Hoping that Greg Wallace is forgiven, rather than cancelled

[Toodaloo1567]

Just a few concerns about this whole GW thing. Caveat: I do not condone behaviour that is illegal.

1. It does kind of look like a whole bunch of privileged TV luvvies are clamouring to denounce someone with really quite humble roots. I grew up in London and am constantly paranoid about how I come across to my mainly middle class colleagues. The thing is, middle class and privileged people operate by a set of unwritten rules. It’s like a full time job in itself trying to emulate their way of interacting, lest you be called out for not being ‘nice’ enough or doing something odd to them, like forgetting to start an email with ‘Hope you are well?’. Only, they won’t let you know to your face that you’ve accidentally been too sharp or direct, or maybe that your joke wasn’t woke enough - no, that stuff just goes straight to HR.
2. The equality act 2010 makes it the employer’s responsibility to prevent sexual harassment in the workplace. Why wasn’t all this lewd stuff dealt with? GW said that no one had made a formal complaint. Again, it makes me wonder whether the middle class luvvies just didn’t want to call things out at the time because it’s ‘beneath’ them to even consider doing something about it.
3. Even though he’s apologised, the public doesn’t think that’s good enough. It’s like only perfect people get to keep their careers. Woe betide you if you said something crass on twitter 10 years ago, or got caught speeding or something.

Of course, lots of you would want to shout me down over this, but you know what? We’re all mums here and many of us have sons. Boys and young men do and say crass things. GW hasn’t raped or systematically abused anyone. It doesn’t make what’s happened right, but I also don’t think it’s right that swarms of pitch-fork waving strangers get to play judge, jury and executioner. I’m a big fan of forgiveness. Am I the only one?

it's like when Neil Gaiman tried to use his autism as an excuse for the recent SA accusations. "I can't read social cues"
it's so frustrating because, when he recently admitted he's autistic, we all supported him, then he threw the rest of us under the bus using it as an excuse to be an abusive P.O.S.

I'm sorry if you are offended OP

It’s Greg’s Mum!

Why the hell should a sexual abuser be forgiven?

Fuck off op. And once you've got there, fuck off some more. Shame on you 😡

Of course this git needs to be axed from BBC shows imo.
Bigger question - which hasn't been focused on much, as always - is what are the BBC doing about a string of terrible revelations; Jimmy Savile, Rolf Harris, Princess Di interview, Princess Di interview cover up, Martin Bashir re-hiring, Huw Edwards.... and on and on and on.

Well apparently not much, apart from saying 'lessons will be learnt' and hiking the licence fee.

Opportunity for Starmer to restore his plummeting popularity by commissioning an independent review into the whole sorry mess at the BBC - one focus should be on their HR and the need to listen to whistleblowers and protect them.

And keep your sons away from women

I'm GW's age.

When I was in my late teens/early 20s, I had several men make disgusting comments to me and touch me up. I told my parents at time and while they believed me (my mother had had similar experiences when she was younger), I was told - and it was probably true too back then - that I would be the one who would get the blame for leading them on. I had a supposedly Christian 70+ year old man run his hands up my legs from the ankles. The husband of a work colleague my parents' age feel me up. And the rest.

I can tell you that now, I would be issuing an extremely firm fuck off to these creeps and probably accompany it with a knee to the balls, and like hell would he do anything about it!

I have brought my children up not to accept or perpetrate this crap.

I thought that generation back then were dinosaurs and that men my own age would have more manners and general savvy, to set the lowest of bars!!

I don't know the truth about what actually happened but there's enough coming out there to raise huge suspicion. I hope there is a thorough and transparent investigation.

I would never, ever behave in that way towards a young man. Do women do that? I suppose some maybe. Though why does some creepy auld lech think he's untouchable??!

Agree. One aspect of this that doesn't get mentioned much is how upsetting this behavior must be for those who have experienced serious trauma previously, to have to hear that during a work day or whatever. Not that it's ok for anyone to experience that, but I have a friend who lived through genocide, witnessed her parents being murdered in her home and you can imagine what they did to her. For someone who has lived though what she has, to then be put in a situation like this is infuriating, but it wouldn't occur to these men to consider the other person would it?

@khaitai

His behaviour is inexcusable.

However, if you looked at a certain books on feminism from yesteryear you'd understand why a working class man of his age finding himself in a position of power would find his masculine expression of domination had shifted from the home to the workplace.

Working class men of his age when younger were often like Gregg anywhere where they were free to express themselves, some of them still are. Most of them didn't have the power to do it at work. It's no great secret that they harbour far more misogynistic, racist, and xenophobic views than their middle class counterparts.

One book is Feminist Theory: From margin to Center, by Bell Hooks. It was written when Gregg was a young working class man. I expect Gregg never learned to behave differently because he had too much autonomy to get away with this behaviour.

What are any other media companies doing about it, that's what I want to know?

People using this to bash the BBC are ridiculous. Or Keir Starmer. Try harder 1/10.

You may not realise it OP (and are probably incapable of understanding it judging from your post) but you are one of the reasons pieces of shit like him (and Saville and Weinstein et. al.) are able to continue abusing women and kids. This 'oh let's all join hands and forgive everyone till we're blue in the face and everything will be peachy' is a major part of the problem.

Yes women have come forward:

‘One woman says he touched her bottom at an event and another says he pressed his crotch against her while filming on a different show.

He brushed past me at the checkout, and touched my bum with his waist and penis and laughed and said “oooh you liked that didn’t you”," she said.’

Another woman:

‘She says she was called to his dressing room on one occasion, to fix his bow tie for an after work event.
When she started fastening his bow tie, she says she noticed his trousers were "partially lowered". She did not see how this happened.
"His pubic hair was on show, where you can see the top part of his penis, and he was wearing no boxers underneath."
Anna says no apology was offered. Instead, she says, "he stared at me", in a way that felt like "a power play".’

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgj64237v6zo.amp

Creepy, sex pests come from all walks of life and they are menace to work with. Being working class has nothing to do with it.

I cannot imagine asking a colleague into my office and then pulling my clothing down so that they could see my pubic hair. It would be so fucking weird!

YABVU and I am working class! Being a creep has nothing to do with what class you are, please do not suggest that we don't know basic social skills.

It's that simple 🤷🏻‍♀️

When I said "Why has everyone suddenly realised now that it was unacceptable?" I didn't mean to imply that some people didn't find it unacceptable before, but that only now is everyone - the media, society at large - declaring that it's unacceptable.

I meant to express frustration that stronger action wasn't taken earlier by those with the power to do something, rather than to imply any fault on the part of those who complained previously and whose voices were ignored or those who only now feel able to speak out. I can see that wasn't clear, unfortunately.

It does kind of look like a whole bunch of privileged TV luvvies are clamouring to denounce someone with really quite humble roots . They haven’t clamoured on someone because of his roots, plenty of celebs/people come from humble roots, it’s how he is presenting himself that’s the problem. If he wants to have banter of a sexual nature, he can do that with like minded people down the pub on a Friday night, it’s not appropriate for a workplace environment and on people that don’t want to listen to it. There are unwritten rules about respect etc yes but they are not class based.

As for not calling it out, it’s always difficult calling out someone’s inappropriate behaviour so I understand why it’s not happened before but now that one person has been brave enough to do it, all those that experienced it too and weren’t brave enough to do it, now have the confidence to say yes I experienced it too. Also, what usually happens in these situations, is the inappropriateness starts off as low key and sporadic and the more someone does it and doesn’t get pulled up, the more it becomes their norm and they step it up a level until they go too far.

I'm a parent to a son and 2 daughters. The aim is to raise them with dignity and respect for themselves and other people. You are making excuses for his behaviour. He has always been crass, his jokes that were aired skated on thin ice.

He wasn't making crass jokes down the pub he was doing so at a professional workplace. The context matters very much! He was also a cohost on the shows and in a position of power over contestants.

Absolutely 💯

This right here.

I've no idea what happened off screen obviously, but on the Masterchef celebrity programmes, Gregg AND John were deeply respectful of any drag queens, nauseatingly calling them she and her.

Of course the other stuff is inappropriate. But I don’t think they’re sackable offences. I really don’t. If he’s making sexual innuendos, it’s merely an annoyance and an eye rolling situation, but I honestly wouldn’t lose sleep over it. It would annoy me more than it would upset me.

Ffs!!
Inappropriate sexual comments and innuendos have no place in the workplace. Anyone making them should be subject to disciplinary proceedings and repeated offences should most definitely result in losing your job.

Raise your bar and expect better.

The more accounts that come out about greggs behaviour, the more certain I am that this is about making women feel humiliated, uncomfortable and embarrassed.

It's absolutely a power play.