To judge friend's approach to Christmas?

[NoisyDenimShaker]

I'm desperately trying not to judge my friend, who keeps talking about how much she loves spending Christmas only with her husband and kids. I don't have kids, so perhaps I just don't understand. But I feel I've watched her turn into someone I'm finding more and more difficult to respect. Here's the situation: Her parents are dead now, but when they both had terminal cancer, a few years apart, she wouldn't invite them for Christmas. Even when her mum was terminal and widowed, she wouldn't invite her. The mum did have a companion, but she was desperate to spend Christmas with her daughter and four young grandchildren the last two Christmases of her life. She was terminally ill for both of those Christmases, although the cancer hadn't yet overwhelmed her and she could have travelled. Anyway, it didn't happen, because she wasn't invited.

My friend also has a sister whose husband had an affair, and the sister will be alone this year since the parents are gone and her husband is with OW, but she won't invite her sister. (When I say alone, she'll probably have invitations since the sister is cool, but she has no family left to spend it with.) Neither will she inviter her in-laws, who live nearby and are old and one is terminally ill.

She gets on fine with all those family members, whom I know are deeply hurt, as our families know each other and go way back. What she says to me is that she just wants to spend Christmas with her husband and kids.

So my question for all the parents here is this: When you have kids, is it understandable to just spend it with the husband and kids. even when various family members are dying and/or alone? That they grow up so fast, and in the blink of an eye, they'll have their own partners and Christmas will change forever? So you want to have Christmases alone with your spouse and kids while you can?

I'm just really trying to understand, because friend keeps talking with glee about how she's having the Christmas she wants, and I'm having difficulty not judging.

I don't have kids, so perhaps my friend is being totally reasonable and it's what all parents want - just to be alone with their spouse and kids at Christmas? Maybe my friend is not being unreasonable?

I can't imagine doing this but it's the reality of the MN 'we want to spend Christmas just our little family', people who are old and/or single are left alone because they don't fit the instagram version of Christmas.

Doing the work of Christmas and Hogmanay is exhausting but it's worth it because my DM and MIL hosted for years and they deserve a rest now. And I say that as someone with 3DC and a FT demanding job who lives far away from family and always has to host for multiple days and multiple people. Our Christmas and Hogmanay is extremely busy, we have had up to 12 people in the house over Christmas week, it's my DCs birthday between Christmas and New Year and we host a Hogmanay party (with family staying over) as well.

Everybody celebrates Christmas in their own way. Or choses not to celebrate it if that's what they want.
I don't know why you are getting so worked up about what happens in this woman's family. You really don't know about their family dynamics, the real feelings of those concerned, their emotional history.
You do Christmas the way you and your family want to do it and let other people get on with their lives.

Christmas can not just be about Christmas Day, so you can have that as a couple with your children only, and other family members be visited on other days such as Christmas Eve or Boxing Day.

From the outside this scenario looks a lot like my own.

I spend Christmas with just my husband and children rather than my parents.

However, I have reasons for this. My mother is an alcoholic and has made many of my Christmases as a child a nightmare.

None of my friends or other family members are aware of this as it is kept secret, so on the face of it I look selfish as my mother puts on a very loving and caring facade.

In my experience, there is usually a backstory when people exclude family, even if you aren't aware of it.

I've never had Christmas with just ex and dc out of choice, it happened a couple of times because we were living overseas but that was because we couldn't afford to come back, high fares. More recently Covid thwarted plans in 2020 which was pretty boring. I don't get wanting to be away from extended family

It's very complicated. And I expect there could be more to it. I have a narcissistic DM who, to the outside world martyrs herself.

For nine years I have gone out of my way to try and do Christmas how she would like it as best as possible since DF died. It's always been hugely fraught and last year things came to an ugly head. Not one person apart from DH knows I had a mental breakdown nor was off work for months because of her behaviour.

And now I am getting extreme pressure from relatives about why I won't have to her stay at Christmas this year. The stupid thing is, I'm actually doing it out of misplaced loyalty not to have to tell everyone quite how awful her behaviour has been.

Christmas or not, sometime we just don't know what's below the surface.

Please don't judge your friend.

@GettingThemFromHereToThere you have no idea of the family history but want to judge them. Not very Christian or charming.

I think you're probably making a lot of assumptions without knowing the full story, especially in saying the mum was 'desperate' to spend Christmas with them.
You say your friend has a sister so presumably mum spent Christmas with her? If so, that's perfectly acceptable in my mind. If not, why are you not also mad at the sister?
I think you just need to accept people do things differently and you probably don't know the full reasons behind it, even if you think you do.

I feel very sorry for your friend. To have a friend like you, posting such personal details about their life for a bunch of strangers to rip apart and abuse. Well done. Hope you feel vindicated.

Also, as children we loved having all the relatives round for Christmas and my kids do as well. When they were little and we didn't have a big enough house to host so it was just us it felt like an ordinary weekend rather than something special, having visitors is what makes it Christmas.

You only know what you've been allowed to know

We essentially travel the country with a toddler in tow to see our families at Christmas.

It's exhausting and not for everyone but it's important to us and our family that we spend time together at this time of year.

How many people do you host OP?

People with kids aren’t a monolith. What your friend wants to do and what other people with kids want to do will be different. Some people without kids, just want to spend Christmas with their partner and no one else.

You can think she is selfish. Or you can think she might have reasons you aren’t aware of that she prefers Christmas with just them.

I hated Christmas with my exh because he always wanted a house full. He cooked so it seemed great. Except he wouldn’t bother with the kids all day because he was cooking. From 9am (after not getting up until 8am) to bedtime, he was always doing something in the kitchen appearing for a couple of minutes to chat to everyone about all the hard work he was putting in. I was the one building toys, playing with the kids while entertaining my family and his. This was after weeks of him not doing much to help towards Christmas and moaning about anything me or the kids wanted to do. Our mothers were very different people and didn’t particularly get on, so there was always a bit of tension and awkwardness. It was always a stressful day.

The one year we did have just us it was far less stressful and I didn’t end up in the bathroom wanting to scream by 3pm.

He was actually (usually) a very hands on dad and good husband. But something about Christmas used to turn him into a dickhead and it became about his performance cooking.

I never said I wouldn’t allow people to come over and definitely wouldn’t if someone was terminally ill. But everyone else’s view of our perfect Christmas is very different to mine.

But you don’t know what’s happening behind closed doors. Or why she feels this way. But not wanting terminally ill relatives around at Christmas isn’t down to something that happens when you have kids. There’s likely to many reasons she feels the way she does. It’s not because she is a parent and parents all think like this.

Mum is dead now. Dad is going to his girlfriends, I am divorced. It’s me, dd (20) and ds (13) just like it was last year and it’s bliss.

For people saying it's not my business, she talks to me about it, and I feel judgey inside but would rather not feel that way. So I was wondering, from a parent's point of view, if this is what most parents want - just their spouse and kids. Because I wouldn't know, not having kids myself.

Some family and friends.

There are already 6 people in the house to cater for and entertain, that's enough surely? I'm with her, I love Christmas with my OH and kids, I definitely wouldn't want my in laws there and I wouldn't want my fussy mother either. She's not interested in Christmas anyway.

What my friend chooses to do at Christmas wouldn't in anyway impact my friendship and it seems a very strange thing to feel strongly enough about to post on MN.

So she talks to you... and then you post it all on MN.

and want us all to join you in judging someone.

nice.....

Erm...I posted to get some insight so that I can feel kinder towards her when she talks about it??? Since I don't have kids myself, I wouldn't know how it feels to just want Christmas with them. Thanks for digging deep and finding the absolute worst reading, though. That must have taken some doing!

Yes, THAT was the point of the post. And she doesn't do social media. 🙄

On the face of it she sounds extremely selfish and also short sighted for the future, but of course there could be other things going on.

My Mum has always told me to do what I like for Christmas...she spent every Christmas of our childhood trying to appease divorced parents who both felt they HAD to see us and Christmas and Boxing Day were always manic trying to fit everyone in (which incidentally I loved as a kid!)

I don't get the Mumsnet thing of only immediate family at all (no one I know in real life does this). Even though I'm actually an introvert I love the bustle of Chrismas and seeing everyone...just us would be incredibly boring and not special at all. We are local to all our family though...perhaps that makes a difference. And we actually like each other (again IRL I don't know anyone who is non contact with their family)

I think (hope) most people do think of others before making this decision...I would have thought they do and the OPs situation is unusual.

BECAUSE SHE KEEPS TALKING TO ME ABOUT IT, LIKE I ALREADY SAID TWICE!!!!!!

Of course there's more to the story. From the outside, it is very easy to judge though. And trying to explain the intricate reasons why you don't wnat your mother around never is awful because people just don't get it (especially if they have good enough mothers). So I get why she (the friend) keeps it simple.

It completely depends on the circumstances. When you have people who are terminally ill or very elderly, then it might not be the case that you can just invite them over. Does it mean picking them up? How far away do they live? Who cooks the Christmas dinner and who does the driving? Does it mean going to theirs and travelling on Christmas Day and catering in someone else’s house? My children have spent many christmases travelling around the country, spending Christmas Day visiting relatives in hospital, or being in houses where they have to hang around politely while stressed adults cobble together a meal before driving back home late at night. It is all rather guilt ridden and awful. None of the elderly adults really care that much about Christmas and it got to the point when my children started to dread it. This year we are not seeing anyone apart from us on Christmas Day and hopefully it will be better. I wouldn’t judge her.

Did you see the thread on here the other day about never knowing what goes on behind closed doors?
She might be with a controlling husband who will not allow anyone in.
What she tells you and shows you is what she wants you to see and hear.