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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think men shouldn't be midwives

1000 replies

igglepiggle599 · 29/11/2024 19:37

Just saying, I have nothing against the male midwives themselves. I'm sure they're amazing at what they do and are lovely, kind, caring people. They themselves are not actually the issue I have.

I think many women are uncomfortable with the idea of a male midwife for any number of reasons, and there's a good chance that any given woman will automatically feel uncomfortable when a male midwife walks in. I also find it very disingenuous when people say that they can simply request another midwife. I'm sure that's often true (though maternity units presumable don't have an infinite supply of midwives at any given time, so there's at least a hypothetical scenario in which this wouldn't be possible?). I don't think it's fair that women should be put in a situation where they have to speak up and say that they want a different midwife, particularly when they are extremely vulnerable and possibly in excruciating pain. I'm not a particularly shy or passive person, but I would find that conversation very difficult even when not in labour. I might panic in the moment and wonder whether that amounted to some kind of breach of equality laws, or I might be in such a state that I just didn't want to risk any kind of conflict. Ultimately I would end up with a birth that may well be smooth from a medical point of view but somewhat tainted emotionally, as I would know that an aspect of the situation made me uncomfortable and I hadn't felt able to say anything.

Also, is midwifery even the kind of profession that would actually benefit from gender diversity given that women are the ones who give birth? I'm sure these very talented, compassionate men would be just as valued in a different branch of nursing. Obviously there are male doctors who can end up delivering a baby, but somehow it feels different for men to train in a role that is so intimate.

Very much open to different perspectives.

OP posts:
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12
Mum2jenny · 30/11/2024 19:53

As I said earlier, in some respects I’d prefer a male midwife as I’ve had bad experiences with a female one.

Crazyfarmgirl · 30/11/2024 19:53

StormingNorman · 30/11/2024 19:43

I’m sorry you went through an earlier trauma, but it would have helped with their scheduling if you’d mentioned your preference beforehand. It’s too late when you arrive.

I was never given the option, my doctor had referred me for an emergency scan which she had me booked in that same day. I was only given a time and place, no contact details etc.

SilverDoe · 30/11/2024 19:54

Oceangreyscale · 30/11/2024 11:28

I didn't care if my midwife was male or female, I also didn't care that the medical professional who replaced my coil last time was a man. I did appreciate him asking me if that was ok.

Why should men be banned from these roles just because some people are uncomfortable? I'm not. If you're uncomfortable then it's your job to voice that and request an alternative I'm afraid.

I did want to address this as well before the thread fills up.

Most women, even women with male related trauma, do want to be okay and function.

I didn't know I'd be uncomfortable with a male midwife until the experience had happened. Now I'm constantly reminded of that negative worry when I think of my son's birth.

InterestedDad37 · 30/11/2024 19:54

YABU ... How about no female nurses for tasks on male patients? A female nurse was present when I had a vasectomy, and another (even more 'personal' operation) ... I used to be a nurse. I nursed both men and women, including having to do things 'down there' ... my father was a nurse... my mother was a nurse... so was my sister, my brother and many of my uncles and aunties ... so yes, you're being unreasonable. It's a job, done professionally by most who do it.

PuffinCliffs · 30/11/2024 20:01

InterestedDad37 · 30/11/2024 19:54

YABU ... How about no female nurses for tasks on male patients? A female nurse was present when I had a vasectomy, and another (even more 'personal' operation) ... I used to be a nurse. I nursed both men and women, including having to do things 'down there' ... my father was a nurse... my mother was a nurse... so was my sister, my brother and many of my uncles and aunties ... so yes, you're being unreasonable. It's a job, done professionally by most who do it.

If a man wants a male nurse for this then I think he should be allowed.

You are being unreasonable to dictate to women what they should feel comfortable with.

StormingNorman · 30/11/2024 20:05

Crazyfarmgirl · 30/11/2024 19:53

I was never given the option, my doctor had referred me for an emergency scan which she had me booked in that same day. I was only given a time and place, no contact details etc.

I’m sorry. I thought it was routine appointment. It’s understandable that they couldn’t accommodate your request at short notice, but they should have been kinder about it.

TiptoeThroughTheToadstools · 30/11/2024 20:05

wombat15 · 30/11/2024 19:23

I am sure the great majority of adult men have seen vaginas before.

My point exactly!

InterestedDad37 · 30/11/2024 20:06

PuffinCliffs · 30/11/2024 20:01

If a man wants a male nurse for this then I think he should be allowed.

You are being unreasonable to dictate to women what they should feel comfortable with.

I take your point, but my point was really just that it's a professional job, and the gender of the employee doesn't theoretically matter ... though I realise exactly why some women may feel uncomfortable with a male midwife ... I get that, I understand it.

wombat15 · 30/11/2024 20:06

TiptoeThroughTheToadstools · 30/11/2024 20:05

My point exactly!

So you wouldn't mind intimate care from any man off the street?

PuffinCliffs · 30/11/2024 20:07

InterestedDad37 · 30/11/2024 20:06

I take your point, but my point was really just that it's a professional job, and the gender of the employee doesn't theoretically matter ... though I realise exactly why some women may feel uncomfortable with a male midwife ... I get that, I understand it.

it is not about the man though, it is about the woman.

Mattins · 30/11/2024 20:09

InterestedDad37 · 30/11/2024 20:06

I take your point, but my point was really just that it's a professional job, and the gender of the employee doesn't theoretically matter ... though I realise exactly why some women may feel uncomfortable with a male midwife ... I get that, I understand it.

Their gender is irrelevant to me. Their sex isn’t.

ProfessionalPirate · 30/11/2024 20:11

SouthLondonMum22 · 30/11/2024 17:44

Not at all. Having a preference is absolutely fine but just as I wouldn’t ban make midwives, I wouldn’t ban male care workers either.

That’s fine in theory but what do you say to that fact in the NHS the choice is taken away from many women? I remember when my poor grandmother in her 90s would receive male carers to perform the most intimate of tasks, she was distraught. All she wanted was a bit of dignity at the end of her life. We were told there was no other option, so we ended up paying for fully private care as a family which totalled around £2k a month. Not a possibility for everyone sadly.

In an ideal world we would have ample NHS funding and excess staff to cater for such preferences. But we live in the real world, not the ideal world.

StormingNorman · 30/11/2024 20:12

Crazyfarmgirl · 30/11/2024 19:53

I was never given the option, my doctor had referred me for an emergency scan which she had me booked in that same day. I was only given a time and place, no contact details etc.

I’m sorry. I thought it was routine appointment. It’s understandable that they couldn’t accommodate your request at short notice, but they should have been kinder about it.

SouthLondonMum22 · 30/11/2024 20:15

ProfessionalPirate · 30/11/2024 20:11

That’s fine in theory but what do you say to that fact in the NHS the choice is taken away from many women? I remember when my poor grandmother in her 90s would receive male carers to perform the most intimate of tasks, she was distraught. All she wanted was a bit of dignity at the end of her life. We were told there was no other option, so we ended up paying for fully private care as a family which totalled around £2k a month. Not a possibility for everyone sadly.

In an ideal world we would have ample NHS funding and excess staff to cater for such preferences. But we live in the real world, not the ideal world.

Banning males from caring roles isn’t the answer. They are typically already short staffed enough and what about elderly males with a preference to have male caters?

InterestedDad37 · 30/11/2024 20:17

Mattins · 30/11/2024 20:09

Their gender is irrelevant to me. Their sex isn’t.

Well, you know ... we either want equality or we don't. Quite simple, really.

ProfessionalPirate · 30/11/2024 20:18

StormingNorman · 30/11/2024 19:33

Not being silly at all. I was replying to to the real world example of your own labour: “requesting a female midwife before the birth means basically diddily squat when it comes to it and there aren’t enough female midwives on the rota to cover everyone”.

In this situation the choice is a male midwife or no midwife. More women aren’t going to want to do the job and fill those spots on the rota just because men aren’t doing the job anymore.

Yes so the choice is ‘male midwife, or jeopardise the life of your baby and yourself’. In other words, no choice at all. I realise the NHS is going down the pan but your expectations don’t need to be as low as all that.

Copernicus321 · 30/11/2024 20:18

After a hard labour and 2 female midwives a consultant paediatrician came in and our DD was safely delivered shortly afterwards. The paediatrician was male and I've never been more pleased to see him. It would be comforting if woman fully staffed the maternity and paediatrician services for childbirth but I think we have to accept that the service is dangerously understaffed and the gender of who attends the birth is the least of the current concerns. I'm sorry to say.

PuffinCliffs · 30/11/2024 20:20

InterestedDad37 · 30/11/2024 20:17

Well, you know ... we either want equality or we don't. Quite simple, really.

If you are saying women must have male midwife’s or carers then you are not for equality.

StormingNorman · 30/11/2024 20:21

Mattins · 30/11/2024 20:09

Their gender is irrelevant to me. Their sex isn’t.

Get over yourself. You know what he meant.

PuffinCliffs · 30/11/2024 20:23

Equality means women have the same access to healthcare as men. If that means female carers then that means female carers. Insisting that women must accept male carers is discriminatory.

PuffinCliffs · 30/11/2024 20:23

StormingNorman · 30/11/2024 20:21

Get over yourself. You know what he meant.

Gender is irrelevant, sex isn’t

StormingNorman · 30/11/2024 20:25

PuffinCliffs · 30/11/2024 20:07

it is not about the man though, it is about the woman.

Does that hold true if a labouring racist doesn’t want a black female midwife? If it’s about the woman…

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