To just … not have toys?

[giveupontoys]

Obviously we’ll have to have some, but my DS(4) just doesn’t seem to play with them.

Christmas presents included a toy ice cream van and he just gets everything out and then it ends up discarded and thrown everywhere, so bits get lost and it’s unusable. This is the same as everything we get.

He has a few toy trucks / cars type things but doesn’t really seem to play with them.

I know people will say not to let him or to discipline him but he just ignores us … doesn’t solve anything.

I don’t know what to do really. It kind of seems pointless having toys if they end up unusable but on the other hand he has to have some things.

I’ve read all your posts, and you’ve mentioned you have another child a couple of times. Do they not play together? If the other child plays ‘nicely’ what does that mean, what are they doing?

It struck me as a bit odd that you talk about your son almost as if he’s an only child, but he has a sibling? Do you play with the sibling or are they entertaining themselves without input from you? I’m so curious about the dynamics of this?

My DS is autistic and has never played from a young age (didnt know he was autistic then). We had toys around all the time because he has two siblings, but they were never touched by him except for a set of cars that he would carry everywhere. If it were just him, I'd have cut back on them significantly yes. Keep some things for purposes of helping with fine motor skills as that is important, as are stuff that teaches cause and effect- though you can do this outdoors. Books would be the thing I'd have the most of in this instance. I'd persist with reading even if he walks away. He can still hear you around the room.

And honestly if it gets broken then so be it. The alternative seems to be binning a brand new toy anyway so what's the big deal if it gets broken? Toys get broken, no one likes it happening but it's not unusual with young kids.

Does he get plenty of exercise?
My nephews are rough and tumble boys and mine looks to be going the same way… like puppies they need a good run / jump / wrestle around at least once a day, then they will usually settle to play a bit less destructively. Park time, or even running up and down the garden for a while, really helps them settle and focus on something. They also enjoy activities like baking, hiding toys which they have to find etc. For tidying up things like “can you find every toy and put it in this box? I bet you can’t do it in one minute… set timer and off they go.

And I also assumed he was an only! If other sibling plays with stuff then I'm perplexed as to how you apparently don't know how to play, when you have a child doing it right in front of you in your own home. This is all a bit weird. Do they never interact with each other? And why can't the other child use the toys instead of them being binned?

I’ve binned it because it had about twenty different parts to it, I’m not joking. I haven’t got the time to be endlessly putting it back together and I do mean endlessly. I think I’ve put it back together about thirty times today, bits under the sofa, rug, TV stand, bookcases, I just can’t keep doing that.

@VivaVivaa look … this will sound so abrupt and rude but it doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter if he is ND or not. He isn’t going to be diagnosed for what, the best part of a decade, nursery think he’s fine, HV thinks he’s fine, it’s literally just MN who say he isn’t and at the risk of sounding like a complete arse here MN say EVERYONE is ND. That’s not saying he is and it’s not saying he’s not; I don’t know! But it isn’t curable is it?

Right now I’ve had a week where it’s been an absolute onslaught of toys and I just have no time in which to sort them. My younger child is refusing to sleep, is still up now actually, and I can’t find anything, I can’t find the TV remote, my purse, keys, nothing. I’m doing shit at work because of it, because I live in chaos, and I hate it.

@Skade ..My son adored playing with bricks, wooden ones, lego, and I took it totally for granted.
The school {when he was 4} called me in when collecting him to say he was very unusual about how he put roofs and lintels on the buildings, to make windows.. and they showed me what he'd built.

He is a skilled Conservation worker now, {can't be too outing!} and his tutor at college said he was ''A natural'' - Just as well, as he had very bad dyslexia at school but had a great mind for puzzles and complex shapes. 😂👍

How is it weird that one child sits playing and one sits emptying and climbing?

Why does losing a few pieces make a toy unusable? Children just use their imagination and find something else to replace what is lost. They mix stuff up all the time at that age and they don’t care about a toy remaining perfect and pristine - it is only you OP who has the problem here.

As all the other posters are saying, sit down with your ds, play & have fun together because that is what matters, not whether all the pieces of a toy are kept in perfect condition.

@giveupontoys you've seriously "binned" the ice cream van because some of the smaller parts have gone missing?
If your son is aware that's what you do he is never going to have respect for his toys.
Get bored of it = oh well lets chuck it and on to something else.
That's not good.
Get some plastic boxes and put small amounts of similar toys together and start a rule of only one box of toys out at a time.
If he tips them all out then at least it's not a huge amount at once.
When it's time to put toys away just scoop (and encourage him to help) everything up and put back in the box. If parts have been kicked under the sofa - then never mind. They'll turn up eventually. Maybe have a small basket for things that suddenly reappear when cleaning.
Then when a toy comes out to be played with and a bit is missing then you can look in the Basket of Found Things.

If it's something he actually played with though why didn't you get him another? Or get him a toolbench. Does he have friends around to play? Maybe he just doesn't like playing alone.

I think it sounds like he lots of physical things rather than imagination. Tipping toys out, watching them fill an area feels satisfying as it very briefly meets that need. I'd focus on physically stimulating activities that may or may not be toys. Indoor swing, one of those wobbly balance board circles, connecting tunnels, an old cardboard box filled with ball.pool balls, bath toys as an activity rather than just a wash, indoor swing ball etc. He'll probably really enjoy sport as he gets bigger.

Why does it have to be complete at all times? Why can't he play with a few flavours missing?
Perhaps some sort of blockade could stop things disappearing underneath furniture? Fewer gaps, fewer missing toys?

How about board games ? There are plenty of fun games to play with a 4 year old. Mine are older now but First Orchard, Snail Race etc are great games. I'm so childish I actually liked to play imaginary games with mine with Playmobil, kitchen etc but board games is great if you don't because you there are rules to follow so easy peasy. Look for some inspiration : https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/board-games-for-kids/

Both my boys had dolls and a toy buggy - are they not just as likely to be parents one day?

Re the no playing thing. I find it hard to do role playing which my boys love. But building a tower and knocking it down / running cars up and down a ramp, marble run, magnatiles - all super easy.

Now you’ve said you hate Bluey I’m immediately suspicious of you though- how can you hate that?! Peppa Pig, sure - but Bluey?!

How to play 101.

DUPLO
do you have enough of it? You need just loads of blocks etc. Go on ebay and get bags of 2nd hand.

Sit on floor and suggest things "shall we build a farm!" , " lets build a house for your cuddly bunny". Show him bits, get him started then follow his lead, let him develop it off into something else & roll with it. Its ok if he says its a dinosaur park and he then smashes it up because "it was T-rex".

BRIO
Tip out all the brio and build the longest track you can round the downstairs of the house.

Tell a story inspired by something like thomas the tank engine then act it out. "Uh oh, edward's hit thomas he's derailed! Quick james needs to come from the engine sheds over the level crossing and bring the crane"

BOARD games
Play orchard toys games with him
Choose games with two dice where you need to add small numbers and talk about it, get him to move your piece for you & count the spaces

IMAGINATIVE
base it on what will interest him. It may not be baby dolls. My son liked:
Sweet shop: buy cheap sweets in supermarket and put in old empty herb jars. Write a price list on a white board eg cola bottle 1p, snake 2p, lolly 3p. Give him 20p to spend and make him work the money out. Swap and he can be shopkeeper while you buy.
Cafe: write a menu, set up a kiddy table/box with a table cloth (i use an old cotton scarf!). Play at being customer and waiter and take turns. Use real food, make a big fuss of pretending to be a snooty french waiter etc. Do washing up in a bowl on the kitchen floor afterwards.

Draw pictures together. You can buy books that give you step by step "how to draw" for different characters which can appeal.

Other brilliant toys
BUILD IT - if he liked a tool set he will love.
Magnatiles - build a fort and defend against attacks from mummy with a straw and dried peas or those tiny pea size pompom balls

Boys can be quite different to girls at this age, my experience is that they sometimes play less independently and need you to engage/start them off/play with.

And my little ones have loved games and puzzles since a really early age. Orchard games and there’s a website called Scout and Co where I get really nice stuff.

@giveupontoys We have that same ice cream set. Don’t bin it - but he will need someone to make ice creams for. He’ll need a customer.

Without wanting to sound at all judgmental; because I have a similar agreement little boy and I wish I was better at playing with him… This does sound like an environment. You don’t want to play; the example of play you give is walking a baby in a pram; which is going for a walk really, it’s not play. He will be a bit baffled when you sit down to play with him if it’s not usual and you’re on edge and don’t know what to do. And it does sound like you might hover over him because you don’t want mess to be made, but that may be because your house sounds quite small and cramped, so I’m guessing there’s not actually much room to play? And your partner doesn’t sound the most useful… does he ever play with your son?

It’s biologically to be expected that your daughter plays better than your son does, but he’ll catch up. And like someone else said, “playing” will initially be copying what someone has shown him, which is probably why he plays well at nursery but not at home; where other children will show him games, and the nursery practitioners.

You do need to encourage him to tidy up, but you know that. And I absolutely understand the desire to be out a lot - we rarely have a day totally inside, and often do outdoors activities. That’s not a problem. But you do need a bit of time inside to play. He’ll never learn to play if you don’t show him. You’re probably right that your parents didn’t play with you much, but you can stop that being something you pass on…

So you’ve described a couple types of toys.

What about remote control cars, duplo, building blocks, art craft sets, playdough etc.

Yes, Mumsnet has an utter obsession about ''ND''

''My son stubbed his toe''

Mumsnet : A&E NOW. Has he been diagnosed Dyspraxic?

''My Daughter got cross because of the sound her brother was making, eating''
Mumsnet : Has she a diagnosis for Autism or PTSD?, or Misophonia?

Or ...Drumroll...'' Have YOU been diagnosed, yourself OP?''

{I hope you take this for the jest it is!}

Whittle down the toys.

Maybe your son just prefers outdoor activities?

Nothing wrong with that.

i have a son who has literally just turned 4 and I can’t imagine having no toys in the house! We are constantly playing here or doing activities - it’s f’ exhausting as my husband and I work long hours full time, then weekends / holidays / are all play. He also likes books as a quiet time activity but what you describe is a type of play - children like to sort things and put things in and out of boxes etc. maybe you need to try other activities - does he like drawing? Role play? My son is always playing shopkeeper and uses that awful ice cream cart to serve people ice cream all the time, and he serves all his teddies food from his shop area. We have toys of every type - jigsaw puzzles are his favourite, but kinetic sand and Lego is also good, we do a lot of drawing and then we have the usual train tracks and cars etc. outside he has a trampoline and swings etc and a bike, cars, etc. is your son chilled when he is not playing?

I understand that lots of mess feels chaotic and it's much easier if everything is tidied away but as many posters have said children really need toys and time to play for their development, you know this. Can u not find some storage solutions, its only for a few years. Emptying toys is a play schema that some children engage in....could you speak with health visitor/sure start or similar support ? He might need you to model play more if he doesn't know what to do. Does he have any friends come round? Something needs to change here, your child needs toys.

I did and all the parts got lost again so I admitted defeat.

The point of the ice cream thing is lost if there’s no ice cream, otherwise it’s literally a bench thing that isn’t played with. But tbh I feel like everyone’s honed in on that one example, and it’s much bigger than that. So another example - we had a throw on the sofa. DS was constantly chucking it on the floor and it was getting dirty and made the house look a mess. So I put it away. And that thing is like some sort of mythological creature that emerges constantly to haunt me. Half the time I don’t know where it is and DS finds it. I do not know how. I just actually lost my shit over it because it was crumped at the bottom of the stairs AGAIN, so it is in the bin, with the ice cream set and I do not care who is judging, come and bloody clean it up yourselves then.

It isn’t important. If he doesn’t like toys then he doesn’t like toys, he’ll outgrow them all soon enough anyway.

One of mine didn't play with toys at home. He would play at creche and preschool - he loved wooden brio-style train sets there so much but never played with it at home. At home he liked to be on the move and/or outdoors. He liked big sticks and had an extensive collection which were variously swords/staffs/wands/ski poles. Loved riding his bikes and perfecting "stunts". Around 5 years old he got into paper and felt pens - pictures, comics, stories, mysterious codes. By 8 he had a gang to ride around with and solve crimes. Plenty of imaginative play, but he's never been bothered about toys. He always liked real objects though. Ignored the toy hoover, but loved the dustbuster. Ignored the play kitchen, but very happy to help in the real kitchen. Kids know when they are being fobbed off with the fake.

If toys with lots of small pieces are stressful, stop buying them. If you find it hard to play with your DS, try simple board games or reading together. All my kids have enjoyed those, despite their feelings on toys.

Oh and hospitals role play. Youngest loves this.

Take old empty calpol bottle. Fill with water, add beetroot juice to colour it pink. Have refreshers/parma violets for "pills" Give them a real medicine syringe for the pink water, a real bandage, the cheapest plasters you can buy, the bathroom thermometer etc. I even bought a cheap pulse ox monitor you put on your finger. White coat, mask and stethoscope. Clipboard to write notes. Let them diagnose you with all manner of inflictions, write notes, bandage your head/foot etc