I didn’t leave the left. The left, left me.

[GenerativeAIBot]

Stop me if you have already heard this the last few days, I am trying to make sense of how I feel about Trump and other right leaning wins:

“Woke” issues being pushed to where they have been, has empowered the right by giving them something real and legitimate to campaign against. Something more than their usual transparently false bogeymen.

In general, Authoritarianism, compelled speech, no debate. Specifically men in women’s sports, in women’s changing rooms, unfettered immigration, being asked to ignore the evidence in front of our eyes.

This is happening across the world, Italy, France, Germany, USA, UK.

I remain entirely committed to progressive taxation, a social safety net, collective bargaining, workers rights, public schooling and health services as well as the rights of everyone to live contented, unmolested lives.

I reject identity politics in their entirety. For example, I consider terms like “Woman of colour” to be the epitome of divisive, racist, sexist thought patterns that seeks to infantilise people and move their locus of control from internal to external. Disempowering people and making them victims.

I didn’t leave the left. The left left me.

Reasonable?

Le sigh. 😮‍💨 😔

All I can suggest is that you read some more academic and scientific papers about different understandings of sex and gender.

Honestly, I feel like the left have barely moved. In fact, I would say that the Dems in the US plus the current Labour Party are pretty much centrist.

I appreciate that people hone in on gender issues but there's not really a significant difference between Labour and the Torries on that front. There is a much bigger gulf in the US, of course, but for me it just isn't a core or particularly important issue in that it has never affected my life.

In the US, it is the right that has moved into fascism - and I don't use that word lightly or for hyperbole, it's what Trump's own former Chief of Staff (themselves a traditional conservative) believe him to be. He also tried to overthrow an election (and personally, I think Jan 6 amount to terrorism).

Unfortunately, the right wing media empire is very very powerful and good at pushing the narrative that the left has become extreme. Perhaps it has on isolated issues, but the American right is probably the most extremist mainstream political movement the western world has seen this side of the Second World War.

You'll be told that that doesn't count (because no one expects better from the Tories). If you mention Boris Johnson,you'll be told that you're living in the past. They're very adept at deflection.

@ThePerkyDuck
How many peanuts need to be added to a nut free dish to make it no longer nut free ?

THe issue is about men pushing women around
and if they are not pushed back into their lane
you end up with Afghanistan

I am not telling people what they should care about I just wrote what I THINK (free speech?) they should care about by pointing at issues that are not discussed by the majority of politicians, especially the right wing ones, as their rhetoric is mostly about trans people and migrants.

Funny that, because it's the lack of empathy towards women and girls from those who want to centre men's interests above them that really grates me.

The failure to realise that males are the oppressor class, however they identify, while female are the oppressed.

Telling women it's not only A-ok for their equality, prizes and safety to be taken away from them, but that they're also supposed to STFU, cheer it on, and 'be kind' to blokes who've had every advantage of growing up male but now decide that their special identity trumps the right of others. Or they're bigots.

That injustice really grates, yes.

Exactly many people don't realise how far to the right they have moved. I looked at old bnp national front leaflets with talking points that many are now so comfortable to say mainstream parties. That's how far we have gone that way it's very obvious

Ok, you are fine to care about all those things.
Most people do care, to some extent, about most of those things.

But they are not the things that win elections.

It's much more nuanced then that and I know many of your side may not think that. As a woman myself disabled I dong think my best mate who is trans is affecting my rights but I tell you what who is the same right wing arseholes that hate her abd me and that many on your side now like

I think part of the problem is that politics has got a lot more tribal since the advent of social media. So many times I see people saying "don't talk to me if you are a Tory" or things to this effect, and now if you are left leaning you are the devil incarnate. Saying that you don't want to speak to people who disagree with you can never end well.
Then in the UK, the huge amount of people who are pretty much centrists end up feeling hated on by both sides and feeling like they have to pick a side, positions become more entrenched and the cycle goes on.

'Your side'?

Which 'side' do you think I'm on? Who are you referring to?

Actually, there are plenty of us who reject WOC. Me, my friends and their friends. I despise the term - it's American identity politics language. It's othering, while at the same time lazily lumping us into one pot - we are a myriad of different cultures, languages and experiences.

But they are not the things that win elections.

This seems to be the case for sure. What I don’t fully understand is why that is.

Take it you don't care then? Funny that your concern only stretches to SOME minority groups. Why is that? The OP started a thread to discuss our disillusionment with the left and you know, Labour who happen to be in government right now...can't speak for the Tories, I've never voted for them 🤷

Because poor people outnumber rich people.
It is a pyramid.
And when poor people are suffering financially, they will vote for whichever politician or party promises to address their suffering.
Food, rent, finding a dentist, buying the kids shoes. These are the things that matter to most people.
Worrying about ableism, racism, misogyny, etc. is too abstract and too much of a luxury. There is no head-space for it when you are thinking about what on earth to feed the kids tonight or how to keep your car on the road to get to work.

*The failure to realise that males are the oppressor class…, while female are the oppressed.”

Again why are you naturalising this- suggesting it is rooted in biology? Thats a really disturbing position..

I do care actually i don't care for hypocrisy so who did yiu vote fir? If uou have such disillusionment with the left I always find that is normally not the case and that people have voted for the tories but that's my cynical mind that or reform. Do I think antisemitism is right nope kf course not however I never see anyone sorting it from the other side . Antisemitism is different from critiquing the pm of Israel for killing innocent Palestinians and I can also state that hamas has ruined Palestine and both sides need rid of their leadership and then hopefully there could be peace .

Bull shit i am poor I just happen to think of the big picture I happen to believe in equality and that we all bleed the same

But the democrats , for example;, are trying to give poor people health coverage , but that doesn’t seem to win them votes! I don’t think people are rational like you are suggesting. Thats not what I see. What is see is that people hate foreigners and women more than they care about access to healthcare, for example. Apparently they do find the luxury for that and don’t feel it’s too abstract!

I agree

One thing we can all agree on is predictive text sucks omg it keeps changing my words lol

Liberal extremists have took it over.

Just like neoliberals have taken over the uni party of Lab-Con.

Take it you r a socialist so you don't agree with equality then just equality of capital

Do you mean it is disturbing that people believe oppression is rooted in biology?

Or do you mean it is disturbing that oppression is rooted in biology?

The first is a matter of people noticing reality, 'believing' reality.
The second is just reality.

Yes, sometimes reality is really disturbing, distressing, frightening, disgusting, and rage-inducing. Which is why it is so important to see it for what it is, name the beast accurately, then you can fight it.
You can't fight the reality of the fact that oppression is rooted in biology. But you can fight the oppression itself, first by seeing it clearly.
You fight the oppression, not the biology.

The thing that did upset me on the left is straight after Oct 7th people were marching for Palestine I thought that was really bad . Now I can say Israel has hone far to far but that then at that time the very next day was wrong and it showed some havd an agenda I don't agree with that even though I class myself as left centre