Why are so many men single

[Winter2028]

I know quite a few single men in their 30s. They all have jobs and their own properties. Their friend groups are also overwhelmingly single men; a single friend of mine who is a civil servant used to live in a houses where where all the men had similar jobs and all struggled to find girlfriends (the flatmates apparently railed a lot against 'feminazis'); another friend of mine (late 30s) socialises with a group of 6 friends where only 2 are in relationships (they are all nearly 40) and the rest are single not through choice.

This creates an impression that its hard to get a girlfriend and its because women have more choices and are more picky today (my friend don't think this is a bad thing but it also means they support things like government sponsored dating!) These men are probably not an anomaly as the rise of the far right is apparently correlated with the rise in single young men. However as a woman my impression is that many poor men are in relationships (my dh was a penniless graduate student when we married in our early 20s and his sisters also married men who were poor in their 30s; one of my SIL even had to share a hotel room with her MIL and baby and DH and she she is planning on having another baby with him). Sadly many abusive men are in relationships.

So what is the reason why so many men are not in relationship when women's expectations are hardly sky high. Is it lack of social opportunities (they do go on dates but my impression is the dates don't go anywhere). Is it lack of charisma (many uncharismatic men I know are also in relationships)?

I think the key word is ‘need’ as you’ve said here. I’ve been single since I was 35, but I don’t ‘need’ a man in the way men think women need them. I have money, a roof over my head, a car. The grass gets cut, the car is maintained, the bills are all paid, any extra money I may have I don’t have to explain any ‘treats’ I’ve bought myself or the kids. So if I was dating, someone would have to bring something exceptional to the table. I have no need to compromise as i already have everything I need for a nice life. Unfortunately most men I’ve known just want sex and looking after, thinking going to work is all they need to do to be a good choice (I know it’s not every man but it does seem to be a large number).

Yes but there is still the expectation to do that as well as the assumption that what everyone actually wants is marriage and kids. There are so many threads on here where if one of the people involved doesn’t have kids, she (never applies to blokes) is apparently jealous of the OP who does have kids (even if the OP is on benefits and living with what sounds like an abusive partner). There are also loads of threads where someone is upset because their partner hasn’t proposed after umpteen years and then it turns out said partner is lazy and cheats yet STILL this woman wants to marry him. In my sisters friendship group there are several couples and the women are OBSESSED with being a wife (or wifey as they say).

My son is 23 and doesn't have a girlfriend, and no, he's not gay, he just doesn't want the drama as he calls it! Several of his graduate friends (from Uni and work) have the same outlook and opinion. They're in no hurry to get married and have children as they want to "live" as they call it. They want the freedom to go to football every Saturday, or to go for "lad's" holidays, or pub quiz nights, etc., together with no obligation, no drama, etc. He has different "groups" of friends, some from work, some from Uni, some from his home town, and just loves to "flit" in between different groups, no obligation. No tantrums or sulks if he doesn't fancy football one weekend, or wants to go to a pub quiz with his work group instead of his Uni friend group, etc.

@taxguru your son seems to have quite a misogynistic view of women if this is actually how he views them. Sulking, drama, tantrums - he does realise that women do mature beyond the age of 3 right? Obviously he’s young and you’d hope at 23 men and women would want to enjoy life before thinking of marriage anyway. Sounds like he’s really not ready for marriage for a good while yet.

Just seems so sad all this cynicism and grim
porn consumption. Benefits no one men or women. Just be normal and find a nice girl who is your equivalent and face life together. Megan Fox is not going to turn up at your front door.

What so the gullible women have no say in the matter?

I used to read the newspaper lonely hearts on my commute in the evening and it was full of older men with rather dull hobbies looking for slim young attractive women. I admired their confidence but they were not very realistic especially as studies suggest women tend to ‘marry up’.

I'm 47, not desperate for a man. I have my own home, I can take a car to the mechanics without being ripped off, I work, I can pay my bills. I have a good life and good social life too.

If I were to meet a man that complimented my life then great but I don't need one.

I do miss the little things like someone to talk to about my day or pick up cat food on their way home but that's about it (other than sex obviously).

I'm not surprised at them.
If I had a 45 yo brain at 25, I'd be single all my life.
Fortunately, no children.

If there's loads of single men in their 30s does this mean there's loads of single women too?

The two blokes I know who are single in their 30s had relationships where they were treated appallingly in their 20s, they don't want to date again. Just happy being single

Sad. Think most
of us have had shit relationships in our twenties it’s a learning curve can’t imagine not getting up and dusting myself down to find someone better just giving up entirely.

Thinking about it an ex would rant about gold
diggers he was flat broke and I paid for everything but somehow that didn’t occur to him…

👍

Exactly!

are there?

In my experience older women seem to enjoy the post-divorce life more than older men. The men are the ones who try to leap back into married life.

This.
Finally.....finally....young women are raising the bar and the men don't like it. Their dented egos are everywhere.

I wholeheartedly agree with this. So many relationships are equal(ish) before children and then The Slide happens. Women are more aware of this happening and are opting out - who can blame them? You get a good education and a career, not to mention independence, then watch it all drain away when you're stuck in a dull part-time job to work around school pick ups/drop offs and financially reliant on your partner who is trying to act as if his life didn't change (of course he needs several evenings and most of the weekends for his hobby, he works full time! ) and wondering where your life went.

And there's no way back.

Many men want a housekeeper, sex toy and mother for their children, not an equal. Many won't say it but they actually rather like a "traditional" set up because it benefits them. Women aren't willing to put up with that so they choose to stay single. Men need to step up if they don't bloody like it.

it’s a learning curve can’t imagine not getting up and dusting myself down to find someone better just giving up entirely.

Who says it's "giving up"? Maybe women look around after a relationship ends and decide that they're actually happier on their own. There's a reason behind the statistic of "men are happier in a relationship, women are happier without one". Many women I know - me included - who come out of long term relationships in their 30s and onwards decide that actually they're happier single.

Why would he have given up by 22?

I think the normalising of constantly being on a phone means we're raising all subsequent generations to be completely unpractised at casual conversation and eye contact. We had youth clubs, discos, pubs and even commuting or travelling where we'd talk to strangers and be used to being with whatever sex we were into. Now, what routine do children and teenagers have of being with, then later kissing or fumbling around with like we did as teens (not so much on a commute, obviously)?

Generally for more social improvement for everyone we need to re-build Third Spaces and have a place that everyone in the community can access and regularly spend time together. How on earth will people get together when apps are gamified fuck-arounds that have shown are demonstrably worse for women's outcomes, and everyone gets anxiety speaking to a stranger in real life?

I'd like to believe that women are much more discerning now but I still know of plenty of abusive relationships of younger women, sadly.

I can’t speak for all now single women who gave up their 20s for a serious (and ultimately bad) relationship. But honestly, I am the someone better I found. This more mature version of myself, who doesn’t need to rely on anyone, who is very happy in her own company yet has friends and a social life - truly the thought of ‘finding someone else’ isn’t a goal in life, at the moment I can’t see how it would make my life ‘better’ in any sense.

He finds it hard to meet anyone. He goes out sometimes but he says it’s hard when you are out, no one really wants to chat and he says he finds dating apps a bit grim and it feels really uncomfortable basically looking through a woman’s photos and a few lines of text. He said he goes through phases of chatting to women on dating apps but that no one actually wants to meet up, they just want to chat endlessly.

The more time goes on as well, I think the more his confidence get knocked.

My son is in his early 30's. He has an economics degree, a very good job, owns (with mortgage) his own property and a very wide circle of friends and is happily single. Every year he has a summer full of wedding invitations (and has been best man/usher a fair number of times). He has no real interest in changing his status any time soon as he enjoys the freedom he has.
Tbh I don't blame him at all.

Some of these generalisations about men get right up my nose. I do not want a housekeeper, or a cook, or a cleaner, or a sex toy. And I especially don't want a mother for my children because I don't want any *** children either! I accept the irony on a parenting forum. I would like an equal female partner and anyone who dares suggest otherwise can go away with maximum prejudice.

Some Men are like women they would rather nail and bail than have all the drama.
Plus men cant do wrong right.

they just chill out, enjoy the single life, and then if someone comes along, then fair enough

I always feel so heartened when I read about young people (male or female) doing this. I did it in my 20s and sometimes felt like the odd one out for not chasing relationships or commitment, but it was great. I was only ever going to have a relationship if it enhanced my life without question and in every aspect. And DP came along and did just that. I'd have been contentedly single indefinitely though.

I dont even know where to begin with this one. Nail and bail 🤢. And ‘drama’ seems to be code for ‘my girlfriend expects me to act like a mature adult who can wash his own clothes and hoover without being told’. The first part of your posts explains why people think so little of men.

Are you a sulky, possessive drama llama who has tantrums? Where has he got these awful ideas about women?

23 is quite young so it is understandable that he doesn’t want to settle down but to justify it by making nasty assumptions about women in general is not very admirable.