to think men shouldn't be midwives

[igglepiggle599]

Just saying, I have nothing against the male midwives themselves. I'm sure they're amazing at what they do and are lovely, kind, caring people. They themselves are not actually the issue I have.

I think many women are uncomfortable with the idea of a male midwife for any number of reasons, and there's a good chance that any given woman will automatically feel uncomfortable when a male midwife walks in. I also find it very disingenuous when people say that they can simply request another midwife. I'm sure that's often true (though maternity units presumable don't have an infinite supply of midwives at any given time, so there's at least a hypothetical scenario in which this wouldn't be possible?). I don't think it's fair that women should be put in a situation where they have to speak up and say that they want a different midwife, particularly when they are extremely vulnerable and possibly in excruciating pain. I'm not a particularly shy or passive person, but I would find that conversation very difficult even when not in labour. I might panic in the moment and wonder whether that amounted to some kind of breach of equality laws, or I might be in such a state that I just didn't want to risk any kind of conflict. Ultimately I would end up with a birth that may well be smooth from a medical point of view but somewhat tainted emotionally, as I would know that an aspect of the situation made me uncomfortable and I hadn't felt able to say anything.

Also, is midwifery even the kind of profession that would actually benefit from gender diversity given that women are the ones who give birth? I'm sure these very talented, compassionate men would be just as valued in a different branch of nursing. Obviously there are male doctors who can end up delivering a baby, but somehow it feels different for men to train in a role that is so intimate.

Very much open to different perspectives.

This is one of the most genuine 50 50 threads we've seen. I genuinely can't decide what's right.

@igglepiggle599
I was responding to the notion in the quote that "women are better because they have babies" Do keep up.

Make gynaecologists and obstetricians are slowly disappearing anyway 🤷‍♀️

80-90% of newly qualified ones are female, if you compare that to only a few decades ago it is a huge shift and change.

If they are very good at their clinical knowledge, skillful at practical tasks and have empathy and a great rapport with mothers - all qualities an expectant mother would want in a female midwife as well, I don't care if the midwife is female or male. I was looked after by a male midwife on the shift after I had delivered my baby and his care and his work were impeccable. There are male and female obstetricians; I don't see why midwives need to be all female.

Put it this way- I'm sure every mother prefers a skilled and caring male midwife to a dangerous and rude female one!

For the actual pushing part at the time I didn’t really care who was in the room and where and can’t really remember it but I definitely would not have wanted a male midwife for the earlier stages. I personally felt vulnerable enough and exposed with other women I didn’t know in the room and doing the (very invasive) vaginal examinations let alone a man. But that’s just my preference and would be the same for any gynaecological issue.

So because I had a bad experience with an older female midwife would it be fair for me to say I didn’t want one involved in my birth if I went to have another child and then in turn say I don’t think women over 55 should be midwives?

I’m not being completely serious with what I’m saying here and I’m not trying to be arsey. I just think is it fair because a, I’m guessing small percentage of women would feel uncomfortable with a male midwife we just shouldn’t allow it? Maybe we need to make the choice between male and female care an option at booking appointments so women don’t feel put on the spot at their most vulnerable moment during labour. I completely understand that although I am comfortably with a male midwife due to past experience that some wouldn’t be and they most definitely shouldn’t have it forced upon them.

*should say male not make!

Ah, I see, not my quote. Apologies. The 'Do keep up' was quite rude, though - people make mistakes (including you with your punctuation).

It might make her less empathetic and more impatient!

Likewise@Claire903 i think my posts are very contradictory and make no sense at all 🤯🤣

think I might popover to a thread with an easier question like parking or something 🤣🤣🤣 as long as there’s a diagram

Do you feel the same about male surgeons doing c sections and surgical placenta removal, and post birth stitches? Because I generally only hear this argument against male midwives, not male obstetric surgeons - is it maybe some old fashioned sexist assumptions about it being more ok for men to be surgeons?

When your in active labour and in that much pain and pushing I couldn't have cared less who walked past/ in the room I just wanted the pain to stop and my baby! When you have been examined down there that many times by both sexes all that is important is that you have someone qualified and knows what they are doing- but everyone has their own opinion this is just mine.

I think males can be midwives as long as it never leads to any woman being in a position where she has no choice. I think that’s a good middle ground.

Yabu. I had 2 male midwives, both were great. And the male registrar who delivered Ds5 saved both our lives.

I think you were probably wasting your time with that noble sacrifice tbh. Midwifery will always be female-dominated and reading some of these posts, you can see why!

Thing is there's a lot more to it than that. The act of getting a baby out, probably in a room full of people, is only a very minor part of the midwife's contact with the woman.

All those check ups, intimate and emotional conversations, breastfeeding advice, checks of birth injuries afterwards in your own home.

Apart from anything else it won't be possible for them to have a chaperone presumably? I've had a man doing a breast ultrasound and it was ok but it would have been frightening without a female chaperone present. I wouldn't want a male midwife in my home with no one else around showing me how to breastfeed, for example, or checking my vagina.

Similarly male gynecologists should not examine women without a chaperone.

And no obviously lesbians are not the same as men. This is about abuse, not about sexual attraction.

@TheStorksAccomplice

Please don't tell people to "keep up". It's patronising and rude. This isn't to do with who I agree with , by the way.

No it’s not necessarily about that. Logically I can tell myself that they are just professionals doing their job, but I can’t help the fact that I don’t feel as comfortable in the presence of men as I do women when I’m in a vulnerable position. It’s me, not them. I would have thought that was quite normal, human nature. But maybe I’m in the minority 🤷🏻‍♀️

Men shouldn't be midwives or gynaecologists. This should not be a controversial opinion.

I'm all for more male primary teachers and men in caring professions, but no they should not be midwives and they shouldn't be obstetricians. There are so many male obstetricians because the patriarchy has dominated women's health since they burned all the midwives at for being witches. So much medical stuff they tell us is just bollocks from the 1700s that no one has bothered to correct. (See.. due date) Just as we are getting more female obstetricians they start becoming midwives and it's supposed to be progressive. Fuck off away from our fannies! Just get a different job that doesn't involve fannies. What's wrong with you?!

Also people saying men should do it because they had bad women midwives.. there's a lot of misogyny coming out here. Maybe some midwives should be better, the answer shouldn't be 'lets get men to do it instead.'

Can't remember which baby but I overheard some midwives arguing over who would accompany me to the operating theatre!! Mine are 27-21.

Along the lines of, "you go", "no you go", "no you go, I don't know her"!!!!!!!

Bizarre.

I wouldn’t have wanted a male midwife, nothing to do with cultural reasons personally I just wouldn’t for the same reason I request a female nurse/doctor when discussing gynaecology issues/smear tests etc.

I do wonder how it’d be received if you were given a male midwife and requested a woman - I can’t imagine it would be met with understanding and a smile in the nhs.

Funnily enough as I was reading I was thinking - a male health visitor- no way would I have let a lone male health visitor into my house (assuming I was alone of course) to visit me and my new baby. Being alone in a house with a strange man and being so vulnerable after birth, it just wouldn’t have happened.

I personally wouldn't have liked having a male midwife at all but it looks like many would, if the poll is anything to go by.

Ah, but according to MN, most men are perverts, whereas female health professionals are not. Then again, all those disgusting men probably get a kick out of a female examining their genitalia, so maybe it shouldn’t be allowed for that reason 🙄