To want to see my friend without her toddler?

[harrietmg]

I’ve been friends with her since primary school, over 20 years, and we’ve always been super close. We were each other’s maids of honor, and she’s one of my best friends. Since having her daughter, Sophie (2.5 years old), she insists on bringing her to every meet-up. At first, it made sense because Sophie was breastfed. Now, she says she doesn’t want to miss any time with her daughter, and lately, she frames it as “so fun” to have Sophie along now that she’s move grownup, calling her “another one of the besties” who enjoys our outings and is “part of the gang”.

The reality is less fun. Brunches involve constant interruptions: “Don’t touch that,” “Let me wipe your hands,” “Don’t shout,” “Get down before you fall,” or “Don’t hug Aunty Harriet with jammy hands.” While I understand this is normal toddler behavior, it’s hard to relax or have a proper conversation when I’m dodging sticky hugs or watching her manage Sophie the whole time.

When I’ve suggested meeting without Sophie, she always says, “I don’t want to miss her childhood because of brunch.” We’ve tried playground meet-ups, but those mostly consist of us running after Sophie to keep her safe while barely talking. I love children, but sometimes I just want time with her. For her sake too: she’s mentioned losing 90% of her friends because “if someone doesn’t want to spend time with my child, they aren’t a true friend.”

She has a nanny-housekeeper four days a week and regularly asks her mum to babysit when she and her husband go on date nights (about once a month), but otherwise, she refuses to leave Sophie. I’ve suggested meeting after Sophie’s bedtime or letting her husband put Sophie to bed, but she says she doesn’t want to miss bedtime, and by then, it’s too late to go anywhere.

I have two children of my own (a 5-year-old and a 9-month-old) so I understand the challenges of maintaining pre-motherhood friendships as a parent. But I’m also conscious that, as lovely as my children are, they’re not necessarily welcome at every social gathering. I’ve always made an effort to respect that.

Now, she’s asked if she can bring Sophie to my 30th, a 7 pm dinner at a high-end restaurant, then leave halfway through when Sophie gets tired. I love Sophie, but I don’t think it’s fair to have a toddler crying, running around, or throwing food (as toddlers do) at what’s meant to be a special evening with friends.

I'd understand the toddlers parent attitude if she was ill but she is perfectly healthy and has a loving dad and grandparents who are willing to look after her for a couple of hours now and again. Get over yourself toddler mum!!!!

Tell your friend to consider your birthday a date night with her husband, and tell her husband not to allow his wife to bring their toddler to your birthday dinner. And then, tell your husband to intervene if her husband is unsuccessful; turn them around and do not allow them to join you. Friend will cut you off if this happens but you'll probably be better off without her for a while.

How did the birthday dinner turn out?

She is completely nuts. She is also depriving her own husband of forming a good relationship with his child.

YANBU, she is ridiculous. Id say only meet her with your dc in tow as well.
If you are going to be around sticky kids it might as well be yours! And as for your 30th- absolutely not. If you wanted kids there you'd have your own.
As for 'can't miss any bedtimes' I'd got for a breezy ' that's a shame, looking forward to catching up when she is off to uni then.....'
It's no wonder she has no friends left.
I feel terribly sorry for her DH and daughter, that's not a healthy relationship for anybody

Or in response to her being appalled that other people Leave Their Children sometimes- 'yes it's terribly difficult but I have to or everyone would think I was fucking insane'. Oh, no sorry, of COURSE I was only talking about myself............

Comes across like ypur friend has a very unhealthy attachment to her child.
The comment re her belief that a single bed time is making her heart tear, concerns me a lot. It's a very strange thing to say.
Mind, it could be a way to manipulate you into changing your mind.
What is she going to be like when Sophie goes to university? Or holiday? Or moves out?

Hopefully your friend has a good night out without Sophie and remembers that she can occasionally do things without her child present.

My best friend was like this and it was fucking painful. She hated being apart from her kids so much that they didn’t last long at school and then she homeschooled because of the separation anxiety.
Sadly her marriage broke up because of how obsessed she was with her kids.

I was going to name change because she knows I’m on here but then I just mentioned I was going to post about it and she encouraged me! She said if sharing how batshit she was back then helps others then she doesn’t mind at all.

My friend took her daughter to her sisters hen night after being explicitly told no. It was a “girls night in” spa break in a hotel with matching pyjamas, cocktails and cocktail making classes, girlie DVDS and snacks in the rooms and at night party games and even a stripper!
Her sister was so angry but my friend tried to twist it saying how upsetting it was that she had to miss out because of how unsuitable it was for her child.

EVERYTHING revolved round her kids and she was a complete martyr but thought she was as being the best parent in the world from never being apart from her kids, she went out on date nights because her husband insisted and so did her parents but she spent the whole night talking about the kids and making it obvious that she wanted to be at home.

The thing that changed everything and opened her eyes was when her daughter was 6 and she took her a big outdoor playground. My friend was following her daughter trying to play with her but her daughter was more interested in the other kids. In the end her daughter said “mummy I’m going to try to make friends with that girl so I have friends as a grown up” my friend said “you have me though, I will always be there for you”
My friends daughter replied “but silly mummy you are my mummy not my friend!”

My friend luckily came to her senses instead of trying to convince her daughter they were besties and forming a gang with he other kids.
This was a long time ago now and occasionally we do see her daughters on a night out but they love seeing us so they can get bought drinks 😂. I’m just so glad that my friend wasn’t lost forever as she is like my sister.

The obvious solution here is to get Sophie to tell her mum that she needs some adult time with friends and to give her some peace 😂.

Wow that is guilt tripping to the extreme. She sounds pathetic and a bit mad.

OP, it may be too late now, but would your friend consider attending your party later in the evening, after she's put Sophie to bed? (Maybe she can just join you all for dessert or coffee or something?).

Or is your friend not willing to leave Sophie even when she's asleep?

Hate to say this, but it's been my observation that a lot of passive dudes (like the husband of the OP's friend) don't really care about having an independent relationship with their kids. Or at least, their desire to have an independent relationship with their kids is trumped by their reluctance to rock the boat and upset their wives.

She sounds like a sap

Ditch her until she regains her sanity

My SIL was like this, my DB eventually got his DD into nursery so they had time apart. Even now his DD is an adult my SIL is still besotted. Sadly she has no friends as a result. Good luck

Sounds to me that she’s trying to manipulate you to let her bring Sophie!

You are not being unreasonable.
This is your 30th birthday meal for the grown ups to enjoy each other's company without distractions.
Just say I dont think it's a place for little ones come on your own relax itll be fun .. something like that if she doesn't understand its unreasonable of her .

Poor Sophie.

I would be saying no to the meal it’s a child free night for all, you are not having your own children there so why would you want someone else’s child to attend
my concern is your friend seems to have attachment issues with the child which will in turn will become issues for the child.
I don’t think you are in the wrong in anyway at all I actually think your friend may need some counselling if I’m totally honest
Happy 30th Birthday 🎂
Hope you have/had a lovely birthday

You can have an adult only birthday party. It's on the mum to make the decision but then accept the consequences. The mum has some issues. How will she cope when her child needs to go to school, or is invited on a playdate etc.

I would just stop inviting her to meet for coffee etc and let her do the running. The fact that everyone else has dumped her should show that she is the problem. When she asks why, just say you want some time to have adult conversation and anyone that can't be there for you is not a true friend.

If I was the DH I would be really annoyed that I was being micromanaged as a parent and not allowed to have a piece of cake with my kid or any kind of quality time to develop the relationship.

This daughter will go off the rails in teenage years due to lack of space.

This is a common problem when friends have baby's unfortunately, my rule is either everyone brings they're kids to a social gathering of friends or no one does. Can't get childcare sorted then you're just have to miss that social gathering that time

Small children might be fascinating company to their parents but to most other people they are just boring.
I suggest you only meet up when your children are in tow too.

I wonder what your friend's DH thinks of her obsessive behaviour? perhaps he likes it coz it means he is off the hook for all bedtimes and other activities.

I loved my dd to bits when she was a toddler but was always keen to take advantage of any opportunities where I could leave her with someone capable so I could have some freedom to chat with friends without interruptions.

If you want to retain this friendship you may have to have a gentle, but frank discussion about preserving boundaries between roles as parents and individuals, explain how you enjoy having time to yourself or with friends without having to be on guard for child safety constantly. Hope you can get her to see sense, otherwise she may need counselling - I've never known a fellow mum as obsessed at that.

I would ask your friend to pencil in a girls evening once Sophie has gone to Uni. This woman has some serious problems to do with attachment. I wonder if this only about the babie or something far deeper.