Page 6 | To think that *Some men steal the joy

Vodkaandpepsimax · 2024-12-08T21:49:57+00:00

Out of life? I see it around me, with friend’s husbands and then often have it at home with mine and also grew up with a dad who veered between super fun, very imaginative and funny to very grumpy…It would feel like a lot revolved around his mood, whereas mum stayed pretty constant (or pretended to be at least) Yesterday, trying to get all christmassy (I enjoy it all and especially for dd, 6’s sake) went to a christmas event, Dh silent in the car, me singing along awkwardly with dd to a Mr Tumble xmas cd. It was very busy when we arrived, lots of time to park, yes annoying, but dh so moody about it, I offer to drive/park, he snaps back. Complains about queues for the hot chocolate…just takes the joy out of the experience. I’ve booked for just dd and I to go to see The Nutcracker as I know it will be a much nicer, special experience just us, but obviously need to do things as a family. Anyone else in this situation

5475878237NC · 09/12/2024 07:59

GreyCarpet · 09/12/2024 07:44

Once again, I find myself posting on a thread about "all", sorry 'most' men, and not recognising the description of 'men'.

Again, I have never had a serious relationship with a man who has sucked the joy out of things or been deliberately miserable. Or just not prepared to join in with the fun.

My ex husband was fun when we were together. He never spoilt anyone else's enjoyment of anything. He enjoyed things that children enjoyed because the children were enjoying them as much as he generally enjoyed them himself.

My current partner is the same.

This year, we took our (adult) children pumpkin picking and had a pumpkin carving competition with them.

My daughter and I usually decorate the tree together, but she's away at university this year so my adult (26) son came round to do it with me. My partner didn't pass a single coment about the fact we sang along to The Muppet Chritmas Carol while we did it and spent an hour or so in the kitchen making sausage rolls from scratch, baking camembert and making mulled wine for when we'd finished. Then he put up fairy lights around the living room and said how much he loved them.

We have loads of 'fun' things planned for Christmas and he's looking forward to grandchildren coming along so we can do fun things with the children again. He's 60.

But then, I always prioritised being 'able to have fun' in a man.

Maybe some women prioritise different things when looking for a life partner but treating me as an equal (including in the division of household labour) and the ability to find the fun were very important to me. More important (and attractive) than height, income and looks anyway.

The bottom line is that if your husband is a lazy, sulky, moody fun sucker, it's because you married a lazy, sulky, moody fun sucker. Not because all/most men are crap.

And, if you find you have married one of these men, leave him at home to wallow in his own grumpiness and take the children out/do things on your own.

I definitely didn't marry a fun sucker. He's evolved into one.

MagicSteaks · 09/12/2024 08:03

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oldladywithdog · 09/12/2024 08:05

CatNoon · 08/12/2024 21:55

It’s because men, most men, are fundamentally far more selfish and self-centred than (most) women are. They don’t bother making an effort to enjoy something for someone else’s sake. They don’t care or can’t see or choose not to see how their foul mood affects everyone else. They feel a sense of entitlement to their grumpiness. And this seems to just get worse the older they get.

Exactly this. My DH enjoys cricket - I have no interest in it but I go along to matches and just enjoy the day as it's something he wants to do. However, if he has to do something I enjoy (that he doesn't) he does suck all the joy from it by moaning and general grumpiness. So like the OP I book things for myself and DD /DSD.

The thing is I don't remember him being like this when we first met (second marriage), either I was blind to it or he put on a bit of a show and now he doesn't have to 😩

Greentreesandbushes · 09/12/2024 08:05

OP what happens when you pull him up on it? My DH gets pulled up on his moodiness, he can be sullen, he has ruined many meals out, I have list friends to it. I’m strongly considering divorce.

Sharptonguedwoman · 09/12/2024 08:05

crockofshite · 08/12/2024 22:39

If you want to do things as a 'family' you really have to be in agreement about the activity you plan to do together.

Be honest with each other about what you both want to do with your leisure time. There must be something you both like doing together.

I mean, for example, how would you like to spend 4 hours traipsing around the golf course after him if he's really keen on golf and you'd rather be at a knitting convention.

You can do stuff that only interests you, he can do stuff that only interests him, together you do something that you both want to do.

If you can't agree on anything you both want to do, you are probably incompatible .......

Don't you think we all have to do things we wouldn't perhaps opt for, for our children? I could tolerate being stuck in a soft play centre/indoor playzone because DD loved them. ExDP, not so much.

5475878237NC · 09/12/2024 08:09

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Some of the unwritten rules of social and intimate relationships. Like it's not all about any one person's needs or preferences...The idea of putting our feelings aside to facilitate an experience and desired outcome for the other not the self.

gannett · 09/12/2024 08:12

I don't recognise fun sponge traits as gendered at all. Being child-free I see it more in group situations like: restaurants, where one person always insists on nitpicking and asking to see the manager; parties where everyone's getting nice and convivial except one spouse with a cat's bum face who wants to go home early and take their partner with them; nights out where one person always brings the mood down with an insecure emotional meltdown. That person is as likely to be a woman as a man in my experience.

I've also hung out with parent friends and their kids in plenty of child-oriented scenarios and I can't say I've seen much fun-sponge behaviour from either mums or dads, though both mums and dads certainly do their share of moaning about how tedious it all is afterwards!

Enforcing jollity is also a very annoying trait. I am not sure why anyone should be expected to be smiley and cheery when stood in a mile-long outdoor queue in single-degree weather. One of the reasons I'm child-free is because I know I have almost zero suck-it-up capacity in unpleasant or boring situations, and all of these "fun family days out" described in this thread frankly sound like hell. If I had to go to a kids' Christmas adventure park I would be a sullen misery within 30 minutes and it would be justified.

PrincessPeache · 09/12/2024 08:13

My DP can be a bit like this, but he has quite bad social anxiety and was agoraphobic for almost a decade before we met - he’d just overcome it about a year before we started dating. It bothered me a lot at first but then I put aside the picture in my head of the perfect family and I just do what works for us.

Which means I take DS on holidays, often without DP but I also make sure we plan trips that he will enjoy too and can come along with. I do more days out with DS and we have an agreement that if I ask him to come, it means it’s important to me that we do this activity as a family and he will put every effort into being in a positive mood and making it a good experience. If it’s not important to me, I make it very clear - “you’re welcome to join us, you’re always welcome, but it’s absolutely fine if you want to skip it. It’s not the sort of thing I’d expect you to enjoy”.

I make sure we spend lots of time the three of us in situations DP doesn’t find overwhelming too so DS will have lots of happy memories of us as a family doing things together. He’s an excellent parent to DS and we definitely have different strengths but that works for us.

MagicSteaks · 09/12/2024 08:19

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Skyrainlight · 09/12/2024 08:21

I think this can be the case for both men and women. I hate the saying 'happy wife happy life', because it implies that unless the wife is happy she's going to make everyone else miserable. And I grew up with a mother like that, so it's not just men, but yes people like this can ruin experiences, days, weeks, months and lives.

"Energy is contagious: either you affect people or you infect people. - T. Harv Eker"

gannett · 09/12/2024 08:31

GreyCarpet · 09/12/2024 07:44

Once again, I find myself posting on a thread about "all", sorry 'most' men, and not recognising the description of 'men'.

Again, I have never had a serious relationship with a man who has sucked the joy out of things or been deliberately miserable. Or just not prepared to join in with the fun.

My ex husband was fun when we were together. He never spoilt anyone else's enjoyment of anything. He enjoyed things that children enjoyed because the children were enjoying them as much as he generally enjoyed them himself.

My current partner is the same.

This year, we took our (adult) children pumpkin picking and had a pumpkin carving competition with them.

My daughter and I usually decorate the tree together, but she's away at university this year so my adult (26) son came round to do it with me. My partner didn't pass a single coment about the fact we sang along to The Muppet Chritmas Carol while we did it and spent an hour or so in the kitchen making sausage rolls from scratch, baking camembert and making mulled wine for when we'd finished. Then he put up fairy lights around the living room and said how much he loved them.

We have loads of 'fun' things planned for Christmas and he's looking forward to grandchildren coming along so we can do fun things with the children again. He's 60.

But then, I always prioritised being 'able to have fun' in a man.

Maybe some women prioritise different things when looking for a life partner but treating me as an equal (including in the division of household labour) and the ability to find the fun were very important to me. More important (and attractive) than height, income and looks anyway.

The bottom line is that if your husband is a lazy, sulky, moody fun sucker, it's because you married a lazy, sulky, moody fun sucker. Not because all/most men are crap.

And, if you find you have married one of these men, leave him at home to wallow in his own grumpiness and take the children out/do things on your own.

I agree with this, but I also think the tendency on MN to default to "all/most men are inherently more selfish" is because - obviously - most heterosexual women will never actually experience having a female partner who's a fun sponge around her family. So it ends up being a trait they associate with men.

Sibilantseamstress · 09/12/2024 08:37

I just ask my husband, “I’m going to so-and-so’s party, do you want to come too?” Or, “I am booking such and such for me and the kids, should I get a ticket for you?”

If he decides to come, great, and I expect him to be courteous, if not, I really don’t mind, I am happy to go without him, no passive aggressive resentment from me.

Things got better when I quit assuming he would automatically come along.

Mummadeze · 09/12/2024 08:44

My Dad was/is like that and so is my partner. They have both sulked their way through a pantomime in the past and guess what, they are no longer invited. I do loads of fun things with my DD together on our own and it is much better. We will accompany her Dad on things he has planned as those are the only things he seems to enjoy.

Superworm24 · 09/12/2024 08:46

This isn't a gendered thing. Some of the worst people I know for this behaviour are women.

gannett · 09/12/2024 08:48

Oh god pantomimes. I sulked my way through the only one I've been to, when I was 10 years old, and I was accused of ruining it for everyone! Possibly a key moment in deciding to be child-free and living a life where I would never again have to attend a pantomime.

I really don't think people should be made to do anything they really don't enjoy.

ohpoowhatnow · 09/12/2024 08:48

Yes I agree with this. My husband manages to make trips out rushed, stressfull and less enjoyable. Often feel like I'm walking on egg shells. But then sometimes wants to be the life of the party. I think they're inherently selfish and can't control their emotions.

Raindropskeepfallinonmyhead · 09/12/2024 08:53

gannett · 09/12/2024 08:48

Oh god pantomimes. I sulked my way through the only one I've been to, when I was 10 years old, and I was accused of ruining it for everyone! Possibly a key moment in deciding to be child-free and living a life where I would never again have to attend a pantomime.

I really don't think people should be made to do anything they really don't enjoy.

That's all very well but what about when they expect you to do what they want and get all moody if you don't want to!!

CrispieCake · 09/12/2024 08:58

gannett · 09/12/2024 08:48

Oh god pantomimes. I sulked my way through the only one I've been to, when I was 10 years old, and I was accused of ruining it for everyone! Possibly a key moment in deciding to be child-free and living a life where I would never again have to attend a pantomime.

I really don't think people should be made to do anything they really don't enjoy.

That's fine for people who don't have children or pets but it goes out the window when you take on responsibility for others.

BettyBardMacDonald · 09/12/2024 08:59

YaWeeFurryBastard · 08/12/2024 21:57

but obviously need to do things as a family.

Do you? I’d just book things for you and DD or take her with your friends/family. She’ll probably have a nicer time without the miserable git ruining the mood. I honestly couldn’t bear it if my husband was like this!

This.

Though i must say it all sounds a bit of "forced fun" (especially singing along in the car; that would get on my nerves) and "making memories."

Do you ever do any adult -centric activities with your husband?

CrispieCake · 09/12/2024 08:59

Superworm24 · 09/12/2024 08:46

This isn't a gendered thing. Some of the worst people I know for this behaviour are women.

This is not my experience at all. Most women I come across are wearing themselves out trying to make sure their children feel happy, loved and cherished.

gannett · 09/12/2024 09:00

Raindropskeepfallinonmyhead · 09/12/2024 08:53

That's all very well but what about when they expect you to do what they want and get all moody if you don't want to!!

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Oh that is a definite deal-breaker.

Nothatgingerpirate · 09/12/2024 09:08

Yes, most of them do.
Looking forward to the next chapter of my life, when there are none in my proximity.
😁

BearOnABlanket · 09/12/2024 09:10

BettyBardMacDonald · 09/12/2024 08:59

This.

Though i must say it all sounds a bit of "forced fun" (especially singing along in the car; that would get on my nerves) and "making memories."

Do you ever do any adult -centric activities with your husband?

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Of course it is. I don't really enjoy CBeebies land FFS, I was there because my toddler did. As an adult, I'm able to occasionally put my needs second, so that my children can have some child-centric fun.

And yes, we also had adult time, a lot of the time the kids had to come too as we had no childcare - and guess what, despite being bored witless, they were generally significantly much better behaved, and able to deal with it than their own bloody father!

I didn't see it coming - he was the life and soul of the party when we met, but apparently, it's only fun if it's for him or if he gets some kind of glory for it - traipsing around a hedge maze and going to see Santa isn't fun enough for him, and all about the kids, so he felt it was unreasonable for him to have to be involved. (after we split, I thought about taking down photos with him in, then I looked around at all of them, and realised he wasn't in many of them anyway - all the stuff we did as a family, was actually just me and the kids!)

Curiossir · 09/12/2024 09:11

CatNoon · 08/12/2024 21:55

It’s because men, most men, are fundamentally far more selfish and self-centred than (most) women are. They don’t bother making an effort to enjoy something for someone else’s sake. They don’t care or can’t see or choose not to see how their foul mood affects everyone else. They feel a sense of entitlement to their grumpiness. And this seems to just get worse the older they get.

Rubbish.

Superworm24 · 09/12/2024 09:13

CrispieCake · 09/12/2024 08:59

This is not my experience at all. Most women I come across are wearing themselves out trying to make sure their children feel happy, loved and cherished.

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My mother made sure that everyone knew how much of a chore she found having children and how much she disliked doing anything with us. My father was pretty useless too but he would play with us at times. And unfortunately I've met plenty of other women like my mother.