to think men shouldn't be midwives

[igglepiggle599]

Just saying, I have nothing against the male midwives themselves. I'm sure they're amazing at what they do and are lovely, kind, caring people. They themselves are not actually the issue I have.

I think many women are uncomfortable with the idea of a male midwife for any number of reasons, and there's a good chance that any given woman will automatically feel uncomfortable when a male midwife walks in. I also find it very disingenuous when people say that they can simply request another midwife. I'm sure that's often true (though maternity units presumable don't have an infinite supply of midwives at any given time, so there's at least a hypothetical scenario in which this wouldn't be possible?). I don't think it's fair that women should be put in a situation where they have to speak up and say that they want a different midwife, particularly when they are extremely vulnerable and possibly in excruciating pain. I'm not a particularly shy or passive person, but I would find that conversation very difficult even when not in labour. I might panic in the moment and wonder whether that amounted to some kind of breach of equality laws, or I might be in such a state that I just didn't want to risk any kind of conflict. Ultimately I would end up with a birth that may well be smooth from a medical point of view but somewhat tainted emotionally, as I would know that an aspect of the situation made me uncomfortable and I hadn't felt able to say anything.

Also, is midwifery even the kind of profession that would actually benefit from gender diversity given that women are the ones who give birth? I'm sure these very talented, compassionate men would be just as valued in a different branch of nursing. Obviously there are male doctors who can end up delivering a baby, but somehow it feels different for men to train in a role that is so intimate.

Very much open to different perspectives.

I had a male midwife, he was wonderful

The more I think about this topic, the more I am convinced that midwifery should be a female only domain.
Only women can give birth. It's one thing we can keep female only.
It feels to me that everything women have fought for is gradually being taken from us.
Midwives were burnt at the stake for being witches by a patriarchal society afraid of womens power.
I don't think it's unreasonable to honour those women.

Of all the silly reasons...

What an outdated opinion.
Of course I don't object to a qualified health professional who happens to be male. 🫣

Eh?
Male midwives are caring for and allowing women to guve birth safely, just as female ones are. They're helping, not hindering.

You're speaking as if it's a global thing, this fear of a man in the room when you're exposed and vulnerable.

I think it's far more a case of British women being used to things a certain way. Women in other parts of the world get on with it without midwives, but with doctors who are often men. In other countries, too, women do know the male doctor if they have chosen one. This is because they see their doctor all through pregnancy.

@ilovesooty "
It didn't take long for the suggestion to surface that men who choose to become midwives might have perverted motives."

Which is obviously ridiculous. However, it only took a couple of posts to suggest that women are being ridiculous and precious for expressing a preference. And, bizarrely, that men are somehow better at the job than women....

I can see what you mean but most gynocologists are men.

I think there are aspects of the midwife’s work that will be difficult for males to perform - and yes, I accept that all of us feel differently about exactly who they want to do tho ha to us. I’ve only ever had good experiences of midwifery and practice nurses doing smears etc. It might not be logical that I had no problem with a male staff member doing a breast scan or a male GP showing me how to do a breast exam - but a huge problem at the thought of a male doing a mammogram or assisting with breastfeeding. I suppose I see some procedures as basically very clinical and others as very different.

At the end of the day, women should be asked early on and given time to think about it - not presented with a fait accompli when a bloke starts handling their breasts.

I know the UK is a big place with a population of about 70 million, but 200 still seems likes a large number all things considered.

It’s not obviously ridiculous that some men who wish to become midwives might have perverted motives.

In fact, it’s staggeringly naive to think that all men who go into midwifery are doing so for virtuous reasons.

Female dominated profession. Meaning profession where women are disproportionately represented, not one that should be done by women. I think its still the case that primary education is primarily staffed by women.

I agree. Only women can give birth, and no women should be required to expose herself when she is at her most vulnerable, to a man. At the very least, all women should be able to stipulate having a female midwife.

i’m sure there are very capable and caring male midwives, but their competency isn’t the issue here.

Yes, that’s also inappropriate in my opinion. I see that it’s better for women to have necessary gynaecological care from a male than none at all and suffer the health consequences, but it would be far better if they were all women….

Do you think so? Out of a population of about 40,000 midwives? I think it's pretty low, personally.

The two young men I've had treat me through my two pregnancies were some of my favourites. Respected my body and my decisions, spoke to me like an adult. I hate when midwives stroke me or call me darling etc. I felt like the women didn't trust that I knew my body better than them, "I feel...." "no you dont". And I don't like them hanging about and chatting. I want as little contact with them as possible.

I specify the young men because I also had older men who were arrogant and dismissive but they were consultants and most consultants bar one were like that.

DH’s ‘best friend’ from school is a gynaecologist. He used to be lovely. We seldom see him unless he comes to Aus for a holiday; and we haven’t seen him for 7 years now thankfully, and haven’t heard from him for months.
The way he talks about ‘cunts’ is revolting. He’s won SO many awards for his service, research and bedside manner. We see a totally different side.

Personally, I didn’t want a male midwife. I think female’s choice is paramount. If she’s uncomfortable then it’ll impact the labour.

Everyone is different, some women don’t mind being at their most naked and vulnerable state in front of a male stranger, some do. We shouldn’t ever mock this choice. Some women say they absolutely wouldn’t care when they’re in the throes of giving birth. I would have. 4 children, and I remember each midwife.

I think it depends on the individual. I used to work with a male midwife on a Labour ward and he was very popular with the women. Women coming back for their second baby would ask if x was on shift and could he look after them. Even women who hadn’t met him would ask about him and say they’d heard he was great.

There are tens of posts on this thread parroting their birth experience to cover every possible error a male or female carer could make and the vast majority ware useless to the discussion but this one is really important.

also just to add- one of my female midwives kissed me. It was exactly what I needed.

I was talking to the other poster about the trajectory once the male was in post. Not the training required of him. Although you do raise an interesting point. Apparantly there is a drive to positively recruit men into midwifery. So it's entirely possible that simply rocking up with a penis would give a man an advantage over a similarly qualified woman.

But we don’t care what people do in other parts of the world do we? This conversation is about the female dominated midwifery profession in the uk

What an unpleasant comment. You think women who prefer to be in the company of other women during birth are a joke, and imagining that any males in the room are looking at them sexually? Have you had some sort of empathy bypass?

i get it that women are fine with a male midwife, but they probably haven’t been abused by men….

Requring a women to have a male midwife is barely a step away from requiring a woman at a rape crisis centre to have a male support worker in my opinion.

In my opinion, there are a very small number of jobs that should be sex-based, and midwifery is one.

Is it? What's the modern opinion then? That the wishes of a tiny minority of men to join a particular profession should trump the possible discomfort of women for whom the profession exists? That the most important thing is that we never ever restrict or disadvantage men? Because that all sounds depressingly old school to me.

I omitted “some” from the first sentence by mistake… it should have said “some women.”