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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Absolutely shit scared about the future in the UK?

649 replies

JDNCh · 04/01/2025 18:17

Name changed - I’m genuinely terrified by the hate, division and atmosphere here right now, online and spilling over on the ‘the real world’. I’m scared by how quickly things are changing, and just how much influence the US/Elon Musk/Reform+supporters are having. I’m scared of what the actual point of it all is - what’s the endgame? And what’s the solution? Why is no one protesting/rising up from the other way? Do people generally agree with all this?

I’m in no way a minority (white, female, 30s), I’m not super left, I have one little boy and I’m so scared for his future. I don’t want to live somewhere so intolerant with this constant atmosphere of distrust and something getting ready to blow.

What’s the general consensus? Is this what the people of the U.K. want?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
20
Justiceeternal · 05/01/2025 02:15

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 01:38

I think a lot of the far right stuff is a knee jerk reaction to the complacency of the left.

Like, look at the Rotherham sex scandal and how quiet the left were. Same with the 1200 sexual assaults on that one NYE in Germany. Even the authorities played it down and the media weren't originally allowed to mention the ethnicity of the attackers.

There are loads of examples like this that aren't widely known, such as the 40 sexual assaults at the We Are Stkhlm music festival, which were perpetrated by a large group of asylum seekers against victims as young as 14yo. Again, the police stated that the event 'went largely with incident' despite the sexual assaults having been reported at the time, and they only started to admit the truth once stories started coming out on social media and questions started being asked.

And if you look at the statistics, there has been an increase in sex crimes which rises with the number of refugees accepted in every European country for which we have the data. A few examples off the top of my head are asylum seekers being responsible for 20% of serious sex crimes including rape in France despite being 1-2% of the population. In another European country (I forget which) recent immigrants were responsible for 50% of gang rapes over a five year period. For anybody interested the figures were from Hirsi Ali's book Prey - I'd post more but my friend has my copy.

There are loads more stats like this yet lefties will often defend these types of men to the death for fear of being seen as a xenophobe.

Not that I agree with all the Tommy Robinson types either. Often it's just an excuse to kick off. However, I think a lot of people don't seem to connect the dots between people arriving from misogynistic cultures and then continuing to act in the manner they were raised. And IME the types of people defending these demographics often aren't living in the areas where they're likely to ever come into contact with them.

I don't think it's hard to see why some people get sucked into this vigilante style of thinking. I mean, imagine your 14yo daughter being sexually assaulted by dozens of men and then seeing the police talking about how the event 'went largely without incident' when you know there were another 40 victims.

Put what you said in ChatGPT and this is what it said:

‘The claim that asylum seekers in France, constituting 1–2% of the population, are responsible for 20% of serious sex crimes, including rape, lacks substantiated evidence. Comprehensive and up-to-date statistical data directly linking asylum seekers to such a disproportionate percentage of these crimes is not readily available…
It’s important to approach such claims with caution, as they can perpetuate harmful stereotypes and misinformation. Without concrete data supporting the assertion that asylum seekers are disproportionately responsible for serious sex crimes in France, such statements remain unverified and potentially misleading’

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 02:15

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 02:12

Lack of decisive evidence is usually the issue in rape cases (with some shocking exceptions obv).

Where were all the feminists when 1200 women were sexually assaulted in one night? You can bet your nelly they'd have been up in arms if the perpetrators had been white males!

How utterly disingenuous. A 99% rate of failure to convict is not down to lack of evidence, it’s down to society victim blaming women and systemic misogyny.

Feminists don’t accept abuse from any group of people, they want all men help accountable for their actions.

lemmein · 05/01/2025 02:16

Getmeonaflight · 04/01/2025 18:56

Far right riots? Oh please. Because starmer said so?

Locally to me they were literally stopping traffic and only allowing white drivers through. What else would you call it?

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 02:17

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 02:14

I think there is a big misogyny problem in Islamic culture and people are too afraid to discuss it. It's possible to criticise a religion/culture without having any issue with the otherwise decent followers.

People are discussing it though. Why are you scared?

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 02:19

Justiceeternal · 05/01/2025 02:15

Put what you said in ChatGPT and this is what it said:

‘The claim that asylum seekers in France, constituting 1–2% of the population, are responsible for 20% of serious sex crimes, including rape, lacks substantiated evidence. Comprehensive and up-to-date statistical data directly linking asylum seekers to such a disproportionate percentage of these crimes is not readily available…
It’s important to approach such claims with caution, as they can perpetuate harmful stereotypes and misinformation. Without concrete data supporting the assertion that asylum seekers are disproportionately responsible for serious sex crimes in France, such statements remain unverified and potentially misleading’

Edited

I’m guessing by Sidhu’s sneering at feminists that he’s a man .

user243245346 · 05/01/2025 02:21

mollyfolk · 04/01/2025 23:42

I worry that our Govt want to criminalise so-called 'Islamophobia' in a country that is supposed to value free speech, as no religion should be free from criticism, especially one that is misogynistic and thinks that 'non-believers' and women are 'less than'...
**
I worry about the new antisemitism here and the impact it is having on Jewish people's safety and security here and on the general cohesiveness of our society.

I have no idea how you can demonise Muslims in one breath and lament the increase in antisemitism in another.

Islamophobia and antisemitism are two sides of the same coin. Both have risen in recent times and both involve demonising people because of their religion, othering them and blaming them for the ills of society. And now we are seeing the far right using a faux concern for anti semitism as a cover for their own prejudices. We'll never fight racism with racism.

Edited

Islamophobia (or at least what the op is referring to as she refers to blasphemy law) is criticism of Islam itself. No religion or belief system should be protected from criticism or debate in the uk. Whether Judaism, Christianity or Islam. There have been recent proposals in parliament for blasphemy laws. This is really concerning and we should not limit free speech like this.

JHound · 05/01/2025 02:29

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 01:38

I think a lot of the far right stuff is a knee jerk reaction to the complacency of the left.

Like, look at the Rotherham sex scandal and how quiet the left were. Same with the 1200 sexual assaults on that one NYE in Germany. Even the authorities played it down and the media weren't originally allowed to mention the ethnicity of the attackers.

There are loads of examples like this that aren't widely known, such as the 40 sexual assaults at the We Are Stkhlm music festival, which were perpetrated by a large group of asylum seekers against victims as young as 14yo. Again, the police stated that the event 'went largely with incident' despite the sexual assaults having been reported at the time, and they only started to admit the truth once stories started coming out on social media and questions started being asked.

And if you look at the statistics, there has been an increase in sex crimes which rises with the number of refugees accepted in every European country for which we have the data. A few examples off the top of my head are asylum seekers being responsible for 20% of serious sex crimes including rape in France despite being 1-2% of the population. In another European country (I forget which) recent immigrants were responsible for 50% of gang rapes over a five year period. For anybody interested the figures were from Hirsi Ali's book Prey - I'd post more but my friend has my copy.

There are loads more stats like this yet lefties will often defend these types of men to the death for fear of being seen as a xenophobe.

Not that I agree with all the Tommy Robinson types either. Often it's just an excuse to kick off. However, I think a lot of people don't seem to connect the dots between people arriving from misogynistic cultures and then continuing to act in the manner they were raised. And IME the types of people defending these demographics often aren't living in the areas where they're likely to ever come into contact with them.

I don't think it's hard to see why some people get sucked into this vigilante style of thinking. I mean, imagine your 14yo daughter being sexually assaulted by dozens of men and then seeing the police talking about how the event 'went largely without incident' when you know there were another 40 victims.

France does not capture ethnicity based statistics - it’s illegal.

So where are you getting your data from?

(and while the claim about gang rapes is concerning - if true - why do these far right warriors always only want to talk about a subset of sexual assaults? The specific subset that they can use to advance their case.)

AngelicKaty · 05/01/2025 02:30

JDNCh · 04/01/2025 18:26

@NeverGuessWho the rise of the far right? After the summer riots, there were plenty of counter protests and what felt like some hope. It doesn’t feel like that any more to me.

and you’re right, why don’t I? Probably because I have a toddler, work full time, I am knackered and I am scared and it feels ineffective against a billionaire with influence. But you’re right, sitting on my arse anxiously checking the news won’t help - but genuinely what can be done? I don’t think a traditional protest is what this requires.

I think YABU OP. The counter protests against the summer riots showed us how much tolerant, decent people outnumber the bigots and racists - the trouble is that the latter are more vocal, but we still have the rule of law on our side and the quiet majority don't want anarchy and hatred. We will always outnumber the Neanderthals.

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 02:33

Justiceeternal · 05/01/2025 02:15

Put what you said in ChatGPT and this is what it said:

‘The claim that asylum seekers in France, constituting 1–2% of the population, are responsible for 20% of serious sex crimes, including rape, lacks substantiated evidence. Comprehensive and up-to-date statistical data directly linking asylum seekers to such a disproportionate percentage of these crimes is not readily available…
It’s important to approach such claims with caution, as they can perpetuate harmful stereotypes and misinformation. Without concrete data supporting the assertion that asylum seekers are disproportionately responsible for serious sex crimes in France, such statements remain unverified and potentially misleading’

Edited

There's a lot more. The below figures from Hirsi Ali's book Prey were mostly collated from news reports and official data. The sources are all referenced in the book. She's a Somalian Muslim who faced FGM and fled a forced marriage.

The rates of “either rape or sexual assault went up between 2014 and 2017 in every European country for which data are available” and “in some countries — notably Denmark and England — they went up a lot, roughly doubling in the case of Denmark.” In that country, Hirsi Ali reports, “‘non-Western’ immigrants and their descendants” account for “around two-fifths of rape convictions and between a quarter and a third of groping convictions — even though they make up less than 13 percent of the population.” In Germany, asylum seekers constituted only 1 or 2 percent of the population from 2015, but they were “disproportionately responsible for sex crimes included in the statistics, making up nearly 12 percent of suspects by 2018,” and responsible for 16.3 percent of grievous sex crimes, such as rape.

To understand this phenomenon, Hirsi Ali argues, we need to take seriously two major causal factors: the ideas and cultural attitudes that many people from Muslim-majority countries bring with them, and the irrational decisions and self-deluded policies of European authorities.

Many asylum seekers from Muslim-majority countries brought with them their society’s endemic contempt for women. She cites a UN survey of more than four thousand men in Morocco, Egypt, Palestinian areas, and Lebanon which found that between one-third and two-thirds of men admitted to sexually harassing women in public. Women are reduced to commodities, useful only for their capacity to bear children, and therefore subjected to a “modesty doctrine.” Hirsi Ali regards such attitudes as tied to and reinforced by Islamic ideas. “More than any other major religion,” she writes, “Islam formalizes the subordination of women.”

Hirsi Ali describes a pattern of government officials looking the other way and staying silent, lest they appear to be xenophobic. Take the incident in Cologne. What was the official response? Police officers on the scene reportedly ignored women who came to them with complaints or else turned them away. A police statement on New Year’s Day claimed the evening had been “largely peaceful.” It was only after a groundswell of posts on social media and coverage in news outlets, that the authorities released information about the attacks and the perpetrators. Moreover, it turned out that smaller-scale gang assaults had occurred that night in Hamburg, Stuttgart, Dusseldorf, and Bielefeld.

The pattern extends beyond Germany. That same year in Sweden, at the “We Are Sthlm” summer festival, a group of some fifty young asylum seekers preyed on women at the event. Even though “thirty-eight sex offenses had been reported on girls as young as 14,” Hirsi Ali writes, Swedish police stated that the event had had “relatively few crimes.” Months later, “fearing a backlash like the one that had followed events in Cologne, Swedish police came clean. Revealingly, Södermalm police chief Peter Ågren said that one reason for the cover-up was to avoid provoking racism or ‘play into the hands of the Swedish Democrats,’ Sweden’s rightwing populist party.” Hirsi Ali believes that European leaders have come to fear that if they speak about the rise in sexual violence against women, they would be seen as “xenophobic” or as appearing to give “ground to actual xenophobes.” Instead, they would rather “cover up the problem and leave victims at risk.”

https://newideal.aynrand.org/ayaan-hirsi-ali-on-migration-islam-and-women-as-prey/

Ayaan Hirsi Ali

Ayaan Hirsi Ali on Migration, Islam and Women as Prey

To explain the erosion of women’s freedom in Europe, look to the massive influx from Muslim-majority countries and government polices that enable the pernicious ideas and customs of immigrants.

https://newideal.aynrand.org/ayaan-hirsi-ali-on-migration-islam-and-women-as-prey

JHound · 05/01/2025 02:33

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 02:19

I’m guessing by Sidhu’s sneering at feminists that he’s a man .

Who likely only cares about women when he can leverage it to criticise groups he hates.

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 02:33

Somewhat reminiscent of Rotherham, no?

JHound · 05/01/2025 02:35

user243245346 · 05/01/2025 02:21

Islamophobia (or at least what the op is referring to as she refers to blasphemy law) is criticism of Islam itself. No religion or belief system should be protected from criticism or debate in the uk. Whether Judaism, Christianity or Islam. There have been recent proposals in parliament for blasphemy laws. This is really concerning and we should not limit free speech like this.

Except Islamophobia has practiced typically is not criticism of the ideology but attacks against Muslims. When Muslim women are subject to abuse on the street that is not “criticising of the faith”.

JHound · 05/01/2025 02:36

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 02:33

There's a lot more. The below figures from Hirsi Ali's book Prey were mostly collated from news reports and official data. The sources are all referenced in the book. She's a Somalian Muslim who faced FGM and fled a forced marriage.

The rates of “either rape or sexual assault went up between 2014 and 2017 in every European country for which data are available” and “in some countries — notably Denmark and England — they went up a lot, roughly doubling in the case of Denmark.” In that country, Hirsi Ali reports, “‘non-Western’ immigrants and their descendants” account for “around two-fifths of rape convictions and between a quarter and a third of groping convictions — even though they make up less than 13 percent of the population.” In Germany, asylum seekers constituted only 1 or 2 percent of the population from 2015, but they were “disproportionately responsible for sex crimes included in the statistics, making up nearly 12 percent of suspects by 2018,” and responsible for 16.3 percent of grievous sex crimes, such as rape.

To understand this phenomenon, Hirsi Ali argues, we need to take seriously two major causal factors: the ideas and cultural attitudes that many people from Muslim-majority countries bring with them, and the irrational decisions and self-deluded policies of European authorities.

Many asylum seekers from Muslim-majority countries brought with them their society’s endemic contempt for women. She cites a UN survey of more than four thousand men in Morocco, Egypt, Palestinian areas, and Lebanon which found that between one-third and two-thirds of men admitted to sexually harassing women in public. Women are reduced to commodities, useful only for their capacity to bear children, and therefore subjected to a “modesty doctrine.” Hirsi Ali regards such attitudes as tied to and reinforced by Islamic ideas. “More than any other major religion,” she writes, “Islam formalizes the subordination of women.”

Hirsi Ali describes a pattern of government officials looking the other way and staying silent, lest they appear to be xenophobic. Take the incident in Cologne. What was the official response? Police officers on the scene reportedly ignored women who came to them with complaints or else turned them away. A police statement on New Year’s Day claimed the evening had been “largely peaceful.” It was only after a groundswell of posts on social media and coverage in news outlets, that the authorities released information about the attacks and the perpetrators. Moreover, it turned out that smaller-scale gang assaults had occurred that night in Hamburg, Stuttgart, Dusseldorf, and Bielefeld.

The pattern extends beyond Germany. That same year in Sweden, at the “We Are Sthlm” summer festival, a group of some fifty young asylum seekers preyed on women at the event. Even though “thirty-eight sex offenses had been reported on girls as young as 14,” Hirsi Ali writes, Swedish police stated that the event had had “relatively few crimes.” Months later, “fearing a backlash like the one that had followed events in Cologne, Swedish police came clean. Revealingly, Södermalm police chief Peter Ågren said that one reason for the cover-up was to avoid provoking racism or ‘play into the hands of the Swedish Democrats,’ Sweden’s rightwing populist party.” Hirsi Ali believes that European leaders have come to fear that if they speak about the rise in sexual violence against women, they would be seen as “xenophobic” or as appearing to give “ground to actual xenophobes.” Instead, they would rather “cover up the problem and leave victims at risk.”

https://newideal.aynrand.org/ayaan-hirsi-ali-on-migration-islam-and-women-as-prey/

Not one source is cited in that excerpt.

Also “non-western descendants of immigrants” are natives of the European countries they are born in. The dog whistle is deafening.

(and the comments about France are curiously absent.)

CarolinaWren · 05/01/2025 02:39

MidnightPatrol · 04/01/2025 18:27

I think social media has become extremely toxic and is increasingly a force for bad, rather than good.

Elon Musk and his interfering…yes, it’s bad, and the power of such interference is concerning.

But - the whole platform is like that. I used to enjoy reading twitter and now all the content is racism, sexism, pornographic etc.

I’m not sure how much real influence they have though - or is it just noise. Outside of Twitter I’m not sure anyone is paying much attention.

I think the bigger challenge for the UK is that we are becoming a poor country and no one is really doing anything about this. Being able to afford a home, a family, a comfortable standard of living, retirement - all looking increasingly unlikely for younger people and the next generation. That is very concerning IMO.

I agree completely. All social media is problematic, but Twitter/X is the worst. I deleted my Twitter account when Musk bought the site, then I missed some of the posters I was following and set up a new account. I deleted that account a few weeks ago. It's mostly right wing trolls and propaganda bots posting at this point, so I'm not missing anything. I deleted Facebook about a decade ago. I keep thinking about deleting Reddit, but for now I just limit my use as there is some good content mixed in with the trash.

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 02:40

user243245346 · 05/01/2025 02:21

Islamophobia (or at least what the op is referring to as she refers to blasphemy law) is criticism of Islam itself. No religion or belief system should be protected from criticism or debate in the uk. Whether Judaism, Christianity or Islam. There have been recent proposals in parliament for blasphemy laws. This is really concerning and we should not limit free speech like this.

No, Islamophobia is prejudice against Muslims, not criticism of Islam.

One person asking at PMQs if the UK plans to ban the desecration of books is not ‘proposals in parliament for blasphemy laws’. You’ve overstated it.

The only place to have blasphemy laws in the UK is northern Ireland to protect Christianity. Perhaps you’ll go to NI to protest this?

SammyScrounge · 05/01/2025 02:45

User37482 · 04/01/2025 18:29

I’m a bit scared that we have loads of institutions that are more worried about pissing people off than locking up child rapists tbh. That really fucking concerns me. Not what Musk is twattering on about. The problem is that there is a problem not that someone pointed it out,

I think that you're right that it is the spinelessness of the authorities that is our greatest danger. What kind of people are they that will sacrifice our children in the name of ideology?

GoldOnyx · 05/01/2025 02:46

MidnightPatrol · 04/01/2025 18:27

I think social media has become extremely toxic and is increasingly a force for bad, rather than good.

Elon Musk and his interfering…yes, it’s bad, and the power of such interference is concerning.

But - the whole platform is like that. I used to enjoy reading twitter and now all the content is racism, sexism, pornographic etc.

I’m not sure how much real influence they have though - or is it just noise. Outside of Twitter I’m not sure anyone is paying much attention.

I think the bigger challenge for the UK is that we are becoming a poor country and no one is really doing anything about this. Being able to afford a home, a family, a comfortable standard of living, retirement - all looking increasingly unlikely for younger people and the next generation. That is very concerning IMO.

@MidnightPatrol i feel exactly the same regarding the UK’s economic situation. I feel like we’ve been on a downward spiral since 2008 in terms of the importance and power of our economy decreasing since then. Meanwhile, the cost of living - particularly since 2021/22 - is increasing more and more.

Rather than coming up with solutions (which is admittedly hard to do!), the government is blaming the situation on vulnerable people - e.g. refugees or migrants, or claiming that factors like the war in Ukraine or Covid have much more impact on it than they actually do.

I read this article the other day -https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/jan/02/death-of-middle-class-professional-spells-danger-for-labour - and found it a very true reflection of what we’re experiencing. It shook me and made me feel quite sad and scared.

The death of the middle-class professional spells danger for Labour | Gaby Hinsliff

Graduate pay is falling – and an aggrieved generation could join white-collar workers in supporting Reform UK, says Guardian columnist Gaby Hinsliff

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/jan/02/death-of-middle-class-professional-spells-danger-for-labour

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 02:50

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 02:19

I’m guessing by Sidhu’s sneering at feminists that he’s a man .

I agree with what Hirsi Ali has to say about feminists below tbh. In fact, the vast majority of women nowadays don't identify as feminists anymore, preferring 'egalitarian' positions. Last time I checked it was 7% of women in the UK (20% in another study) and even the feminist utopia of Sweden only has 40%. The 7% figure was actually from a study by the feminst org Fawcett Society which can be found online.

Most of us aren't interested in the types of white feminsit rhetoric that loves to bash men yet is too scared to stand up and say anything when the perpetrators aren't straight white males (perhaps they only feel comfortable criticising the type of men they marry lol).

“Talking about violence by Muslim men against European women is unfashionable in an age of identity politics, when we are supposed to operate within a partly historical matrix of victimhood.”

I think Western feminists excuse the misogyny inherent in Islam, and practiced by many Muslims, because thinking about it puts them in a situation of cognitive dissonance—they are forced to criticize the behavior of a group they consider oppressed (Muslims) if they want to promote the rights of another group they consider oppressed (women). It’s a clash between two classic progressive values, and to a large extent Western feminists have chosen Islam over women. Why they’ve made that choice baffles me.

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 02:55

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 02:50

I agree with what Hirsi Ali has to say about feminists below tbh. In fact, the vast majority of women nowadays don't identify as feminists anymore, preferring 'egalitarian' positions. Last time I checked it was 7% of women in the UK (20% in another study) and even the feminist utopia of Sweden only has 40%. The 7% figure was actually from a study by the feminst org Fawcett Society which can be found online.

Most of us aren't interested in the types of white feminsit rhetoric that loves to bash men yet is too scared to stand up and say anything when the perpetrators aren't straight white males (perhaps they only feel comfortable criticising the type of men they marry lol).

“Talking about violence by Muslim men against European women is unfashionable in an age of identity politics, when we are supposed to operate within a partly historical matrix of victimhood.”

I think Western feminists excuse the misogyny inherent in Islam, and practiced by many Muslims, because thinking about it puts them in a situation of cognitive dissonance—they are forced to criticize the behavior of a group they consider oppressed (Muslims) if they want to promote the rights of another group they consider oppressed (women). It’s a clash between two classic progressive values, and to a large extent Western feminists have chosen Islam over women. Why they’ve made that choice baffles me.

Most of us aren't interested in the types of white feminsit rhetoric that loves to bash men

It’s hilarious that as a man you’re centering men in an issue that is affecting women and girls.

Women want the end of sexual exploitation of girls by any man, regardless of race.

We see through men like you and Musk who try to use the plight of young girls to further a racist agenda.

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 03:01

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

ChicLilacSeal · 05/01/2025 03:02

OP, many of these trolls are Russian state-sponsored agents whose role is to unsettle western societies via online media. Below is some info about this. It's good news in a way, as it indicates that things are not so bad in the real world. The best thing we can do is not engage with the crazy stuff online. You are feeling exactly the way the Russians want you to feel.

'Russian “troll farms”—groups of organized online agitators—identify grievances in other countries and then insert themselves into those debates with the aim of inflaming them. Rather than promoting any one political ideology, professional Russian trolls instead focus on fanning Americans’ emotions around heated topics such as gun control or immigration, and then pitting Americans against Americans. The tactic is—literally—divide and conquer.' [This is a quote from the first link below, from Carnegie Mellon University.]

https://www.heinz.cmu.edu/media/2018/October/troll-farms-and-fake-news-social-media-weaponization

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/10/how-russia-secretly-orchestrated-dozens-of-us-protests?srsltid=AfmBOorbIfPRS4zVG7IG1np_Ng-OuwZHFi2zRxI0g5iiOQt9Ci9UqYxE

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-justice-dept-says-it-disrupted-russian-social-media-influence-operation-2024-07-09/

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 03:03

And yes you can be a native of a country and still have been raised to a different set of cultural norms. It's these cultural norms that are the issue.

user1471516498 · 05/01/2025 03:03

I never thought I would find myself hoping that the conservatives would sort themselves out. If the Torys were to recapture the traditional centre right ground, they would be able to regain the ground they lost to the Lib Dems and become a serious party again.
As it is, it seems that Badenoch is trying to out- Farage Reform, with the added negatives of the taint of Partygate. And while Badenoch is running the Tories into the ground, reform will continue to rise

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 03:05

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

The mass sexual assault of Muslim women in India by Hindus during the 2002 riots is well documented.

“Several cases of mass sexual assault have been reported in India and have received significant international coverage. During the 2002 riots in Gujarat, targeted violence against Muslim women and children documented by civil society groups reported "mass rapes, live burials and burnings, acid attacks, impaling, and other brutal forms of torture that was deeply gendered, and linked violence against women with violence on their children – both born and unborn".[5] Survivors reported "that sexual violence consisted of forced nudity, mass rapes, gang-rapes, mutilation, insertion of objects into bodies, cutting of breasts, slitting the stomach and reproductive organs, and carving of Hindu religious symbols on women's body parts.[6] The Concerned Citizens' Tribunal, characterised the use of rape "as an instrument for the subjugation and humiliation of a community".[6]”

Or does that not count because Muslim women were the victims?

SidhuVicious · 05/01/2025 03:12

Choccyscofffy · 05/01/2025 03:05

The mass sexual assault of Muslim women in India by Hindus during the 2002 riots is well documented.

“Several cases of mass sexual assault have been reported in India and have received significant international coverage. During the 2002 riots in Gujarat, targeted violence against Muslim women and children documented by civil society groups reported "mass rapes, live burials and burnings, acid attacks, impaling, and other brutal forms of torture that was deeply gendered, and linked violence against women with violence on their children – both born and unborn".[5] Survivors reported "that sexual violence consisted of forced nudity, mass rapes, gang-rapes, mutilation, insertion of objects into bodies, cutting of breasts, slitting the stomach and reproductive organs, and carving of Hindu religious symbols on women's body parts.[6] The Concerned Citizens' Tribunal, characterised the use of rape "as an instrument for the subjugation and humiliation of a community".[6]”

Or does that not count because Muslim women were the victims?

So is India now in the west?

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