To think this is an unacceptable wage?

[Youthiswastedontheyoung]

I'm a qualified teacher with 21 years' experience who has just started supply so flexibility with a poorly husband and three kids of my own.
Just did a full day supply (8.30-3.30) and came out with £112 net.
Hubby thinks decent wage, I think piss-take!
Opinions please!

Get a better paid job?

OP, I'm a qualified teacher, but I now do an hourly paid role as a peripatetic teacher in the charity sector. I'm paid £40 an hour. I can also claim travel to and from work as an expense. I think £40 a hour is about right for a self employed teacher.

You've been a part-time TA for the last 5 years, so why would you expect to progress a teaching career in that time? Thats not discrimination. Stop being disingenuous.

At my school there’s a deputy and assistant head (female) who job-share. They are very much not discriminated against. The rarity of part-time senior leadership roles is not specific to teaching.

Let’s talk flexibility. As a classroom teacher you can’t just do a WFH day. I have seen flex with PPA time and some home-working, albeit very limited. I work way more than my contracted hours, am on-site >15 days of 20 and don’t have options in school holidays. So define flexibility?

I give up my time, which I don’t have a lot of, for free, to support schools and teachers who do an amazing job. Every meeting I advocate for teachers with all sorts of externals agencies and with the Head. However, what I don’t accept is some of the comments you’ve made which are v specific to your circumstance.

@Fluufer 21 - 5 = 16 (years) prior to that.

Ok? And now you're a part time temp. You can't progress in a career you haven't been working in. Not sure why you would consider that discrimination.

@Enchente Exactly that. There is no flexibility.
One of my friends has a daughter who has started Reception with mine. She can WFH nearly all of the time and do all school runs.
My husband is offered flexi-time so he can take half hour lunch and start/finish half hour early. He is able to take our daugjter to school because of this.
They can both attend lots of school events.
Obviously being in school 7.30 - 5.30 this isn't an option.
These are just two examples and why mothers are turning away from teaching.

@Fluufer No - I'm also a 0.5 Class Teacher.

Haven't read the full thread OP but agency supply told me this week they were on £160 a day so you need to haggle for the extra £20.
You have more leverage if on more than one agency's books but then tax gets awry with more than one employer.
Working directly for the school as day-to-day regular supply best way to go but hard to come by these days.

I’ve been teaching 31 years. I’ve just taken a year out of my permanent job to do supply and travel. I get £220 a day but it’s long term and I mark, plan and do parents evenings. So I work 8-4.30 on average. If I was just day to day I’d get £170. Both figure are before tax.

Yes, you said on your other thread it's maternity cover. So a part time temp, like I said.
You can't pick and choose which bits are true to suit.

@Fluufer Do you have any knowledge of the payscales in teaching?

So basically you want to WFH full-time. What does that person do? I know WFH call centre workers who earn NMW. Plenty more jobs are going back in the office.

Your selective listening is exhausting so will
leave you to it. I hope you find a job that gives you all the flexibility you want, that you’re qualified for, and that pays what you expect. That’s a rare find indeed.

I'm confused about this thread - no one is going to make great money in any profession working part time, having had 3 maternity leaves and with children spaced out, doing casual extra hours on supply and seemingly not taking on too much extra responsibilities. That is not unique to teaching. It's the same in most professions. The supply rate sounds fair to me and comparable to many other jobs that would have comparable requirements.

It's a trade off and a choice. Professions have a progression route, if someone is ambitious and wants to achieve the higher range of financial return for their profession then they follow the progression route. Or if not fussed with that or want more flexibility then they can stick it out at the lower levels long term. Time spent will not make much difference to that. That is why in many professional firms there are always some younger people being made partner, getting big pay rises and others that have been working for 20 years but have plodded along and stayed st pretty much the same level as when they were NQs.

@Enchente You're the one not listening. I am talking about the inflexibility of teaching. I encourage you as a govenor to speak to your teachers. Find out more about what is they actually do. What they sacrifice, especially with regards to their own children.

When I did a days supply I got £180 per day. This was 6 years ago. Did you negotiate directly with the school or was it through an agency? I negotiated directly with the school. They were desperate as no teacher for 3 weeks as Nd exams coming up. I told them I'd pick up the pieces and teach the exam.classes 2 GCSE groups and 2 A level groups but I wanted £180 a day. Head agreed immediately. I was there for 3 months until after their exams.

As to what I think of the wage:

I was doing supply in 2000-2003 and I was on
£85/a day then (when I first started out) moving to
£110/after I began haggling ending on
£115/120 for being completely flexible travel-wise
I also had a school use me regularly and pay me towards petrol money in cash to keep me! Unheard of now.
That was twenty years ago.
Even then because of wear and tear on the car, gaps at the start and end and petrol, I think my actual wage ended up being 18K.
Then we had the advent of Cover Supervisors and the gap fell out the market.
I became one.
Roll on two decades...
I went back to work after being out the game a while and was paid £115/day to start with then £120. £85 if cover supervisor rates. £55 if morning or afternoon only. They must have seen me coming. Covid didn't make it more lucrative for me.
£153.85 a day for supply is equivalent to M1 iirc but still doesn't help with frozen pensions or crappy new outsourced ones, no holiday, sick pay etc
But you have the stress of running the room rather than the stress of getting their grades.
I am now a Cover Supervisor 5 days a week. My take home per month after tax is £1500/a month which quite frankly sucks. But it works for me. It is so low though that I'd be entitled to UC top-ups (I don't claim atm because I'd hate being judged on what I buy when having my statements scrutinised. I spend way too much on Maccy Ds).
I think Seconded Supply can work (still regret not taking on a role in Wigan), long term supply is a poisoned chalice, day-to-day supply is haphazard, part-time anything is half the pay but often as much work, cover supervisor is a shit title and a poorly paid underappreciated role. But I also know that there's not as much out there with transferrable skills unless you look at NHS reception work/School administrator/attendance/pastoral which don't pay that much more especially if pro-rated.
I am QTS with two degrees and 30+ years of experience incidentally!
I feel your pain. x

You’ve assumed this is OPs level of capability.

I had to prepare and set all work, teach the students and mark and prep students for their exams. Their permanent teacher had left nothing for them. Not even worksheets. She was off for 4 months with stress.

I think OP - given that our supply on £160/a day before tax comes off are still costing the school £220/a day because of the £60 agency fee/cut you could negotiate yourself a better deal once you become a "known" quantity.
Careful though as your agency will demand a Finder's Fee from any school you got to know through them if they get wind of it.

It's a shame that "teaching pools" died a death. You'd think these multi-academy trusts would get their head in the game and start running their own.

Okay, but I also have to work through most school holidays. I also am regularly expected to log on after hours to liaise with clients in other time zones, or just to complete my work. I get some measure of flexibility but lose out in other areas of work life balance. You seem to want all the positives and none of the trade offs.

Yes I have to say, although the hourly rate in counselling is very good, to actually build up a client base enough to earn anything like a decent full time wage will take a number of years post-qualification. Then obviously you need to keep finding new clients as receiving counselling is not long-term for most people. I know this from experience of a friend doing the same thing- luckily she also has a high-earning husband otherwise it would not have been viable.

@Mnetcurious I'm more than happy to take a few years to build up a client base; I'm not working ft currently as is.
Teaching is only going to get worse as the retention and recruitment crisis deepens.

There are good salaries in teaching but as with every other profession it takes self development and additional responsiblities and hard work to achieve them. Every profession requires "unpaid overtime" and additional training/skills/qualifications to progress up the ladder to the higher salaries. Or as pp suggest - they take on tutoring to top up incomes - is there a reason you don't do this?

You have chosen to work in a temporary 0.5 contract as a classroom teacher without additional responsibilities and top that up with a day of contract work paying between £22-24 per hour - not the £16 you claim. There are many people living and working on less than £16 per hour gross - including people with degrees and postgrad qualifications and responsibilities.

Why do you not look for a full time contract? Yes I know you have said "work life balance" but we all struggle with that at times and we don't all have the luxury of part time because we have bills to pay. For someone who is so relentlessly hostile to "lazy SAHMs" (even on this thread you put in a dig) you seem quite happy to soft peddle on part time or less if it gets you UC.

You complain that you could earn more cleaning - so give it a try. You might not find it quite the easy billet you claim it is but if your attitude to teaching is as relentlessly negative as you have posted on quite a number of threads here its possibly a useful stopgap whilst you train to do something else you might enjoy more. Oh and those people WFH and doing the school run - many will be on NMW and many more will be doing it by clocking in plenty of hours before the DC rise and after they go to bed. Most will also have spent years building up relationships and trust.

Are you planning to take any of the advice from the other threads? Is your husband now going to apply for relevant benefits if you are struggling for money? Or will you go full time to solve your money problems?

Lots of women have jobs that make it difficult (or impossible) to be around for school drop off/pick up. Shift workers for a start.

No one is intentionally downgrading the worth of teachers but it's not the only profession where sacrifices are made.