Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?

584 replies

Allinarow48 · 10/12/2024 21:43

Having nightmares over old friends visit.

One of my closest friends is coming to visit over Christmas, after 10 years living abroad with only ocassional visits I should be excited but I’m actually terrified.

I was best mates with “Jane” since we were kids, we lived together during college and were absolutely inseparable. We really, really loved each other for years and went through a lot together. She is also good friends with my DH and my DD loves her.

During her time abroad she has met a lovely man, had a beautiful son (age 2) and started her own business.

She’s always suffered badly with depression and anxiety and her mental health has been fragile. Although in her new country she found some excellent therapists who really helped her. However lately she seems to be spiralling .

It started during Covid, I think she got very deep into social media. She’s always been very politically active and since she had her son the plight of children in Gaza has been a huge focus for her.

She’s always been very vehemently anti Israel since I’ve known her (We’re Irish and that’s very normal here).

She began to post pro-Hamas stuff just after the 7/11 attacks on Israel and immediately shared Hamas videos of the attacks ( the murder of Israelis and desecration of corpses etc.) With added commentary “This is beautiful to me.” “This is how freedom is gained.” Etc. A lot of Irish people are still quite pro-IRA and once again the support of Hamas isn’t that unusual but actually sharing the videos was extreme.

She then started posting videos of dead Gazan children pretty much continuously. Due to the time difference I can see most of her posting is done at night. I think she posts while feeding her son. Videos accompanied by “This is me.” “This is my son.” “I am Palestine.” kind of stuff. She said in one post that her ability to care for her son has been affected by the secondary trauma of what happening in Gaza.

Then recently she began to go from “Death to Israel” to “Death to the Jews.” She posted in Arabic and I translated it. It was an insta story and then disappeared. And since then she’s pretty much transitioned from anti-Israel to Anti-western and fairly drastic Antisemetic stuff “They didn’t gas enough of you” that kind of thing.

Then she went on to say recently that anyone who doesn’t agree with her should kill themselves or be killed and burn in hell etc…

Now here’s the thing: I’m Jewish, non practicing, I have relatives in Israel and lost a friend to the Hamas attacks. I’m disgusted by the Israeli government at the moment and have a lot of sympathy for the Gazan people but I don’t hate the Israeli people either. I am actually quite middle of the road politically.

Being Irish, Jewishness is is not something I have ever advertised and I’m actually not sure I’ve I ever told her. If she’s aware and doesn’t care or has forgotten and doesn’t mind me seeing her posts.

My mistake is that I never responded to any of her posts and never argued with her. She seems to think we’re totally cool. So she contacted me wanting to see me over Christmas for a day or 2.

I’ve been having nightmares about it. I’m scared I’ll say something or do something that upsets her and she freaks out, or something I do or don’t say triggers her mental heath problems and she hurts herself. I also feel bad that my dishonesty caused this situation. If I has said something last year she would probably have ditched me and never wanted to see me again.

I would like some advice on how to proceed.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
JaneJeffer · 11/12/2024 22:37

It’s wrong to judge all of Israel but fine to judge all of Ireland

AnxiousRose · 11/12/2024 22:40

It is important to differentiate Israel from the Israeli government.

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 00:13

The responses here do seem to be mostly Irish people taking an issue that affects Jewish people, probably the most oppressed group in human history, and making it all about their hurt feelings.

AnxiousRose · 12/12/2024 00:33

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 00:13

The responses here do seem to be mostly Irish people taking an issue that affects Jewish people, probably the most oppressed group in human history, and making it all about their hurt feelings.

Oh yes let's add egocentric to our list of character traits for Irish people.
We are creating a lovely list on this thread.

ACatNamedRobin · 12/12/2024 00:35

AnxiousRose · 12/12/2024 00:33

Oh yes let's add egocentric to our list of character traits for Irish people.
We are creating a lovely list on this thread.

@AnxiousRose
But you're not able to disprove what @BeSnappyOtter said?
Just trying to detail so her point isn't addressed?

JaneJeffer · 12/12/2024 00:35

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 00:13

The responses here do seem to be mostly Irish people taking an issue that affects Jewish people, probably the most oppressed group in human history, and making it all about their hurt feelings.

Can you explain further what you mean?

AnxiousRose · 12/12/2024 00:41

ACatNamedRobin · 12/12/2024 00:35

@AnxiousRose
But you're not able to disprove what @BeSnappyOtter said?
Just trying to detail so her point isn't addressed?

Disprove what she said?
That the Jewish people are the most opressed group in human history?

Daradarina · 12/12/2024 00:46

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 00:13

The responses here do seem to be mostly Irish people taking an issue that affects Jewish people, probably the most oppressed group in human history, and making it all about their hurt feelings.

I don’t think that’s fair.

What is someone meant to do when accused of being pro-terrorist and anti-semitic?

Finding such an accusation very upsetting and denying it with great feeling shouldn’t be considered ‘making it all about you’ imho.
It’s very normal.

I really think a polite silence following the accusations would have been misinterpreted as an acceptance that they were true too.

Which they are not.

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 01:43

Think about what OP's friend actually said. Then think about what you're making this thread about.

JaneJeffer · 12/12/2024 02:14

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 01:43

Think about what OP's friend actually said. Then think about what you're making this thread about.

Why don't you think about what the OP said?

A lot of Irish people are still quite pro-IRA and once again the support of Hamas isn’t that unusual

Are we supposed to let this go unchallenged?

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 02:15

And also about what OP actually said. Does using a like "A Lot" warrant this outrage? "A Lot" is a relative term. For some people a lot might be 5% for some 50% If the thing being measured is Hamas supporters in a western nation then 5% is a lot.

JaneJeffer · 12/12/2024 02:15

And it was the OP who made the thread about Irish people, nobody else.

JaneJeffer · 12/12/2024 02:16

Let's not start trying to work out what percentage a lot is. It won't end well.

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 02:20

OK...I did some cursory googling and If you're worried about the international image of Ireland, have a word with your far left politicians who tweeted these on October 7th 2023 while the massacre was still happening and the murder videos were still streaming. Or your elected city councillor who still hasn't been fired for regurgitating nazi propaganda at a government meeting.

These people might not represent most Irish people but they got enough support to be voted into those positions and they thought the political and social culture friendly enough to their ideas to support them. They ran for election again so I’m assuming they weren’t run out of politics with pitchforks… That is indeed quite a lot of support for outright terrorism supporters and antisemites in a progressive country.

AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?
AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?
AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?
BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 02:28

JaneJeffer · 12/12/2024 02:14

Why don't you think about what the OP said?

A lot of Irish people are still quite pro-IRA and once again the support of Hamas isn’t that unusual

Are we supposed to let this go unchallenged?

If someone said to me that a lot of Danish people are really racist I would say "Yes they are." Content that while true it doesn't apply to me. and I would go live my life.

JaneJeffer · 12/12/2024 02:36

Do you realise the impact of saying Irish people support the IRA on a British website?

Happiestwhen · 12/12/2024 03:52

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 02:20

OK...I did some cursory googling and If you're worried about the international image of Ireland, have a word with your far left politicians who tweeted these on October 7th 2023 while the massacre was still happening and the murder videos were still streaming. Or your elected city councillor who still hasn't been fired for regurgitating nazi propaganda at a government meeting.

These people might not represent most Irish people but they got enough support to be voted into those positions and they thought the political and social culture friendly enough to their ideas to support them. They ran for election again so I’m assuming they weren’t run out of politics with pitchforks… That is indeed quite a lot of support for outright terrorism supporters and antisemites in a progressive country.

Is he not right though? Why are the US so afraid to go against Israel?

Greywhippet · 12/12/2024 07:34

Come on mumsnet just delete this thread already!

  • Everyone agrees that the sentiments expressed by the friend that were antisemitic are disgusting and should have been fully called out at the time by anyone who saw them, including the OP
  • There are really offensive generalisations about the Irish including accusations of sympathy with terrorists - this causes significant upset to all those of us that remember the troubles.
  • There are offensive remarks about people protesting the genocide- that OPs friend is ‘an outlier but not that much of an outlier’ - smears all of the people on those marches. OPs friend is very much an outlier
  • It still seems spurious in the least that the OP wouldn’t have called her friend out long ago if the relationship was as stated in the OP. My feeling is that the OP is made up precisely to cause the kind of responses seen on the thread- to sew disharmony
Daradarina · 12/12/2024 07:36

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 01:43

Think about what OP's friend actually said. Then think about what you're making this thread about.

OP’s dilemma has been discussed a lot and posters (including myself) have given her our opinions on what she should do.
Stay well away from her friend with the disgusting opinions is the consensus. It’s been quite clear.

As I explained, it was also necessary to address orher things she said which were extremely damaging.

OpheliaWasntMad · 12/12/2024 07:41

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 02:28

If someone said to me that a lot of Danish people are really racist I would say "Yes they are." Content that while true it doesn't apply to me. and I would go live my life.

I agree. I don’t understand why some of the posters on here are so defensive. There are racists and anti semites in every country. I think it’s fine to challenge the claim that support for IRA is in anyway widespread but I don’t think we have to turn this whole thread into a defence of Ireland. Some people on this thread have negative experiences of Ireland. I think they should be allowed to describe their experience as long as they don’t imply their experience is typical of the country as a whole.

OpheliaWasntMad · 12/12/2024 07:44

Daradarina · 12/12/2024 07:36

OP’s dilemma has been discussed a lot and posters (including myself) have given her our opinions on what she should do.
Stay well away from her friend with the disgusting opinions is the consensus. It’s been quite clear.

As I explained, it was also necessary to address orher things she said which were extremely damaging.

I agree the thread has run its course. The OP’s friend has harmful and hateful views . Everyone has agreed that. The OP should know exactly what to do .

the7Vabo · 12/12/2024 07:47

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 02:28

If someone said to me that a lot of Danish people are really racist I would say "Yes they are." Content that while true it doesn't apply to me. and I would go live my life.

That’s really a personal decision for you.

However you are completing ignoring Irish history. That history includes the IRA blowing up children in the UK. Not to mention the violence that the IRA inflicted on “it’s own” people.

My father was born in Northern Ireland and lived there during the height of the whole mess.

I also have first hand experience of witnessing racism against an Irish person in the UK.

So it is not acceptable to post on a UK website that “a lot” of Irish people support the IRA. It is not in any way comparable to The Netherlands.

Trimbleton · 12/12/2024 07:50

BeSnappyOtter · 12/12/2024 02:20

OK...I did some cursory googling and If you're worried about the international image of Ireland, have a word with your far left politicians who tweeted these on October 7th 2023 while the massacre was still happening and the murder videos were still streaming. Or your elected city councillor who still hasn't been fired for regurgitating nazi propaganda at a government meeting.

These people might not represent most Irish people but they got enough support to be voted into those positions and they thought the political and social culture friendly enough to their ideas to support them. They ran for election again so I’m assuming they weren’t run out of politics with pitchforks… That is indeed quite a lot of support for outright terrorism supporters and antisemites in a progressive country.

Google some UK councillors and MPs , you will find some similar views. Some in the far left and other groups have some very unpalatable pro Hamas views, but that’s globally, not just in Ireland and it’s a disgrace.

The Irish PMs view is aligned with plenty of other countries and it would be wrong to conflate that with anti semitism.

the7Vabo · 12/12/2024 07:50

OpheliaWasntMad · 12/12/2024 07:41

I agree. I don’t understand why some of the posters on here are so defensive. There are racists and anti semites in every country. I think it’s fine to challenge the claim that support for IRA is in anyway widespread but I don’t think we have to turn this whole thread into a defence of Ireland. Some people on this thread have negative experiences of Ireland. I think they should be allowed to describe their experience as long as they don’t imply their experience is typical of the country as a whole.

The OP spoke several times about the Irish in sweeping generalisations - “a lot” are pro IRA, easily offended and selfish. Such sweeping generalisations against Irish people are not acceptable and nobody should be trying to defend that on the thread which ironically is about discrimination and hatred.

OpheliaWasntMad · 12/12/2024 07:53

the7Vabo · 12/12/2024 07:47

That’s really a personal decision for you.

However you are completing ignoring Irish history. That history includes the IRA blowing up children in the UK. Not to mention the violence that the IRA inflicted on “it’s own” people.

My father was born in Northern Ireland and lived there during the height of the whole mess.

I also have first hand experience of witnessing racism against an Irish person in the UK.

So it is not acceptable to post on a UK website that “a lot” of Irish people support the IRA. It is not in any way comparable to The Netherlands.

”A lot” is such a vague phrase. I definitely agree the phrase needs to be challenged as it suggests those views are much more widespread.
There are still tensions in the North and absolutely NO ONE in my experience wants to go back to the sectarian violence of the past

Swipe left for the next trending thread