to think men shouldn't be midwives

[igglepiggle599]

Just saying, I have nothing against the male midwives themselves. I'm sure they're amazing at what they do and are lovely, kind, caring people. They themselves are not actually the issue I have.

I think many women are uncomfortable with the idea of a male midwife for any number of reasons, and there's a good chance that any given woman will automatically feel uncomfortable when a male midwife walks in. I also find it very disingenuous when people say that they can simply request another midwife. I'm sure that's often true (though maternity units presumable don't have an infinite supply of midwives at any given time, so there's at least a hypothetical scenario in which this wouldn't be possible?). I don't think it's fair that women should be put in a situation where they have to speak up and say that they want a different midwife, particularly when they are extremely vulnerable and possibly in excruciating pain. I'm not a particularly shy or passive person, but I would find that conversation very difficult even when not in labour. I might panic in the moment and wonder whether that amounted to some kind of breach of equality laws, or I might be in such a state that I just didn't want to risk any kind of conflict. Ultimately I would end up with a birth that may well be smooth from a medical point of view but somewhat tainted emotionally, as I would know that an aspect of the situation made me uncomfortable and I hadn't felt able to say anything.

Also, is midwifery even the kind of profession that would actually benefit from gender diversity given that women are the ones who give birth? I'm sure these very talented, compassionate men would be just as valued in a different branch of nursing. Obviously there are male doctors who can end up delivering a baby, but somehow it feels different for men to train in a role that is so intimate.

Very much open to different perspectives.

I think it's interesting that for many years women have fought for rights, fought to be heard and are now fighting to be safe in many different environments. Increase of violence against women, abuse of children, daily reports of abusive relationships and behaviour from men towards women going about their daily lives.

However on mumsnet every single male midwife every single person has came across was better than any female midwife. Honestly!!!!! Couldn't make this shit up

Did you mean to be so offensive and hurtful?

Because women are saying ‘no’ to men.

Its not a choice between a male midwife or none though, is it? It's a choice between a male or a female midwife. If there is evidence that significant numbers of women would actively prefer a male midwife, then that would be a valid argument. However the very best you can come up with is 'some' women 'don't mind' and would prefer a man to no one. Well that isn't good enough to present this as in women's interests. You are arguing for mens rights over the comfort of some women, however you try to twist it.

I personally would have struggled with a male midwife. It’s not an embarrassment thing as I had a male anaesthetist and have had a male gynaecologist for years - loads of gynaecology issues here. I can’t quite explain it but I just know I wouldn’t completely relax. It’s a very female thing giving birth.

If only women defended women as much as they'll defend men. God forbid we hurt the feelings of the poor male midwife.

I don’t care what her gender is and if she is a midwife who does recognise the importance of sex then she has absolutely no place in healthcare.

I don't understand the logic behind society being happy with a male obstetrician or gynaecologist (and loads of them are male) but not a male midwife.

The poster who was talking about men being more sexual or something ridiculous, just stop. Men can be professional in the same way women can. Of course both can be unprofessional too.

I don't care either. It's not about you.

I see absolutely no valid reason to exclude men from being midwives, and fortunately I can't see any chance that it would ever happen in reality. Victory for commonsense!!

I had a male doctor deliver DS, he was a knob but still, I couldn’t care less he was male. Had an all female team with DD, the one stitching me up was a little on the weird side. Tbf. Male or female as long as they help me get my kid out with as least issues as possible I, good with whoever.

No, that wasn't really the point of the OP's question. It's perfectly fine not to have a man present at birth. Absolutely, request whomever you are comfortable with. However, the OP specifically suggested that no man should ever be allowed to train as a midwife and yes, I do profoundly disagree with that.

Why? You wouldn’t need proof. Your friend will still be fairly easy to identify s a woman, because your friend is a woman. People can tell

Being pregnant and giving birth is NOT an ailment, like i said sure medical supervision should be in place.

I had a male midwife for my second born. They were very compassionate and reassuring. The same can't be said for the delightful "lady" that delivered my first.

You can't think of a single reason? You're very naive

It’s factual.

Well perhaps it's just the truth?

I had some lovely midwives but a few of them were positively vile: rude and bullying nature, made nasty comments about how I wasn't tolerating the pain I was in, were impatient, slagged me off to my husband, acted childishly and upset me to the point of tears.

None of the male midwives or male doctors did that and that's just a fact.

The thing is I did ‘mind’ hugely who supported me in my births. I absolutely minded that I got the very best person for the job.

it’s not that I was totally unbothered about who delivered my babies, I just didn’t really care what genitals they had.

If you banned half the population from the profession, You’d be limiting my choice as a woman.

Just like I care who performs my smear tests etc. I absolutely do ‘mind’ that I have the person who causes the least pain. So again, please don’t suggest removing my ability to choose the best person FOR ME away.

I think this is definitely insulting to males. We would not tolerate if it picked out .. ethnic minorities, older people, disabled people, on the basis of religion/belief. We would encourage females into male dominated industries. Why should males not be allowed to be a midwife then?

Same reason as the female midwives and every other nurse, doctor etc in the NHS has to get DBS checked.

I just didn’t really care what genitals they had.

What about the size of their hands?

Why should males not be allowed to be a midwife then?

Maybe because a significant proportion of women as evidenced by this thread would feel uncomfortable when they are feeling very vulnerable. Or does that not matter?

Not the point though, is it? We are not here to debate the trans agenda. Hypothetically speaking, you are in a delivery room. My friend walks in. He is, as you noted "still a woman" and was most certainly born with a vagina. It is not the appearance that greets you. What do you do?

It's such a load of unreasonable judgey bollocks that has zero basis in reality.

It's been a very long time but when I think back to my male obs! I couldn't speak more highly of the empathy, gentleness, understanding, quiet professionalism I experienced in their care. I think I fell a little bit in love with both of them! The first saw me through a difficult journey with infertility issues and it was his care that put me in the position of being able to get pregnant in the first place. The second was more jocular with the ability to dry my tears with some light-hearted humour. A man who came in to check up on me on his way home from a weekend away with his wife.

And I think about those absolutely amazing men, human beings, who gave so much of themselves to thousands of women. When I read the shit posted on here, it doesn't resonate one bit with my own lived experience.

And I am angry, actually! I didn't think I was to begin with but I am. I am bloody angry on behalf of all of the decent, caring men who have dedicated their lives to healthcare for women, to see men like them dissed as predators with nefarious reasons for their choice of career, is literally disgusting. Some of you should be ashamed of yourselves.

If you had half a fucking brain cell, you would be judging your friend for his actions and his words, not his appearance.

This thread is actually sickening me now.