To be kept awake by class scoring system?

[PurpleRains]

I’ve been lying in bed crying, so I think I might be being ridiculous, but here goes…

I have a lovely DS, aged 7, Year 2. At parents evening a couple of weeks ago I was told there were no concerns academically, some of his maths is at mastery level, and he is a good role model to his classmates, he is calm, sensible and friendly to others. When he has play dates at other people’s houses I’m told he’s been a pleasure, and he’s invited back. In other words, I’m confident my child is a good kid.

Here’s my problem… 3 weeks ago, the school introduced a new points system. Previously it was some kind of chart at school, and when they reached so many points they were allowed to choose something from a range of stationery items. I don’t think my child got loads of points, it didn’t really rate high on my day to day life unless he wanted to tell me.

The new system is an app. I can log on at anytime and see throughout the day whether my child has been awarded any points. Points are awarded for “demonstrating excellent learning behaviours” in things like listening, curiosity, risk-taking, perseverance, independence, cooperation, and resilience. I can also see whether he’s been awarded them as an individual or if the whole class got the point.

So far my child is receiving 3 to 5 points per week, 2-3 points have been awarded to the whole class.

The child who scores the most points in each class each week, receives recognition in assembly and a certificate I think. So far the top scores in his class have been 18 and 24!

I’m taking this far harder than my child! (who doesn’t mention it unless I ask). I can’t decide whether to
a) feel upset that my child’s obvious brilliance is being overlooked 😉
b) feel I’m failing as a parent as clearly my child is not demonstrating sufficient excellence at any of these 7 key qualities
c) be annoyed that the teacher must be awarding around 150-200 points a week, which I take to be one every 10 minutes, when they could be focusing on other children.

I think mostly I’m taking it personally and feel my parenting is being scored every day, and it’s stressing me out more than anything!

AIBU to be upset and stressed by this scoring system?

Ours raise over 50k per year. This year they have paid for IT equipment, new play equipment in playground and for coaches for year 2 swimming lessons. I think that's quite helpful.
Along with them getting half price panto and legoland tickets which saves parents money, running school discos and movies nights and Christmas activities for the children, a brilliant summer fayre
Why is it a 'bit wet' that parents want to raise money for the school. I'm not PTA, but all the PTA have full time jobs, families and stay up late doing PTA admin, they don't need to 'fill their life'.

That’s amazing! Totally unheard of where I’m from! I think I’d hold very different PTA opinions if that was the case here! Ours sell some Christmas candy canes and gossip in the playground 🙈.

I’m not sure why it doesn’t sit easy with me, probably my own bias in some way, I just think school should be your child’s environment unless there are serious problems you need to help them solve. I grew up in a school where hardly anyone had a working Mum and my (working) Mum and I used to giggle at how obsessed with every little thing the PTA parents were - they were the serial complainers at my school!

@CaptainRedbeardandbigbadbarry How about you don't judge all PTAs by your own deeply subjective experience, and I'll try not to judge you by your deeply subjective words.

Incidentally- do the people who think the PTA at their school is wet, ineffective or laughable ever think "hmm-maybe I could do something to make this better?"

if you can’t see on the app what score other kids got, how do you know the ones with high scores are “nice kids”? Maybe they’re the kids with troubled home lives, or SEN, or disruptive - these kids often get more points/stars etc, as they’re seen as needing the positive reinforcement more (as you say).

This thread took me right back.

Mummy why does (child x) get 3 points for sitting still on the carpet? I always sit still on the carpet and don't get any points.

No, they never do. In my experience (10 years of primary school and 20 years on MN), the people who actively dislike the PTA are lazy moaners with chips on their shoulders.

Plenty of people don’t have time to help obviously, so nothing against them. Plenty of people just don’t want to help, but appreciate what the helpers do, so nothing against them either.

But I have a low opinion of the people who moan about the PTA, make ridiculous claims about them getting special privileges, and say they do nothing apart from being cliquey gossips.

I was active in the PTA when mine were at primary. It wasn’t easy - I’m a working single parent - but it was clear to me that schools who relied on government funding alone were going to struggle. We worked tirelessly and made enough money to make a real difference to the school experience for all the kids. It took a huge amount of time and effort, but we did it for the kids. And I guarantee that we got no special treatment for it.

So if people don’t want to help the PTA, that’s fine. But don’t be a bitch and moan about them, when they’re working hard for your kids!

In defence of PTAs...

Our PTA is brilliant and they work really hard to raise money for the school and make all the children's school experience a bit more enjoyable. They put a lot of time and effort into organising and running events.

Their children don't get preferential treatment though. I've never given a child a single dojo, award, certificate, sticker or part in a play because their mum was on the PTA and no one has ever suggested I should either.

Do you mean like house points but in a an app like say Dojo?

Those points are given out without too much thought. Some kids aren't motivated by them at all. They aren't important and they don't reflect on your child. Don't worry about it.

@Spirallingdownwards "Mummy why does (child x) get 3 points for sitting still on the carpet? I always sit still on the carpet and don't get any points"

That's easily answered, and an excellent lesson into the bargain. "Because child x finds sitting still on the carpet really difficult, and it's really good if he manages it, and he's earned a point for doing something difficult. You find it easy so you don't earn a point for that- you earn a point for doing something you find difficult."

If PTA mum were true my DS would have been a shoe in for Head Boy

I was described as "a force of nature" by the HT at the Leavers Assembly.

DS never even got a handwriting certificate and I frequently did the "walk of shame" up to the teacher for his latest misdemeanour.

I also think it's incredibly disrespectful to teachers to suggest they routinely discriminate in favour of children whose mother runs the Christmas tombola......

Each school clearly has its own set of PTA parents and personalities to match.
I can only speak from experience.. ( 15 years ) of PTA and ours are pleasant enough but do think they are a cut above the rest of us.
I donate lots to the school and also volunteer regularly and I am happy with my own personal contribution.

As I said upthread, my daughter was head girl at primary.
I am just speaking from experience that’s all. And I am entitled to do that.

But how do you know that child finds it 'easy'. It's very hard for my oldest to sit still due to joint pains from being hypermobile, but she does it as she finds the 'distracting' children very annoying so tries her best to not be one of them. But she does so quietly without fuss. Just because a child isn't noisy doesn't mean they find sitting easier, or the work easier, sometimes they just put more effort in.

Other children muck around and boast that they are 'teachers favourite' as the second they are good they get lots of merits/ points. My youngest (likely ADHD) was getting lots of points for sitting still, when it's no harder for her to do than her sister, she has just learnt she can get away with more due to attracting attention.

As adults we don't get paid more to do the same job if we find it harder than another person who finds it easier, and we are setting our children up for failure if we are teaching them they can get more for achieving less, the world of work cares about output not effort. I have had graduate trainees come through my hospital department thinking they should get a great grade due to 'hard work'. We will make reasonable adjustments for disabilities but ultimately their work has to be as high a quality as someone without a disability, otherwise is unfair on patients and potentially unsafe.

This is pretty mean spirited. Schools have SO little money these days and our pta fundraises for stuff like extra glue sticks, art supplies and to pay the shortfall on school trips so all kids can go. It's not like they get paid for it and it's not like the staff have time to organise a Christmas fair etc.

The idea that their kids would get special treatment is ridiculous though. I'd struggle to remember who they were off the top of my head and it's not like the pta have any sway over teachers or what happens in schools.

I think people are mixing up with parent governors but even then teachers aren't that small minded.

I totally agree. If anything, staff try to keep a distance from those parents as we are aware they think volunteering with the PTA gets them extra benefits with the school. The PTA in my last school raised a lot of money and organised a lot of fun things for the children but undoubtedly the parents thought it was a ticket for VIP access to the school. So many of them tried to wander around the school to nosey around under the pretext of organising activities. The same goes for parent governors.

Yanbu dc school has a similar system. It’s the same children getting rewards or doing the special assembly tasks all the time; the teachers pets and the very naughty ones who need extra encouragement. It was OK in reception but started to breed resentment amongst parents and the children in later years.

It’d hard explaining to your dc why they are never recognised, or conversely why they are always chosen and then resented by their peers.

It’s a life lesson though!

Honestly, this is a significantly better lesson to prepare kids for work place than uniform rules. If you're managers favourite you'll do better at work, get better assignments and preferential treatment. Those who are trouble makers get attention and praise when they've done something and they might be managers faves.

Is your child bothered about these points?

Ours is the same. We are a one form entry school raising £40k plus a year. The funds pay for things like resurfacing the Astro turf pitch (which the school rents out in the evenings to raise more money), school trips for those who can’t afford them and playground equipment. Virtually everyone involved also has a “real” job, as well as their kids to look after, various other responsibilities etc. If you want something done, ask a busy person….

The ones who stand on the sidelines rolling their eyes and never volunteer for a shift at the Christmas fair are the ones who don’t have jobs. I wish PP (not you @Bushmillsbabe!) would stop with the bitchy, snide remarks - being on the PTA is a thankless task already and I bet the sideline snipers’ kids are benefitting from the funds raised.

My child used to get so discouraged by this. He would always be near bottom of the class for points. However if you asked the teacher to describe how he was getting on they said well behaved, kind, hard working, always tries their best and shy! In fact i was told they would love a whole class of my son! After a little bit of digging the kids getting the points were the ones that struggled with behaviour or the ones who were a louder presence. Honestly my boy was quiet, never caused any problem and honestly he was forgotten. I could see why he was forgotten given the other behaviour issues in the class. In the end I sent a nicely worded gentle message to his teacher saying he was getting discouraged by how few points he was getting and what could he could do to increase them. He got more points after that. But honestly the only thing that really helped him be noticed was secondary school where he had a different teacher for each lesson and they definitely recognised his efforts more.

As a parent governor with a focus on SEN, I am supossed to 'go for a nosey' on a regular basis, the SLT encourage us to do a mixture of pre planned and un announced visits, thats why we have a DBS, to enable us to walk around the school unaccompanied.
PTA and helpers without a DBS shouldn't be doing this though.

Absolutely. The number of people who say 'I couldn't possibly volunteer an hour of my time, I work and have children'. Errr, we all have children, we wouldn't be here otherwise!

I like that 'if you want something done, ask a busy person'. At the end of the day, who helps hasnothing to do with how busy they are and everything to do with who they are and their priorities. For me, my children are my highest priority, and making their school better helps them, I don't do it due to being a 'saintly person' or for thanks or privileges. I do it to give them the best educational experience, and to support their fabulous teachers, who we are very privileged to have work their socks off for our children

As a child who got sweet FA at school but who went on to get a 1st class honours degree and some, the whole points set up is rubbish and real crap for the poor kids who hardly get any points.

Thinking the worst of people or cynicism taken to the extreme is an unfortunate reaction when someone doesn't get what they think they were entitled too. This attitude formed part of the comedy around Hyacinth Bucket in Keeping Up Appearances. It is not a good attitude to have as you will be viewed as jealous and entitled. If the OP thinks there is some indication their child is underperforming they could arrange a meeting with the teacher.