To be so disappointed in people - Trump voters especially

[notsorighteousthesedays]

I feel absolutely stunned that despite all that has been said and done Trump is likely to get the chance to make the world burn a little faster.

I am afraid for a future so full of anger and hate.

Horrified to see the news this morning. Had convinced myself that there would have been a narrow Democrat victory. Trump terrifies me.

Im assuming that he was referring to what it had become under Biden. Although TBH he says all kinds of shit. He literally opens his mouth and it falls out.

Im certainly no fan of his, I am appalled by the results Im just trying to understand the mindset of why people would have voted that way

You responded to my original comment.

Fair dos, though, if I misinterpreted anything.

Look at what’s been found out about Ed Milliband

What?

So you think it's a good use of your vote to 'get at' those you disagree with rather than what you think is best for you and yours?

That's what disappoints me.

What the fuck are you talking about? Who wants to kill a tiny baby?

Are you talking about Trump saying that babies were being aborted 'after the birth'? If you believe that you need medical help.

Anyway, RFK is going to ban vaccines so there will be loads of infant deaths from preventable diseases so will you be crying about those deaths? I very much doubt it. Like most people who are anti-abortion, they only care about the babies in the womb but couldn't care less about them once they've been born. As George Carlin said, 'if you're pre-born you're fine, if you're pre-school you're fucked'.

This. In a nutshell.

Gender dysphoria can be caused by testosterone exposure in the womb, and by genetic elements. Look for my post upthread for some links to some scientific papers and to the Mayo Clinic.

Yes, they need to read the room and realise that people care about immigration and not just ignore it.

Until the do that the likes of Trump will keep being elected and the whole world will suffer.

I feel absolutely stunned that despite all that has been said and done Trump is likely to get the chance to make the world burn a little faster

Yes, one of this first acts in his first presidency was to withdraw US from the Paris Accord (and one of Biden's first was to re-enter it).

I expect he'll pull them out again early next year

"she was shockingly inarticulate and came across as quite ill educated given the positions she has held. "

Is Trump articulate?

She is 'ill educated' but has more degrees than him?

Is he more qualified for political office than someone who has worked in politics for years?

FFS

Respectfully, I am aware of DSDs.

They should not be conflated, however, with men who know what they are or somehow believe they are something for which they have no frame of reference, taking sports places and single sex spaces from women and girls.

Funding his own ‘independent research’ and passing it off as independent support as to why he can pass the policies he wants to.

For the people who whine about X, this is why it’s important. You never hear about this stuff anywhere else.

An accurate explanation of what's happened, time and again, would be this: capitalism, by its nature, is right-wing. It doesn’t seek to improve the lives of all, but rather to concentrate wealth in the hands of the few. Its need for growth means it must constantly find new people to exploit.

This was fine in its infancy, when the exploited were out of sight and out of mind. But as time goes on, its greed expands ever upward, and those who once benefited from capitalism's advances are now being consumed by it. Working-class people's lives aren't getting harder because migrants have moved here. They’re getting harder because those in power refuse to invest in public infrastructure or innovation that doesn’t create profit.

People lending their support to the right because they “don’t feel heard” by the left on immigration or economic prosperity are, frankly, deluded. I’m sorry if that sounds harsh, but there's no other word for it. They’re handing power to people whose sole purpose is to make sure wealth doesn’t “trickle down” and to keep them at the base of the pyramid, to be exploited even further.

This is the root of the issue, a country cannot have both a strong economy, with plentiful resources for all, and be insular and homogenous, and until people on the right are willing to accept this they will always be angry.

Anyone with a brain worries about him, but until the Democrats realise that people don't like their extreme left wing ideologies, the likes of Trump will keep being elected.

On an economic level people genuinely believe they will be better off under Trump. If they genuinely believe that why shouldn't they vote for him?
The stock markets have responded very favourably to the election result.

A lot of women have become fed up with the impact of identity politics under the Democrats. They no longer have single sex sport. If this issue is important to them why shouldn't they vote for him?

Generally some people are fed up with the Democrats position on an ideology that isn't based in material reality and harms women and children, if that is important to them why shouldn't they vote for the party they feel best aligns with their views?

I mean honestly are you so blinkered that you can't see ANY reason that any person would prefer Trump?

This result isn't close, he's likely to win the popular vote as well as the electoral college.

So maybe stop being so patronising to people with different views to yours and start engaging wtih them?

BTW if I had the vote in the USA I think I would have voted Harris.

What do you think will happen if Trump stops USA funding to Ukraine?

1. Negotiation. Ukraine cedes territory.
2. Ukraine cannot maintain and abandons lost territory. Putin continues to try to take the remainder of Ukraine (??), EU continues to support Ukraine. Conflict for several more years. Maybe some kind of negotiation/treaty after that time. Or maybe Russia somehow takes Kiev, in which case they now have the entirety of Ukraine to incorporate, a disgruntled population and possibly mass emigration from Western Ukrainian regions. Are they financially and demographically able to press on (and what reason do they have for doing so?*) or are they more likely to form a new treaty with the EU or border nations?

*"Putin is power hungry!" Sure, maybe. But power hungry enough to decimate Russia in order to invade an EU member state that he would have trouble seizing (even assuming NATO do not get involved), let alone holding onto long term?? Like it or not, there are certain parts of Ukraine that don't object to being incorporated into Russia. The same is not true of Poland, Czech Republic, etc. They would be an eternal economic drain.

The only mild positive of this is that once these next 4 years with the Muppet is over he then can't run again as he will have had his two terms so this whole circus will hopefully have an end date in sight (unlike in the UK where people can run indefinitely).

Well that's all very sad but humans still are either male or female and there are times when that matters.

The economy mainly. Under Biden they had inflation, rising prices etc.

Trump talked about the economy. Harris didn't talk about much at all and just attacked opponents.

Biden certainly hasn't been a success. Suddenly the VP was presented as their candidate without sufficient time to get the message across as to what she stood for. Just a big mess all round really.

American voters are not stupid, they saw right through Harris’s facade. She was always grossly incompetent and would have been a dangerous POTUS.

I think personally this is a sign of how desperate people are. It’ll happen here too I assume
People in the USA have seen billions going to Ukraine whilst their standard of living gets more and more dire. Then a man comes in promising to stop it all and make their lives better, of course they’ll vote for him.

I wouldn’t be suprised if Farage does end up as PM. People don’t want £3bn for Ukraine and only £230m for homelessness.

It wasn't the Dems who called him facist though. It was military leaders who had previously worked with him.

And people still went 'yay, that's me decided, off to the ballot box I go'.

Fucking insanity.

It astonishes me that anyone thinks there will be any significant difference

I recommend people listen to the latest TRIP Leading podcast, an interview with writer Michael Lewis (Moneyball, The Big Short, The Fifth Risk). He had an interesting take on why people support Trump.

This is an excerpt from the transcript:

ML “My take is that they don't actually think that he's going to solve their problems.

They've given up on their problems being solved, and what they want is their anger to be stoked. They want to feel that someone feels something like they feel. Very oddly, and this is why I think Trump is just like personally critical to this movement.

If that bullet had taken out Trump, I think they would not be someone who stepped in and replaced him and the movement would move on just the way it is.

AC: What has he got that nobody else has got?

A genuine anger, a genuine kind of psychopathic anger at the world that comes from a chip on his shoulder from the way he was raised by his dad, from being a second or third tier New York real estate guy who was looked down upon by the first tier ones, by the culture of New York in which he was raised, which sort of rewarded this sort of this.

AC: But you've also got to have talent. Surely, you've got to have talent to be able to weaponize that, mobilize that.

ML: The fact that he doesn't have talent sort of makes it easier for people to relate to him, I think. What you see as deficiencies, I think probably are great strengths with his audience. So he's sincere in some way.

Even when he's faking it, he's sincere. At some deep level, he feels all that awfulness and they like it. I think that they like that.”

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/leading/id1665265193?i=1000675378702