Christmas and a Muslim husband .. help!

[AmberHiker]

Hello everyone I’d really like some outside perspective because I’m literally drained from going around in circles with my husband .

He is a born Muslim. He is on and off with the level of practising but mainly sticks to the key principles of Islam but has not been praying for some years now . I am a revert. I am not a ‘ practising ‘ Muslim but I believe in Islam and what it stands for .

we have a 8 year old son and I have older kids who aren’t Muslim. For the past 11 years I’ve changed up Christmas but not given it up as for me it was never about the relegious aspect it was about the feeling , the gift giving and decorating the home plus enjoying all the foods and so on. With our son I still decorate the home and we exchange gifts a few days before Christmas. He is aware of who god is to him and to us and what we believe in.

my husband has really been giving me a hard time over recent weeks . He has stated I’m a Christian which I’m not and that I’m acting just like one . He refuses to agree that for me I’ve never linked Christmas to religion and he’s never seen me do it. He keeps going into massive tantrums pointing out I’m showing our son the wrong way . This is making me upset as I don’t feel we have much to look forward too in the uk and Christmas is a nice time of year. I enjoy the festivity and owe it to my older grown children to share with them.

when I point out that he is not doing anything that would identify him as a Muslim to me if I didn’t know him he gets offended. He is not practising not praying not fasting but is determined to take this away from me and our son. like I said if he was devout I could understand the possible problem by example having a tree in the house decorated but he isn’t and the whole thing seems so stupid .

for context he was previously married to a devout Christian who taught and showed him about Christmas ( this is where I think he has the impression it’s for relegious people ) and during their marriage Christmas a big thing in their home too, but so was bacon and alcohol. If I was to ask him was he a Muslim where he was married to her he would say yes he was yet that was allowed to happen …

sorry for the rant but all I do is share some gifts and decorate the home yet it’s a constant battle any mention of the c word and boom it’s a argument. He said I should spend the same effort showing our son about Islam but when I pointed out it’s his job as the man to lead he said he doesn’t have time to show him.. 😂

am I wrong to not give it up

Is anyone else wondering why a man who wants to observe the requirements of Islam (well he wants other people to. Not himself obviously. Oh no.) has been married twice, both times to a non Muslim woman? Why hasn't he married a born Muslim who would understand and share his beliefs and life choices?

I just think there's something really odd (suspect, even?) about this. That a Muslim woman wouldn't expect him to pick and choose which bits of Islam he wants to obey? She might point out to him that he completely ignores four of the five Pillars of Islam. Or is there something more?

Whatever, he's an out and out hypocrite. A Santa hat so that he gets better tips??? That's just as much Christmas as a tree and presents, if not more so because it directly references Father Christmas - St. Nicholas, a saint of another religion.

And just to add for info - a Muslim man can marry a Christian woman, but a Muslim woman can ONLY marry a Muslim man. No picking and choosing there.

He's trying to control you. I wouldn't hang around.

of course the responsibility sits squarely with the individual and what an utter straw man. But as nation, we have empowered terrorist organisations, armed them, funded them when it suited us, and then we act very surprised that they are in fact terrorist organisations.

they are cults at the end of the day and it’s never well rounded individuals that joint cults it’s vulnerable people who have been groomed

I’m so glad to see you confirm that Islam does not recognise the Christian Jesus.

So often I’ve had Muslims tell me that Isa-ibn-Maryam and the Lord Jesus Christ are the same, when of course we all know that’s not true.

That’s not all that Christmas is to those who follow the Lord Jesus.

It’s an interesting theological point, that Jesus son of Mary means different things to different people, the Christ of faith has many faces.

so whilst Muslims believe in Jesus son of Mary as prophet who delivered revelation and performed miracles and is the messiah, we don’t recognise him as the son of God. We believe he ascended to heaven but he didn’t die and rise from the dead nor did he die for our sins. I personally believe that he was placed on the cross but didn’t die there.

so they are in essence the same historical person but Muslims do not believe in the Christian narrative of Jesus. So Jesus son of Mary and isa bin maryam are the same person, but the Christ of faith looks different to a Muslim as it does to a Christian. We believe that this (the Christian version) is wrong and Jesus never claimed to be the son of God etc. You can’t be a Muslim and not believe in Jesus but equally you can’t be a Muslim and believe in the Christian version of Jesus

If the DH was a Muslim in more than name only we wouldn't be having this discussion

Indeed, and as things stand it looks - not for the first time - more like a control issue than anything to do with religion

Good luck with not wanting his negativity to impact your son though, OP; I'd expect that to be a struggle which will only get worse as he grows up, given that the examples his father's setting are neither ideal nor Islamic

This!

It seems that the husband was happy chomping down on a bacon butty and has no interest in living even a vaguely devout life himself, so maybe he should get his faith in order before criticizing the OP.

Sounds like time for him to don the Holiday Armadillo suit and to teach your son about Islam.

The OP has said she doesn’t believe celebrating Christmas is a sin, when Islamically it most definitely is. Fair enough if you want to celebrate but don’t say it’s not a sin to make yourself feel better.

Most British Muslims do not celebrate Christmas and we have no issue with those who want to celebrate but the Muslims on this thread are giving the Op advice from a Islamic point of view, whether people like that or not. I’m sure the OP knew she’d get a variety of opinions, Muslim and non Muslim.

Whether her husband is practicing or not, as Muslims we must make a conscious effort to better ourselves as Muslims. So although he doesn't pray, fast, celebrated in the past, that does not rule out that one day he may become a practicing Muslim and if this is his turning point to get to that position then Allah will be pleased with him.

Those who are saying he’s trying to control her because he’s a man etc, I’m a muslim woman and I would tell my non Muslim husband (hypothetically considering I wouldn't be able to marry a non Muslim man) that I don’t want to be celebrating Christmas, I would put my foot down on it - would your opinion be the same about me?

as I’ve been told that makes us hardline 🙃😅

I gave the Iranian quote (shia) above. Just like Christianity there are different kinds of islam. Obviously anyone very devout in their own religion will believe it is the one right path and indeed only trying to be kind when pointing things out but that does not make them right, of course. The "exportation of democracy" point is interesting. I am certainly very glad we have democracy in the West and do not like the regimes in many countries without democracy such as Saudi, Iran etc. never mind Russia. However we do allow people to express views against democracy in the UK even though in plenty of those other terrible regimes their leaders not allow such freedom.

Those who are saying he’s trying to control her because he’s a man etc, I’m a muslim woman and I would tell my non Muslim husband (hypothetically considering I wouldn't be able to marry a non Muslim man) that I don’t want to be celebrating Christmas, I would put my foot down on it - would your opinion be the same about me?

Yes. If you were utterly non-observant in all other respects. I'd think you a hypocrite and a killjoy.

If you weren't practising in any other way then I'd just assume you were a massive attention seeker tbh.

So if the Op had instead wrote that her husband has started to pray everyday over the last few months and reconnecting with his faith again, what would your advice be to the OP then? Would you then say no you shouldn't celebrate with your non Muslim children?

But she didn't write that. She made it clear that her dh doesn't pray or fast, he's just started to get up himself about Christmas.

@Brananan let me rephrase

What if this is him turning a point and wanting to become closer to his religion and may start praying in a few weeks/months? Muslims aren’t perfect and we make mistakes but that doesn’t mean that we will never change or become closer to our faith.

Many Muslims would have left Islam if we went with ‘ohhhh he’s shit Muslim why does he care now’.. Allah is the most forgiving, no one can judge him on his journey in Islam other than our Lord.

he and his convert wife have their own religious journey different from each other and he should not be imposing his requirements on to her particularly as he knew when he married her that she had atheist adult children who celebrate Christmas. He should have agreed all this with her in advance. If not then he will just have to put up with things continuing - ie her eating a non religious meal with her adult children for our UK secular Christmas bank holiday - indeed they eat it on 23 December

He could wait until after Christmas
It's not his wife's problem that he feels guilty about not doing Islam right all of a sudden.

@mumstheword223

What if this is him turning a point and wanting to become closer to his religion and may start praying in a few weeks/months?

But that is a very big IF and a very big MAY. I am perhaps not as hopeful as you. What if he doesn't but only expects the teachings of the faith to apply to others, particularly his wife? What if he never turns to prayer, never finds the time to educate his son in the ways of Allah? Simply puts his foot down over Christmas (apart from wearing a Santa hat to get bigger tips).

Allah finds joy in those who repent and return to His ways and I understand that good Muslims on this thread would love to see the DH becoming a better Muslim. But if I was a betting person and had to put my last hairgrip on his motivation, given his past and present behaviour, I'm afraid I would put it on this not being his moment of enlightenment but rather his moment of hypocrisy in his desire for control. Do as I say, not as I do.

Interesting though that the very first thing you reached for, when taking about Islamist terror, was to blame others
'doesn't happen in a vacuum'.

things don’t happen in a vacuum, it doesn’t excuse the actions of the violent or brainwashed few but it does provide context. I’m sorry that doesn’t fit with your narrative that Muslims are backwards and stupid and Islam is an inherently violent religion.

Well, Islamically, a man has a right to say no. Whether he’s practicing in other aspects or not. These are the rules of Islam, the Op should know the basic rights of her husband, such as providing for his wife and children (as well as her own rights as women and wife) when she reverted.

The OP seems have reverted on the assumption that she and her husband wouldn’t be practicing any the main aspects of Islam so I’m confused as to why the Op has reverted? If you care so much about Christmas then coming into a religion which says it’s a sin to celebrate is very confusing to me.

He has a right to say no on behalf of his wife and children then does he?

Yes.