Asking fathers permission to propose

[janfebmar87]

Inspired by another thread but not a thread about a thread.

I really feel this is out dated and perpetuates the narrative that women are the possession of men

If we ever want true equality then we need to put "traditions" like this to bed.

My husband told my Dad that he was going to propose, before he asked me. He didn't ask permission to marry me as such. It was a case of 'I'm giving your prior notice that this is my intention'. My Dad was born in 1940, so it was more for his sake than ours, as he would have appreciated the gesture. I can't imagine today's younger generation even knowing that this was a tradition years ago and it would have been expected by the bride's Father.

Hmm perhaps it would have been useful if the ex-dhS HAD spoken to your DF...?

I would go even further and say that the meeting was necessary because marriage also involved dowry. It wasn't some cute romantic "boy meets girl" situation. In was a business transaction and the groom and the father needed to discuss transfer of land/property/cattle which was the primary reason for this "meeting". And the reason the groom had to ask the father is because women did not make financial decisions.
I am willing to bet my house deposit that the tradition of asking the father was not nearly as prevalent among poorer folk who had no dowry to arrange.

Correct.

I despair when I read all these 'the men control women' threads on here - waiting for a 'proposal', etc. ffs.

My husband asked my dad , to me it was more about approval and being a good enough man than possession - I like the idea

But that “tradition” is not rooted in respect, definitely not towards women. Traditionally this was a way of exchanging property - the father gives the husband to be the agreement to exchange property, that the property being the daughter.

We have three daughters, two got married in 2020 and one in 2023. Their husbands didn't ask my husband for permission but they did ask for his blessing. The weddings would have gone ahead regardless but it was a nod to tradition which they were all very keen on.

People really need to chill out.
If you don't want your other half to speak to your parents first, then tell them. If you do, that's also fine!!!
Stop telling women who like the idea that they are being controlled and are some god awful person ffs.

my DH (we were a "nugded in bed one morning and said - let's get married" couple, in fact i think i brought it up first) showed respect for my parents by being polite, not picking his nose at the dinner table, and showing interest in my dad's garden even though gardening bores DH to tears.

He showed respect to my mum by really appreciating her cooking (he's a chef, she worried about it) doing the washing up, and talking to her about the books they were reading

etc etc

He showed enormous respect to me by not being a patriarchal nob at any time since I've known him (which is 40+ years now)

What is respectful about it?

It's just me and dd. I would expect her future partner to ask my permission to marry her. If he decided not to, I'd be pissed off because I know that he'd do it for a man

If she's gay however, I wouldn't necessarily expect to be asked for permission

Did you speak to his parents? If not, why not? Why did you not think to show them any respect?

Because I didn't have a crystal ball & know that my husband was planning on asking me 😂If I was the one doing the proposing, then yes I would have asked them!

It's hard to explain clearly but no..

The first time one of us used the word marriage was probably talking about how we felt about marriage as a concept, did we think it was outdated etc - that's clearly not a proposal.

We had a number of lengthy discussions about what marriage meant to us, etc, well before deciding whether or not we wanted to do it.

It genuinely isn't possible to pin point a question moment for us

Exactly, and yet some people equate that with showing some kind of “respect” to the father, by asking him. Whereas this tradition, for women, was a form of the highest disrespect for the women who were actually just transactions between the their fathers and soon to be husbands. Nothing romantic about that.

Surely you’d already had discussions about your future together and whether marriage was part of that?

Not really. You should have said that you cannot give him an answer without asking his parents for their blessing.

I don't believe you, sorry! You genuinely would have gone and respectfully asked your in laws if they would let you marry their son?

I'd be pissed off because I know that he'd do it for a man

No, @MumOfOneAllAlone , there's a very good chance he wouldn't. Because hopefully your daughter will be an independent young woman who knows her own value and has no time for blokes who think they must check with a father before discussing her own future with her.

I think this is it. It's knowing that a parent is a bit 'old fashioned' so you might go through the motions and do it to please them. It is archaic though and I would have gone mad if DH had done it. My DM made a snarky comment after DH and I got engaged saying 'oh he never asked your dad, did he?' 😂She's so entrenched in 'doing the right thing' i.e. traditional that she completely doesn't realise how misogynistic she's being and supporting patriarchy

Thinks its more like asking the father if he deems them worthy enough to marry their daughter - I don't think its about possession - I know it was originally, but not now.

I think it's sweet, but not mandatory

In the good old days (although throughout the world this still sadly happens) respect = subservience. Nothing noble about it.

I've been married 3 times, ( I know 1st one was violent, 2nd a cheat) none asked my DF.

DH did jokingly while out having a drink with 18 year old DS ask if it was alright with him to marry his Mum. DS replied as long as he didn't hand me back this time!

Almost 25 years later he still hasn't.

I asked (told) my DH and no one’s parents were consulted!

@SleepyHippy3 but surely you can agree that this isn't what it means anymore and hasn't done for some time. asking permission now means that this person wants to love and look after this man's child (who he looked after for years of her life until adulthood) and does so enough that he wants to marry her? this isn't exchanging of property anymore.