locking up every who disagrees with him you mean?

By locking up a mob of baying rioters calling for blood you mean? I bet you’d have been very happy with that if they’d been outside your house with the petrol and matches.

BananaAppleOrange · 08/01/2025 22:19

Bernardscheesyhat · 08/01/2025 22:16

Have you been locked up then?

Fortunately It takes more than your wishful thinking.

BananaAppleOrange · 08/01/2025 22:21

HappyPanda613 · 08/01/2025 22:17

It’s a start. The only way to put a stop to this madness is to show just how serious this government is about disinformation.

But ultimately, banning X and Facebook needs to be a priority at this point. We may even need an alternative social media that is better regulated to deal with hate speech and propoganda, and that is linked to people’s real identities.

Nothing like a good bit of censorship to help your authoritarianism on its way.

Stefanodad · 08/01/2025 22:23

I can’t believe what I’m reading on here these last few days. So much racism it’s shocking.

No one thinks any of these crimes were okay except real sickos. These acts are absolutely miles away from any kind of acceptability for any religion. If a politician of any persuasion could make crimes like these stop then would do. To use mass rape to ideologically and retrospectively sling mud is, in my opinion, an insult to the women affected by these horrible and scandalous events. Serious journalism and efforts to hold institutions to account is to be welcomed.

if you are right wing, anti- Islam or anti-migration then whatever, fine, you are entitled to that. But don’t embarrass yourself, and do the victims a disservice by pretending that sexual crime is somehow imported or that you are helping women by trying to blame random other groups of people. The research is clear on this stuff (see the UCL study linked yesterday) and gang sexual violence it’s NOT a race thing. Have we already forgotten who the perpetrators were in the Pelicot crimes?

Shame on all of you racists. I’m proud to be of the left. One world, one love. Down with the patriarchy.

GeneralPeter · 08/01/2025 22:32

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/01/2025 17:45

Yes. We know this. Men rape. It isn't relevant to these specific gangs. It is whataboutery.

Most crime is not rape. So you shouldn’t be smearing men with your talk of male perpetrators. You are just trying to distract from the bigger issue of crime. Which is committed by people.

(Obviously I don’t actually mean the above. But that’s the same logic as yours. When we found abuse in the Catholic Church, we (belatedly) asked what was wrong with that culture and institution. Ditto the BBC. Ditto the Church of England. Ditto ditto ditto. That’s not whataboutery, that’s necessary to understand and root out the problem. Plenty of people wanted to deflect criticism in those cases onto a wider target too. The Catholic Church used to say that the rot was really in wider society and it was offensive to single them out, for example. I hoped we had learned better, but clearly not).

C8H10N4O2 · 08/01/2025 22:33

Mirabai · 08/01/2025 12:54

Andrew Norfolk is the reporter who broke the story in the media.

There were key women including 2 abuse survivors and Jayne Senior who ran Risky Business and Labour MP Ann Cryer who were fundamental to him even having a story to report. Ann Cryer’s speech was what first alerted him to the story.

Prof Jay’s contribution in the form of a report in 2014 was also key as was female MP Sarah Champion’s.

Julie Bindel also wrote about it in the mid 2000s, Private Eye were covering the story about Rotherham and other areas at around the same time and have convered grooming gangs pretty regularly in the time since. A number of womens groups have been campaigning on the issue for decades

Andrew Norfolk has never claimed to be "the first" - quite the opposite. He was the journalist who managed to get front page coverage and The Times was the first main paper to publish (according to Bindel the Guardian refused to publish the story which meant her work was published in lower circulation places).

Nazir Afzal was the prosecutor who fought to get these crimes taken more seriously and change some of the horrendous experiences of victims during the process - and risked his career to do so.

There have been many people talking about this and trying to bring about change but crimes against "disposable girls" by men face too many vested interests and are diluted and forgotten about as soon as the noise quietens. So if this round of publicity makes a difference then I'm all for it but I suspect it will fizzle out like all the others.

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:33

Usernamenope · 08/01/2025 21:32

The racism by some people on this thread targeting Pakistanis and Muslims is absolutely disgusting and I'm shocked MN hasn't closed it down.

It's right to be horrified by the abuse of women and girls, but obviously if you are not equally arguing that the huge number of drunken white men who beat up their partners when their football team loses or the abuse of kids by peadophile priests needs to be urgently tackled, then yeah you are just racist.

Identifying someone’s race is not racism. There is clearly some interaction between race/ ethnicity, religion and society driving the phenomenon of rape gangs targeting vulnerable white children. Why are Pakistani men disproportionately involved? As I keep saying this is a small subsection of one ethnic minority, if the factors involved are not investigated then it will keep happening. Multiculturalism is dead if we cannot discuss difficult matters without people pointing fingers and making accusations to shut the conversation down. This is a thread about a specific problem, it is not about Football fan DV. Stop deliberately trying to derail it.

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:35

C8H10N4O2 · 08/01/2025 22:33

Julie Bindel also wrote about it in the mid 2000s, Private Eye were covering the story about Rotherham and other areas at around the same time and have convered grooming gangs pretty regularly in the time since. A number of womens groups have been campaigning on the issue for decades

Andrew Norfolk has never claimed to be "the first" - quite the opposite. He was the journalist who managed to get front page coverage and The Times was the first main paper to publish (according to Bindel the Guardian refused to publish the story which meant her work was published in lower circulation places).

Nazir Afzal was the prosecutor who fought to get these crimes taken more seriously and change some of the horrendous experiences of victims during the process - and risked his career to do so.

There have been many people talking about this and trying to bring about change but crimes against "disposable girls" by men face too many vested interests and are diluted and forgotten about as soon as the noise quietens. So if this round of publicity makes a difference then I'm all for it but I suspect it will fizzle out like all the others.

I really hope not

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:37

GeneralPeter · 08/01/2025 22:32

Most crime is not rape. So you shouldn’t be smearing men with your talk of male perpetrators. You are just trying to distract from the bigger issue of crime. Which is committed by people.

(Obviously I don’t actually mean the above. But that’s the same logic as yours. When we found abuse in the Catholic Church, we (belatedly) asked what was wrong with that culture and institution. Ditto the BBC. Ditto the Church of England. Ditto ditto ditto. That’s not whataboutery, that’s necessary to understand and root out the problem. Plenty of people wanted to deflect criticism in those cases onto a wider target too. The Catholic Church used to say that the rot was really in wider society and it was offensive to single them out, for example. I hoped we had learned better, but clearly not).

Well said. The accusations of racism and whataboutery are staggering. Anything to stuff the issue back in a box and hide it away.

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:40

Stefanodad · 08/01/2025 22:23

I can’t believe what I’m reading on here these last few days. So much racism it’s shocking.

No one thinks any of these crimes were okay except real sickos. These acts are absolutely miles away from any kind of acceptability for any religion. If a politician of any persuasion could make crimes like these stop then would do. To use mass rape to ideologically and retrospectively sling mud is, in my opinion, an insult to the women affected by these horrible and scandalous events. Serious journalism and efforts to hold institutions to account is to be welcomed.

if you are right wing, anti- Islam or anti-migration then whatever, fine, you are entitled to that. But don’t embarrass yourself, and do the victims a disservice by pretending that sexual crime is somehow imported or that you are helping women by trying to blame random other groups of people. The research is clear on this stuff (see the UCL study linked yesterday) and gang sexual violence it’s NOT a race thing. Have we already forgotten who the perpetrators were in the Pelicot crimes?

Shame on all of you racists. I’m proud to be of the left. One world, one love. Down with the patriarchy.

Right so ALL gang rape in the history of the world, over hundreds and hundreds of years is not race related. According to ONE study. Sometimes I really despair about the lack of critical thought on MN.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/01/2025 22:40

gang sexual violence it’s NOT a race thing.

This particular type of gang sexual violence, across the country and over decades, has common underlying features which are highly relevant. This is one of the greatest safeguarding failures and miscarriages of justice in living memory. So no, you're not going to stop people bringing up these elements where they are relevant.

Lessthanmore · 08/01/2025 22:41

They target white women because of the same reason ISIS targeted Yazidi women.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yazidi_genocide

BananaAppleOrange · 08/01/2025 22:41

There have been many people talking about this and trying to bring about change but crimes against "disposable girls" by men face too many vested interests and are diluted and forgotten about as soon as the noise quietens. So if this round of publicity makes a difference then I'm all for it but I suspect it will fizzle out like all the others.

Given the number of posters on here trying to silence discussion with cries of racism! musk! We must police Pakistani men differently! Far right! It is a right-wing paper! Conspiracy! All men! …

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:42

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/01/2025 22:40

gang sexual violence it’s NOT a race thing.

This particular type of gang sexual violence, across the country and over decades, has common underlying features which are highly relevant. This is one of the greatest safeguarding failures and miscarriages of justice in living memory. So no, you're not going to stop people bringing up these elements where they are relevant.

But listen to the research [pearl clutch]. I mean UCL did a study!! It is beyond parody. Look at the mugshots…..

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/01/2025 22:43

That UCL study was done with a very clear agenda. Lies, damned lies, and statistics eh.

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:44

BananaAppleOrange · 08/01/2025 22:41

There have been many people talking about this and trying to bring about change but crimes against "disposable girls" by men face too many vested interests and are diluted and forgotten about as soon as the noise quietens. So if this round of publicity makes a difference then I'm all for it but I suspect it will fizzle out like all the others.

Given the number of posters on here trying to silence discussion with cries of racism! musk! We must police Pakistani men differently! Far right! It is a right-wing paper! Conspiracy! All men! …

It is bizarre the avalanche of people who would literally rather screw their eyes shut and stick their fingers in their ears, than appraise the facts rationally and dispassionately.

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:44

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/01/2025 22:43

That UCL study was done with a very clear agenda. Lies, damned lies, and statistics eh.

Explain

firef1y · 08/01/2025 22:48

Winter2020 · 08/01/2025 13:53

If you have evidence that children are going into police stations to report being raped and abused by white British men and being turned away then please report it as that would also be scandalous.

At the moment we are talking about children who were let down by the authorities when being abused by Muslim grooming gangs. If you have something to say about other forms of child exploitation why not start a thread.

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/heartbreaking-case-sophie-12-year-24270662

My abusers were all white, British men. I was what would probably br described as lower middle class, my parents were marries and owned their own home. Never had any social services involvement.
But being an undiagnosed autistic I was vulnerable. My abuse was literally swept under the carpet. This was 40 years ago, I don't know but maybe attitudes were different back then. The police took a statement and that was it, I believe we were told that as one of my abusers was.so old it wasn't worth taking it any further. Another, one of the first questions asked was what was I wearing, I was 13 for god sakes (and wearing my school uniform, but like every other girl.in my year my skirt was short).

If the victims of the grooming gangs are anything like me, then they do not want to be used as political point scores. They would much rather that something was quietly done to tackle the abuse perpetrated by men.

And let's not forget that the worst group of paedophiles this country has had are all very deathly. Very influential, white men. Jimmy Saville, Gary Glitter, Golf Harris, Stewart Hall etc al

GeneralPeter · 08/01/2025 22:48

Usernamenope · 08/01/2025 21:32

The racism by some people on this thread targeting Pakistanis and Muslims is absolutely disgusting and I'm shocked MN hasn't closed it down.

It's right to be horrified by the abuse of women and girls, but obviously if you are not equally arguing that the huge number of drunken white men who beat up their partners when their football team loses or the abuse of kids by peadophile priests needs to be urgently tackled, then yeah you are just racist.

Can you knock it off with the religious bigotry please.

It’s right to be horrified by the abuse of children, but if you are mentioning priests without also mentioning abuse in the scout movement and the use of rape in war, then yeah, you are just a religious bigot.

You must not mention one thing without mentioning all other things.

JRSKSSBH · 08/01/2025 22:49

PeppyGreenFinch · 08/01/2025 22:02

What a desperate lie. This is your true face.

Oh what moronic poppycock. It isn’t a lie. You’d rather apologise because another child has been raped than deal in difficult facts.

Stefanodad · 08/01/2025 22:51

The last few contributions are sensible, thanks. I’m not against talking about these crimes in particular or diving into specifics. There are many journalists who have not stopped since they happened.

It’s the random ideological scapegoating of migrants in general or a religion in general or a political party that's upsets me. It smacks of doing the dirty work of powerful people who’d like to decide is.

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