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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to ask all the women on here with shitty nasty partners and husbands to really think about how they can escape them as soon as possible?

135 replies

Merryoldgoat · 26/12/2024 12:32

I know divorce isn’t easy.
I know that abuse is hard and dangerous to extricate yourself from.
I know that your self esteem might be in the toilet.

But for the love of god please make plans so this is the last Christmas you are the only one with no gifts, had all of your hard work denigrated, your cooking sneered at, your appearance criticised and so on.

No one has a perfect relationship, but it’s perfectly possible to have a relationship without any of the above, and no relationship is better than a shit one.

Life is hard anyway. Don’t let it be harder than necessary.

My mum put up with a shitty relationship for 20 years. Then when she was finally ready to think about leaving she died. Years of knowing it was shit, wishing she could escape, putting up with the criticism and when she’d finally decided it was too late.

For you and your children if you have them, make a plan.

OP posts:
Mrsredlipstick · 26/12/2024 16:46

Again the aforementioned late copper mother was much married.
First one violence, binned, she became a copper because of him.
Second liked a fresh one each year, binned.
Third one my lovely late dad loved her more. That was her advice. Make sure they love you more.

My DH is a good man but any shit from him, he's under the patio. I've seen abuse too often. I'd rather live in a shed with safe kids than play the losing everything card.
My telling of my friends bruised bump more than twenty years later still makes me cry. Don't be that person. A violent person can rarely change (I have to say that as I have a trainee psychologist DD who'd disagree). Personally I wouldn't take the risk.
Get in your car, grab any tech and paperwork and get away.

Youvebeenframed · 26/12/2024 16:50

You’re so right
There have been some horrific situations on MN this year.
The next more shocking than the last
Thank god there is MN for women to turn to for solid advice 💪🏻

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 26/12/2024 16:54

Your poor mum I'm sorry op. I hope that her suffering won't be in vain if it helps others to hold it in mind and be brave and leave (safely with an advance plan before you tell him)

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 26/12/2024 16:55

Fhjiutwafhmbcff · 26/12/2024 12:49

Not realising is a big one.
So often, someone comes on here saying 'I have this one problem, please help.'
Then it gradually turns out her whole life is awful because of a selfish/nasty/lazy/cheating bloke who she'd be better off without.

Yes usually (in my case at least) as he's convinced the woman that she's the issue and she's lucky he's putting up with all her nonsense and emotionally

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 26/12/2024 16:56

Mrsredlipstick · 26/12/2024 13:10

It has truly been a year of violent, abusive partner stories on MN (I say partners because they usually haven't married the OP).
I've frequently wanted to get in my car and go to help other women.
We don't seem to be making progress as women. When I read the toxic behaviour that is everywhere including business forums I get very angry. How do we change this?
I'm glad I've be married a long time to a decent man and I'm super glad I'm retiring next year otherwise I might turn into a vigilante.

Retirement gives your more free time to be a vigilante!

Pinkpank · 26/12/2024 16:57

@Merryoldgoat 👏
Reading so many posts over the last 2 days has really made me sad at how some people are being treated.

Merryoldgoat · 26/12/2024 17:03

Pinkpank · 26/12/2024 16:57

@Merryoldgoat 👏
Reading so many posts over the last 2 days has really made me sad at how some people are being treated.

Same here.

My marriage isn’t perfect but this was my Boxing Day:

The littlest woke up at 7 after I finally got him to sleep at 2am (little git) so DH got straight up - kissed my forehead and told me to sleep as long as necessary and he’d do the kids.

I woke at 11 to a cleaned kitchen, a friendly but competitive game of Mariokart, a very nice leftover sandwich, and the sharing of Ferrero Rocher.

Every family should have the ability to have a life free from discord and uncertainty and the threat of violence.

OP posts:
Dweetfidilove · 26/12/2024 17:10

@Merryoldgoat I fully endorse this message and it needs repeating now more than ever.

The posts on MN are getting worse by the day and I sit in wonderment at what some women and children are living everyday. And that is without even touching the abusive relationships.

Women with resources - stuck.

Women afraid of a drop in lifestyle- stuck.

Seemingly intelligent and competent women just giving away their children's home, happiness and security.

Women encouraging women on this blessed site to remain in shit situations, because they did/ because being single is shit/ because with communication a man can change...

There was a thread with a man behaving maliciously towards a 3 year old and the amount of posters who thought the OP should stay and figure it out, even after she'd decided to leave... 🤦🏾‍♀️. Unbelievable!

Most people know that leaving isn't easy, but creating a plan is crucial for getting away.

Plastictrees · 26/12/2024 17:23

Dweetfidilove · 26/12/2024 17:10

@Merryoldgoat I fully endorse this message and it needs repeating now more than ever.

The posts on MN are getting worse by the day and I sit in wonderment at what some women and children are living everyday. And that is without even touching the abusive relationships.

Women with resources - stuck.

Women afraid of a drop in lifestyle- stuck.

Seemingly intelligent and competent women just giving away their children's home, happiness and security.

Women encouraging women on this blessed site to remain in shit situations, because they did/ because being single is shit/ because with communication a man can change...

There was a thread with a man behaving maliciously towards a 3 year old and the amount of posters who thought the OP should stay and figure it out, even after she'd decided to leave... 🤦🏾‍♀️. Unbelievable!

Most people know that leaving isn't easy, but creating a plan is crucial for getting away.

I think there can be an issue on MN where ‘low level’ abusive/shitty behaviour is normalised, usually within the context of the husband being a high earner. It is normalised that this behaviour is accepted in order to have a higher quality of life financially, like some sort of trade off. If a women questions this it can make others in the same situation defensive, and then the minimising / telling her to stay with him/ ‘think of the children!!1!’ begins. It is frustrating to witness.

We need to raise women and girls self esteem and autonomy, which isn’t easy in a misogynistic society but still. We should not be accepting this shit and should have options in 2024 (almost 2025!).

hellohellooo · 26/12/2024 17:28

TooManyChristmasCards · 26/12/2024 13:28

May I just add

if your partner is becoming a shit the minute you are pregnant or have a baby, doesn't support you then, doesn't take your side against in-laws from hell who think they have some kind of "right" over your baby

it won't get better

Start thinking about moving then, take all the time you need, but be clear that's it, it will never get better with him

Gosh yes

This had to be spelt out to me and on MN

They make you think you are the problem

7 years ago I had an awful Xmas
He was abusing me and trying to force me into a marriage

One morning when I asked to speak about the abuse he took a knife to me

I was 38 weeks pregnant
Ran in my pjs and then went back a few days later

When I returned he told me he had to and it all ramped up a week later

Thank god I had this site at the time
I used to think I was losing my mind and the great kindness on here meant it was a safe place to ask questions and look for advice

I got away when the baby was 5 weeks old and we have a great life

The bastard didn't get jail as the system is so badly geared for men

But

We are free

And every year I make a donation to the wonderful people at women's aid and I always think of the decent ladies on here when I I donate as I would not be alive now if I stayed

❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

Mrsredlipstick · 26/12/2024 17:31

@Dweetfidilove was the post about the three year old where the step partner shut the door on a crying child?
I despair.
I have until recently had a big job. I fell very ill. My husband has fed me, bathed me and wiped my bum!

He doesn't speak to his brother because of his behaviour towards his first wife and child. No big drama but doesn't see how this man can tell lies about his status to effect a new Catholic marriage. It's called principles. Nowt to do with me. I'm not catholic. I'd clone him if I could but a warning he can't cook!

I don't know what it's like to be divorced, but I have plenty of friends who have been there. 99% are very happy. Two were at a breakfast last week who had me laughing at the blokes trying their luck.
A little snipit from the BFF, paint any sole owned house pink then the CFs don't want to move in. Result.

Merryoldgoat · 26/12/2024 18:03

Further upthread someone asked what makes men shitty and how to stop it.

I’m not sure but I know in DH’s case what made him good was his parents and his grandparents who modelled (long before it was the norm) equal relationships, respectful behaviour and being independent.

MIL is fierce in the best way and his dad is funny, calm and kind. They are a partnership and brought up their sons to be the same.

DH was 24 when we started seeing each other. On the practical side he ironed, cooked, cleaned. His mum was having chemo and he made her nourishing food, helped round the house. I had an operation and he took a week off to help me recuperate.

And now I see the same things in our 11yo who is kind, thoughtful, and helpful.

One thing is that I notice: kindness is massively underrated as a quality in a desirable man. And frankly it’s the most important in my experience.

OP posts:
Cryingatthegym · 26/12/2024 18:22

FictionalCharacter · 26/12/2024 13:10

I was thinking exactly the same thing, after reading a couple of very depressing threads about awful husbands. It's worst of all when he's done such a number on the OP that she genuinely doesn't know how abnormal her life is and thinks she's being unreasonable.

It's so hard to see it when you're in it. When you have someone distorting your reality and placing all the blame at your feet and at the same time telling you that it's for your own good etc.

It takes a long time too from realising what's happening to building up the strength and courage and resources to leave when your self esteem and independence have been slowly eroded without you even realising.

Especially when they start being nice and promising you the world and that they'll change. And/or telling you that you're overreacting/it's not that bad/your own fault/generally making you doubt your own perception of what's going on.

It's truly insidious. I wish it was as simple as just leaving.

ScaredAndPanicky · 26/12/2024 18:38

It's partly through mumsnet posts that I started to realise just how bad my marriage was. I had grown up in a single parent family and had no idea how I should/shouldn't be treated (I'd been abused as a child).
It took me years to get to the point I was financially secure enough to leave. Last year I finally ran away. Ultimately it was the best thing i ever did, but it was also the hardest thing I ever did. The desire to go back to my abuser was massive (never understood how that could be until I was in that situation). As all the stuff he had done (rape, physical violence, emotional abuse, having affairs) that I had blocked out to be able to survive started to come back and I was suicidal for months. The kids were all under camhs as they were suicidal too.
It's taken about 18months for me to feel like there might be light at the end of the tunnel. So yes definitely encourage people to make a plan. But if you know anyone personally going through abuse really really stand by them as they will really need your support.

Edit to add- and despite everything I still wasn't sure when I finally went to see women's aid that I was in an abusive marriage and it wasn't all in my head. Because when someone says walk away when they are first violent - is that the first time they break something that belongs to you as you have annoyed them, or the first time the car boot falls on your head (but they say they were trying to catch it), etc. It builds up slowly until it is just normal to have things thrown at you.

Dweetfidilove · 26/12/2024 18:40

Plastictrees · 26/12/2024 17:23

I think there can be an issue on MN where ‘low level’ abusive/shitty behaviour is normalised, usually within the context of the husband being a high earner. It is normalised that this behaviour is accepted in order to have a higher quality of life financially, like some sort of trade off. If a women questions this it can make others in the same situation defensive, and then the minimising / telling her to stay with him/ ‘think of the children!!1!’ begins. It is frustrating to witness.

We need to raise women and girls self esteem and autonomy, which isn’t easy in a misogynistic society but still. We should not be accepting this shit and should have options in 2024 (almost 2025!).

This is what it is, and is as sad as it is frustrating.
Threads like this hopefully shines a light on it, until we have managed to work through the misogyny and stigma of leaving shit relationships.

Dweetfidilove · 26/12/2024 18:43

Mrsredlipstick · 26/12/2024 17:31

@Dweetfidilove was the post about the three year old where the step partner shut the door on a crying child?
I despair.
I have until recently had a big job. I fell very ill. My husband has fed me, bathed me and wiped my bum!

He doesn't speak to his brother because of his behaviour towards his first wife and child. No big drama but doesn't see how this man can tell lies about his status to effect a new Catholic marriage. It's called principles. Nowt to do with me. I'm not catholic. I'd clone him if I could but a warning he can't cook!

I don't know what it's like to be divorced, but I have plenty of friends who have been there. 99% are very happy. Two were at a breakfast last week who had me laughing at the blokes trying their luck.
A little snipit from the BFF, paint any sole owned house pink then the CFs don't want to move in. Result.

If he was the one ignoring the child when she returned from her dad, yes.

Relationships are meant to be supportive and kind, but if you try starting a thread along those lines you'll be quickly shut down.

Ponoka7 · 26/12/2024 20:34

Merryoldgoat · 26/12/2024 15:02

When you have the means to leave and have children it’s unforgivable to keep them in that situation.

That's if you can easily ignore the women murdered as they leave and afterwards. Also the children killed, abused and left permanently disabled because the father still gets access. As a pp said, she's been told by WA that he will get overnight access, which leaves her children at risk of abuse.
There's been cases of children murdered by the father after him getting residency of the child.
I'd also like to add that abusive lesbians also target single Mums. It's something that has been on SS radar for around fifteen years, although Star Hobson was failed by her SWs.

Ponoka7 · 26/12/2024 20:48

@Mrsredlipstick I hope that they now teach how psychology of old is based on sexist stereotypes and assumptions/bias. Even if we agreed that violent people can change, it's universally agreed that they shouldn't re-enter a relationship with a person they have been violent to.

Merryoldgoat · 26/12/2024 21:39

Ponoka7 · 26/12/2024 20:34

That's if you can easily ignore the women murdered as they leave and afterwards. Also the children killed, abused and left permanently disabled because the father still gets access. As a pp said, she's been told by WA that he will get overnight access, which leaves her children at risk of abuse.
There's been cases of children murdered by the father after him getting residency of the child.
I'd also like to add that abusive lesbians also target single Mums. It's something that has been on SS radar for around fifteen years, although Star Hobson was failed by her SWs.

I said when you have the means to leave by which I mean financially, legally, safely - apologies if that wasn’t clear.

OP posts:
Thepeopleversuswork · 26/12/2024 21:43

Never ever stop working. Never rely on someone else for financial security. That should be handed down to every female child at birth.

That’s really the thing above all else that I want my daughter to remember. It’s the only thing you can control.

You can’t preempt or predict how a man will turn out when you have children. You may think you can tell a good one from a bad one but you really can’t. Marriage might give you a bit of insurance. But it won’t save you and it will make it harder to leave.

Thats really the only thing you can do. Keep your money and remember it’s the one thing that might stand between you and an abusive or neglectful marriage. Financial independence is everything.

WomanIsTaken · 27/12/2024 01:47

This thread has bothered me since earlier today (well, yesterday). Checking in again now and seeing some predictable and frustrating responses.

Women who insightfully highlight that certain sentiments on the thread may serve to compound shame and to simplify or minimise the issues faced by women in abusive relationships are not 'men' or 'trolls' or 'misogynists' trying to shut anything down. More likely, they are women who are contributing professional or lived experience, and who understand all the subtleties, complexities and dangers inherent in remaining in and extricating oneself and one's children from an abusive relationship.

A woman leaving a partner who is likely to get some portion of joint custody (the burden of evidence required to prevent access altogether is significant and often not attainable) is facing the reality of her children being cared for, unsupervised, by her manipulative, aggressive, coercive, dominant, neglectful or even violent ex-partner. She is facing harm to herself, her children, her property and reputation (professional reputational damage is a recognised lever for revenge as abusive exes make vexatious complaints or claims to professional bodies and insurers, trash online reviews, sabotage contracts and contacts, and force women to max out on time off work as they crash contact arrangements, leaving her vulnerable at a time when she, more than ever, needs to be able to rely on her capacity to provide for herself and her DC).

Women who leave abusive relationships have statistically tried to leave multiple times prior to the time when they are able to finally leave. They will have planned, thought, reached out, enquired, researched, saved; done all the right things. Only for something to happen which makes it too risky to follow through. Working with women in crisis, I know that when a woman says that her spouse or partner will make her life difficult, or come after her, she rarely says those things frivolously. She'll know precisely what he's capable of, and will have deemed the stakes too high.

So yes, let's encourage women who are on this very arduous journey, but please, until DV services and children's services, local authorities, banks, employers, housing associations, benefits agencies, police and the judiciary actively run toward those among us who need them, less of the 'unforgiveable', 'parents' choice', 'both parents', 'so many women', 'running out of patience with', 'abusers of the future' etc. If you're good, then count your blessings and afford the next woman her dignity and good grace and amplify the work of those who specialise in women's services through donations and signposting.

Frankbeverleyandthebutlers · 27/12/2024 01:59

Merryoldgoat · 26/12/2024 13:18

@FictionalCharacter @Mrsredlipstick

I agree with you both. And it is everywhere.

I think that it’s undeniable also that children growing up in these environments will be damaged by what they see and hear throughout their childhood.

There is such a massive amount of work to do - it feels insurmountable 😔

That's what I try to get across when DV is going on in a household.
I was that child I saw ,heard,had violence used against me .
It takes decades to reconcile with I managed with the help of CBT but it took me 50 years to get there.

Frankbeverleyandthebutlers · 27/12/2024 02:01

I should have added when an op says DV is going on and there are children involved.

Edingril · 27/12/2024 02:06

And stop breeding with them, why on earth does this need to said out loud

imfae · 27/12/2024 04:19

Vinvertebrate · 26/12/2024 14:52

Thank you OP. My marriage is going down the toilet, DH is verbally (but not physically) abusive and is deeply ashamed of having an autistic, SEN child. However, my mother is dying and my child is very disabled and unable to cope with change. I have no family apart from DM and I can’t bring everything crashing down when she and DS are so vulnerable. But reading this thread has made me think and hope that one day I might be able to change things. 💐

So sorry Vinvertebrate that seems very tough for you just now . I am sorry to hear about your Mum and it is also heartbreaking to hear that your H is ashamed about his son .
I think quite often people with no real experience or understanding of the complexities of relationships and how torn and guilty people can feel are quick to say LTB .That they would never put up with it etc .

Your circumstances show how complex this can be . I know OP isn't saying that here and I agree with her sentiment about having a plan . That is the acknowledgment that the relationship isn't healthy for you, but other factors mean that you can't leave imminently .

I hope that when the time is right for you that you can post and get your own advice and support from the lovely ladies here .

Take care in the meantime FlowersFlowersFlowers