Not wanting my SS over for Chistmas Day

[Lifelessonsnotlearnt]

Apologies for the long story but there is background context to add...

My husband and I have been together for 9 yrs married for 7. We each have kids from previous marriages, husband has (M26) and (F20). I get on really well with my SD, however SS tolerates me and is civil, but there is no real relationship there.

Rewind to a few months ago. SD and SS both live with husbands elderly parents (in their 80's). MIL is the loveliest person you could ever hope to meet and will do anything for anyone. SS has lived with her since husband and ex divorced (another story but not relevant to this one). SS has for the most part since turning adult has been in and out of work. There have been various 'interventions' with my husband on his lack of job, grumpy and rude attitide around the house, and not contributing to the house financially or physically, not to mention the smoking of weed in his bedroom! (FIL has COPD amongst other health issues). So during yet another 'chat' with SS, husband reiterated again that he needed to get a job, start contributing to the household and be more pleasant with his grandparents...and stop smoking weed in the house. MIL came in after and the conversation turned to her offing to pay for his driving lessons, which had been on the table since be was 17 and he hadn't taken her up on it, He took some sort of offence to this and he told her she was acting like C which obviously incited my husband and all h broke lose. Husband and SS were shouting and swearing at each other then SS stomped off to his bedroom crying.

SS didn't speak to husband for a few weeks and was cordial with inlaws. Afew weeks later he got a job, but continues to smoke weed in the house! (small changes?!).

Since then I haven't really visited MIL at her home as I'm still enraged at how he spoke to her and how he has treated her over the years, and the fact that he STILL smokes weed. Had that been one of my adult chidren they would have been shown the door! I just don't want to be in the same space as him, and have informed my husband so.

Fast forward to 10 days ago, my husband picked me up from work and informed me that inlaws and SS were coming for Chrismas dinner. Bearing in mind we had always had an 'open house' invitation, but they had never come. SS has only visited his father at out home once or twice and refuses to come when invited. He's had Christams invitattions previously, has said he's coming and just doesn't.

We have argued none stop since, I don't want him to come, husband says 'what am I supposed to do, he's my son'. I feel sick to my stomach thinking I have to spend the day in his company knowing what he's treating my inlaws. I feel there will be an awkwardness that veveryone will pick up on and it will ruin everyones day.

Am I being unreasonable, as husband says I am?

Honestly it sounds as if your DH has just opted out of parenting his child considering his son has been living with his very elderly parents for the past 10 years with him visiting his fathers house “once or twice”. You say his poor behaviour has been going on for years so presumably since he was a child and in the teenage years and instead of dealing with his child he’s just left his elderly parents to deal with an angry abandoned young man? Maybe there’s more to it than that but that’s how it reads. Shame on your DH.

This. Completely unreasonable in so many ways.

I'm shocked at some of the responses stating my husband abandoned SS as a teenagers, which is far from the case. Mistakes were made after the divorce with his ex (both responsible not just my husband), but at what point do you move on and start acting like an adult?

My husband didn't just leave then with IL and move in with me and my children he was single for over 5 years and we dated for over a year before we lived together, always including all of the kids in what we did, holidays, days out, etc. SS was never interested as he was older and out with his mates.

None of this excuses bad behaviour to his grandparents or his failure to launch as an adult but it may explain it.

Exactly

Your H and PIL are enabling him to act like a very angry little boy who stomps off to his room crying because he doesn’t want to be a responsible adult. Your husband was having a chat with his son about the way he is treating his grandparents, total disrespect and disregard of his GF’s COPD by smoking weed in the house, plus his attitude and not paying rent or looking for a full time job. So MIL comes in to soften the blow of him being pulled up about his refusal to grow up and reminds him of the offer he’d had before from her to pay for his driving lessons, to help him find a full time job. He calls her an cunt and then all hell breaks loose resulting in Ss stomping off to his room crying.
All that did was, for your H to lose his temper and to act no different to how Ss had spoke to MIL except it turned the tables from him being being in the wrong to being a victim, to garner sympathy from everyone. Your H would’ve felt guilt because he lost control of the situation and ended up saying awful things in a temper. MIL once you both left would’ve been wringing her hands trying to comfort her GS and he would be let of the hook. I bet that’s a pattern that keeps occurring repeatedly between them all.
The questions it throws up at me reading your post is why did your H lumber his ageing parents with the responsibility of his children.
Why is he unable to keep his parents safe from son’s abuse, swearing at old people in their 80’s by a 26 year old Man, it is abuse and so is smoking weed in the house of someone who has COPD? Why can’t your H speak to his son calmly about said abuse without getting triggered by Son deliberately pushing his buttons so the whole conversation get abusive between them? That must’ve scare the shit out of the PILs? They must of been walking on eggshells after you left trying to calm your Ss down!

To get back on track about your question on your post about you and H’s disagreement on whether Ss should be invited round to celebrate Christmas, your H sees nothing wrong with inviting Son round and is scared of alienating him. You will be resented by all of them if you insist he can’t come, including your IL’s! That’s the family dynamics you married into and there is absolutely nothing you can change about it,. To point out their dysfunctional ways won’t make your H acknowledge it, he will deny it with his last breath!

My advice is to say to H, “I don’t agree with your son’s behaviour but he’s your son so if you really want him here Christmas Day then so be it.” Completely disengage with your Ss, it doesn’t mean you are rude to him or cause an atmosphere, just say the basics, hello, can you pass the salt please etc and goodbye. Stop getting involved or taking an interest in anything he does and how it impacts everyone. When H brings it up just say “I don’t want to talk about it, we have spoken numerous times about your son and his abusive behaviour but nothing changes so I don’t want to discuss it, not because I don’t care but it’s bad for my MH.” Your mantra to yourself is, “not my monkey, not my circus.”
You can’t their behaviour, you only have the power to change your own behaviour so … Disengage.

The fact that his behaviour is worse than his sisters is not surprising if you look at the timeline. His mum left when he was 11. This is such a critical crucial age and he was likely more impacted than his younger her sister who was still in the throes of the magical thinking of childhood. At 11 your identity as an adult in this world is being rapidly shaped, and you have all the sudden insecurities of puberty, and at that moment his parents left him - his dad sort of left him too (by moving in with GP's and with his health issue - not your DH's fault but would have felt like abandonment to the son).

I would say he is in need of counselling. Has he had any? He sounds deeply deeply unhappy and depressed. The weed won't be helping long term but of course it will be numbing his pain.

It's so hard for anyone, girls and boys in different ways but for young men they often feel the pain can't be expressed and they fear appearing weak. So it gets internalised and comes out in angry bursts and avoidant behaviour. He is simply protecting himself and he doesn't know any other way.

I think the only way things will truly recover is if your husband tries to have some proper decent open and honest conversations with his DS, about the past, about what the DS went through and acknowledges his pain. I don't know how good your DH is with honest heartfelt communication but that is what required. And a lot of love (including boundaries but mainly involving investing time and interest) from him as well. Is there a hobby or regular activity they can do together to start the ball rolling?

'what am I supposed to do, he's my son'.

And?

He treats everyone else around him like shit. He's a adult. He is the son of his own parents who deserve a break from this shit show.

Frankly he should have raised his son better and if his son behaves like this, you don't enable it, you say no to it. Like you would a bratty toddler. Which is how the son behaves.

Frankly he should be more concerned about his parents in this dynamic than his son.

His son needs to grow the fuck up. It's time to stop letting him walk all over everyone else.

This is exactly how it plays out. Unfortunately H stroke years ago makes it hard for him to stay calm when provoked and he always feels bad after, hence SS pushing his buttons so my husband is always the once apologising after.

This is so true, I do feel SS needs professional help to talk through his feelings, but he won't initiate it and it has to come from him as he's an adult. H has had many heart to hearts with SS which didn't involve shouting and swearing and the past has also been discussed many times. They have shared many interests, fishing, football, golf and it lasts a short time, before SS disengages and so the cycle starts again....

Well you are fucked then.

And your SS will never sort his shit out. It'll ultimately kill your in laws.

And eventually your marriage.

Seriously, cut your loses.

Both your DH and SS have made lots of mistakes, but you expect a different response from them. You believe your SS should be ostracized for his bad behaviour but also expect your SS to brush your DHs bad behaviour under the carpet. I think good start would be your DH learning to manage his anger, so that situations do not become explosive. At the end of the day, you can be encouraged to pour fuel onto the fire by posters on here but it isn't going to help your situation. If your DCs were difficult, would you exclude them from Christmas?

I still say disengage, there is nothing you can change only your response.

So your partner chose you over his son. That explains EVERYTHING!

No wonder he doesn’t like you or want to be in the house which is “the scene of the crime” so to speak. He’s projecting blame onto his dad, you and your house for being abandoned as a teenager.

His Dad has possibly done irreparable damage to their relationship and to his son’s life. I’ll double down on my earlier post and say uninviting DS will not be helpful.

This is so true, I do feel SS needs professional help to talk through his feelings, but he won't initiate it and it has to come from him as he's an adult. H has had many heart to hearts with SS which didn't involve shouting and swearing and the past has also been discussed many times. They have shared many interests, fishing, football, golf and it lasts a short time, before SS disengages and so the cycle starts again....

He won't initiate it because it will feel like his family are saying there's something wrong with him. Remember he's been abandoned and internally believes that he's of no worth.

The only way it will work is if your DH takes accountability for his son's experience. He should suggest they go to family therapy together to talk over things and so your husband can make amends and try to undo some of the damage that was caused to DSS's thinking, and fully understand his perspective, whilst also coming to terms with a tumultuous time for himself as well. He should commit to doing this together with DSS, at a ringfence time, and paying for it, and also resume a chosen activity such as fishing / football where they can just spend unpressured time together.

I find myself feeling sorry for this young man. Crying after an argument with a parent is not usual for a 26 year old man. He’s clearly struggling with life and I wonder why, what went before?

I agree. It sounds as if his life has been a complete clusterfuck since he was 11, throughout his most difficult years, and the entirely predictable result is that he’s a mess. Unbelievable that some people’s response is that “he’s an adult now and should man up”. 🙄

100% agree but unfortunately I don’t think OP can see it this way.

i would urge you to take a massive step back and at least try, OP. DH was single for 5 years, living with IL. That became SS home. Safety net, after witnessing a difficult divorce. DH chose to leave home to start a new one, with Bella new family. Of course SS wasn’t keen to uproot himself and move into uncertainty with new people he barely knew. As soon as he said he wouldn’t go with DH said “that’s fine, stay. I will leave without you.” and leave he did. Regardless of if that was right or wrong, fair or unfair, in YOUR relationship with DH; to the young man in this situation it would absolutely feel like an abandonment.

Why is he self medicating with weed. Start there and unpack.
ps no to driving lessons whilst addicted he’ll lose the license very quickly

Never forget that suicide rates in young men are so fucking desperately high. Absolutely no compassion for his obviously low MH.

His DGP clearly see him struggling and clearly aren’t looking for a “break” from him on Christmas Day. They aren’t asking anyone to be offended on their behalf, they’re asking to spend Christmas all together.

Well if he wasn’t with the pils that he’s horrible to where would he be? On the street, in prison?
How much stress and angst would that cause in the family?

I would let him come - most won’t be as affected as you will be and oerhaps arrange counselling for DSS and DH after xmas

Years ago I remember listening to a conversation between my grandmother and great grandmother, she was saying she had to drown a litter of puppies her dog had had many years before . I was horrified and told her how utterly cruel she was and she told me bluntly that in them days you couldn’t afford to go to the vets to get dogs spayed, nor feed a dog who had had puppies. It was the norm to work day and night and still not have enough food for your children and dogs would roam free to scavenge food. Children left education early to work and bring in money else they would be expelled from the home because everyone had to pay their way in those grim, hard times.

My point is that even though them days are long gone, a 26 year old man has a responsibility in finding a full time job, to pay towards his keep, his nan is more than willing to pay for driving lessons so he has more chance of finding a full time job as it enables him to work further afield but he can’t be bothered.
His childhood being shit doesn’t give him the right to abuse his grandparents who are in their 80’s, who have given him stability in his life, nor to blatantly smoke weed in the house, after being repeatedly told not to, knowing full well his grandad has COPD and it could kill him.
He is a man not a child!

The thing is that when this kind of stuff happens with teens it does impact them and often for a very long time, sometimes for life.

It sounds like his sister was too young to really understand what was going on. At 11 he will have had a decent understanding that his parents were breaking up (and what that would mean). He will have had a good understanding of his father's stroke - in particular that it might have killed him and that he was at risk of another one.

And he will have had a good understanding of the financial reasons for the loss of the family home and moving in with the grandparents.

Any one of those would have been difficult for a teen and expected to cause issues; all three together is virtually guaranteed to give you a teen with mental health problems.

Some teens respond to these sort of stresses by "acting in" - self harming or developing an eating disorder. It sounds like he responded as many boys do by "acting out".

It also sounds like he did not feel at home or wanted anywhere if he was moving between mum and dads/grandparents frequently.

The final confirmation that he was not wanted by either parent will have been when his dad chose to move in with you rather than make sure that his son was properly launched into adult life.

I feel very very sorry for him.

Your husband is reaping what he sowed I'm afraid.

@Lifelessonsnotlearnt not your circus, not your monkeys.

SS has been enabled by the lot of them. He acts like a dick because they all allow him to. He never faces any consequences.

This isn't about you. If the in laws and DH are happy to live with SS and his arseholery, then let them. All you need to focus on is how you are treated in your own home. YOU do not need to enable anything and YOU can kick him out if he crosses any boundaries inside your own home. Otherwise, let them all get on with it. Stop being so emotionally invested in what a 26 year old brat does and says.

What’s going to happen to the man when his grandparents die? @Lifelessonsnotlearnt wont have him life at her house and be abused? Surely at 26 years of age he needs to learn right from wrong? All those blaming his parents are missing the point, he might of had a shit childhood but he’s got to take responsibility of himself, the world isn’t going to give him a free pass because he’s got hurty feelings. He is not 8 years old now, he’s bloody 26!