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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?

584 replies

Allinarow48 · 10/12/2024 21:43

Having nightmares over old friends visit.

One of my closest friends is coming to visit over Christmas, after 10 years living abroad with only ocassional visits I should be excited but I’m actually terrified.

I was best mates with “Jane” since we were kids, we lived together during college and were absolutely inseparable. We really, really loved each other for years and went through a lot together. She is also good friends with my DH and my DD loves her.

During her time abroad she has met a lovely man, had a beautiful son (age 2) and started her own business.

She’s always suffered badly with depression and anxiety and her mental health has been fragile. Although in her new country she found some excellent therapists who really helped her. However lately she seems to be spiralling .

It started during Covid, I think she got very deep into social media. She’s always been very politically active and since she had her son the plight of children in Gaza has been a huge focus for her.

She’s always been very vehemently anti Israel since I’ve known her (We’re Irish and that’s very normal here).

She began to post pro-Hamas stuff just after the 7/11 attacks on Israel and immediately shared Hamas videos of the attacks ( the murder of Israelis and desecration of corpses etc.) With added commentary “This is beautiful to me.” “This is how freedom is gained.” Etc. A lot of Irish people are still quite pro-IRA and once again the support of Hamas isn’t that unusual but actually sharing the videos was extreme.

She then started posting videos of dead Gazan children pretty much continuously. Due to the time difference I can see most of her posting is done at night. I think she posts while feeding her son. Videos accompanied by “This is me.” “This is my son.” “I am Palestine.” kind of stuff. She said in one post that her ability to care for her son has been affected by the secondary trauma of what happening in Gaza.

Then recently she began to go from “Death to Israel” to “Death to the Jews.” She posted in Arabic and I translated it. It was an insta story and then disappeared. And since then she’s pretty much transitioned from anti-Israel to Anti-western and fairly drastic Antisemetic stuff “They didn’t gas enough of you” that kind of thing.

Then she went on to say recently that anyone who doesn’t agree with her should kill themselves or be killed and burn in hell etc…

Now here’s the thing: I’m Jewish, non practicing, I have relatives in Israel and lost a friend to the Hamas attacks. I’m disgusted by the Israeli government at the moment and have a lot of sympathy for the Gazan people but I don’t hate the Israeli people either. I am actually quite middle of the road politically.

Being Irish, Jewishness is is not something I have ever advertised and I’m actually not sure I’ve I ever told her. If she’s aware and doesn’t care or has forgotten and doesn’t mind me seeing her posts.

My mistake is that I never responded to any of her posts and never argued with her. She seems to think we’re totally cool. So she contacted me wanting to see me over Christmas for a day or 2.

I’ve been having nightmares about it. I’m scared I’ll say something or do something that upsets her and she freaks out, or something I do or don’t say triggers her mental heath problems and she hurts herself. I also feel bad that my dishonesty caused this situation. If I has said something last year she would probably have ditched me and never wanted to see me again.

I would like some advice on how to proceed.

OP posts:
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10
bridgetreilly · 11/12/2024 15:22

You need to say no. “You may never have known that I am Jewish, but I am, and I find I can no longer be friends with someone who posts the kind of antisemitic content you regularly do. We won’t be meeting up this Christmas, or at all.”

SoNiceToComeHomeTo · 11/12/2024 15:40

The anti-semitic aggression must be terrible to hear from someone who used to be a friend, but even if you were not being personally attacked, there's a good case for avoiding contact with her angry, vindictive energy. I don't think I would want to see a friend who had become like this.

Carriemac · 11/12/2024 16:02

I travel a lot between the uk and Ireland and there is a lot more pro Palestinian support in my rural small town that the city I live in in the UK.

Username2532 · 11/12/2024 16:32

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 07:33

“A lot” of Irish people are easily offended. Switch “Irish” for “Jewish” there OP. Would it be acceptable to say “A lot of Jewish people” are easily offended? Of course not. So please don’t say it about Irish people after aligning “a lot” of Irish people with a terrorist organisation.

Really sums it up.

Travelodge · 11/12/2024 16:48

She is antisemitic. She is a racist. She is a supporter of people who boasted about the rape, torture, murder and abduction of civilians, including children.

Be brave. Stand up for decency and tell her that as you have Jewish heritage you are very upset by her beliefs and no longer feel you can meet her or be friendly with her.

I know it would be easier to make an excuse, but it would be much better for her to realise that she actually liked someone she hadn’t realised was Jewish. It just might give her a jolt.

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 17:10

Carriemac · 11/12/2024 16:02

I travel a lot between the uk and Ireland and there is a lot more pro Palestinian support in my rural small town that the city I live in in the UK.

It doenst mean that Irish people are anti-Jewish

ForkHandlesNotFourCandles · 11/12/2024 17:19

Daradarina · 11/12/2024 13:14

Seriously?!

Why are you listening to @ACatNamedRobin and not all the Irish posters on here?

Who’ve lived here far longer and are better placed to judge from the inside out. Who know what’s going on and are less likely to be swayed by foreign publications.

Is it possible you’re biased maybe?

Why do you think Israel is hitting out at Ireland, one of its harshest critics?
Surveys have shown time and again that we aren’t more anti-semitic than Europe as a whole.

For heavens sake think about it. Look up the surveys etc. Ones from unbiased sources please!

Yes, as I said upthread there are dickheads and stupid people everywhere and there will be incidents in Ireland unfortunately like those described upthread, but this really feels like a smear campaign now.

Derry born family in Tipperary and Westmeath aswell

Im Irish ( if you read the thread )
Im happy to read the news thanks and it seems quite clear there is a problem.
Just like increases in anti semitism in other countries
Ive read about those too.
Im not swayed by MNs, I read the news and talk to people.

JaneJeffer · 11/12/2024 17:21

Can you share your news source @ForkHandlesNotFourCandles?

ForkHandlesNotFourCandles · 11/12/2024 17:42

JaneJeffer · 11/12/2024 17:21

Can you share your news source @ForkHandlesNotFourCandles?

I can’t link
I don’t know why
I posted headlines previously and noted articles in The Times of Israel and Jewish News etc
Here’s some others, the articles are definitely worth a read for anyone who reads the news and is interested

AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?
AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?
ForkHandlesNotFourCandles · 11/12/2024 17:46

There also an interesting article by the chief rabbi in The Times Of Israel

AIBU to be having nightmares over friends visit?
JaneJeffer · 11/12/2024 17:56

Rabbi Wieder speaks a lot about feelings Jewish people have but not about any actual incidents of antisemitism.

badwolf82 · 11/12/2024 18:02

This would be friendship ending for me. But, its possible this is a symptom of PPD/PPA. You could gently try to have a word with her if you are concerned for her mental health. But honestly in my book poor mental health isn’t an excuse for severe antisemitism. I’ve had enough directed at me for decades that I don’t really care anymore to see the person behind the bigotry. Just block/ghost and move on.

Carriemac · 11/12/2024 18:06

@the7Vabo I agree I don't think Irish people are anti semetic , just that you see more uncritical pro Palestine stuff

Elsvieta · 11/12/2024 18:47

"Death to the Jews"? "Didn't gas enough of you"?

It's very odd to me that you're even considering seeing or speaking to her ever again, and even odder that you're worried about "upsetting" HER. Cut her dead.

Freeyourminds · 11/12/2024 20:27

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Greywhippet · 11/12/2024 20:42

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I’ve also reported this thread (twice) and had responses saying that no guidelines are being broken. And I don’t like being accused of troll hunting either. This is a disingenuous thread and the unsubstantiated slurs about Ireland are ridiculous

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 20:45

ForkHandlesNotFourCandles · 11/12/2024 17:19

Derry born family in Tipperary and Westmeath aswell

Im Irish ( if you read the thread )
Im happy to read the news thanks and it seems quite clear there is a problem.
Just like increases in anti semitism in other countries
Ive read about those too.
Im not swayed by MNs, I read the news and talk to people.

Edited

There is an increase is anti-Semitism everywhere including Ireland, it's not acceptable but it is not an Irish issue/problem. There are widespread media reports of an increase elsewhere:

https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20240125-anti-semitic-acts-nearly-quadrupled-last-year-in-france-says-jewish-organisation

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 20:57

Carriemac · 11/12/2024 18:06

@the7Vabo I agree I don't think Irish people are anti semetic , just that you see more uncritical pro Palestine stuff

I wouldn't disagree, but I think the distinction is crucial. I also think it's important to say that uncritical pro Palestine stuff doesn't, as far as I have come across, include support for October 7 or any call for violence or other negative action against Jewish people.

I also think the experience in a small Irish town likely differs to that in cities, though perhaps less so than between Ireland and the UK.

My issue with the OP is that she could have asked her question without mentioning Ireland at all, not to mind the IRA, and then she doubled down accusing Irish people of being easily offended and selfish.

There is a huge amount of nuance when discussing Palestine and language matters.

Her friends comments stand alone. The dilemma is the same no matter what nationality her friend is. If you actively support the death of Jewish people your nationality is irrelevant. It's almost like the OP threw in the "a lot" of Irish people are pro-IRA to let her friend off the hook somehow.

ForkHandlesNotFourCandles · 11/12/2024 21:04

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 20:45

There is an increase is anti-Semitism everywhere including Ireland, it's not acceptable but it is not an Irish issue/problem. There are widespread media reports of an increase elsewhere:

https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20240125-anti-semitic-acts-nearly-quadrupled-last-year-in-france-says-jewish-organisation

Which I noted in my fourth line, ‘Just like increases in anti semitism in other countries’.

I disagree with your comment ‘it is not an Irish issue / problem’.

All anti-Semitism is a problem irrespective of the country. If it exists and if it’s on the rise it’s a problem.

JaneJeffer · 11/12/2024 21:08

There is an increase is anti-Semitism everywhere including Ireland
Apart from the man who got attacked in a nightclub there are no incidents. I suppose one attack is an increase on no attacks but hardly proof of widespread antisemitism.

AnxiousRose · 11/12/2024 21:20

I have reported this thread too.

Don't know why it is allowed.

Lots of posts disagreeing with the OP were deleted. I guess it's OK to say Irish people support terrorism but not ok to say they don't.

JaneJeffer · 11/12/2024 21:23

It seems it's fine to call us antisemites, terrorist supporters or whatever you want. If we complain we'll get deleted. Unlike MN our patience is endless.

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 21:32

ForkHandlesNotFourCandles · 11/12/2024 21:04

Which I noted in my fourth line, ‘Just like increases in anti semitism in other countries’.

I disagree with your comment ‘it is not an Irish issue / problem’.

All anti-Semitism is a problem irrespective of the country. If it exists and if it’s on the rise it’s a problem.

That isn’t what I meant. Of course it’s a problem that has to be dealt with.

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 21:35

JaneJeffer · 11/12/2024 21:23

It seems it's fine to call us antisemites, terrorist supporters or whatever you want. If we complain we'll get deleted. Unlike MN our patience is endless.

And to add insult to injury have posters from countries where Jews have been murdered for centuries say they are upset about the Irish attitude towards Jewish people. Then saying Israel has no choice but to do what they are doing, so it seems they are conflating different things.

ForkHandlesNotFourCandles · 11/12/2024 22:35

the7Vabo · 11/12/2024 21:35

And to add insult to injury have posters from countries where Jews have been murdered for centuries say they are upset about the Irish attitude towards Jewish people. Then saying Israel has no choice but to do what they are doing, so it seems they are conflating different things.

I think the problem is the use of the word Israel in this context.
On the Conflict in the Middle East Threads it became very confusing.

Better to say Israeli Government or just Netanyahu. It’s wrong to judge all of Israel and certainly wrong to automatically judge all Jewish people.

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