Another fatal dog attack

[upat4am]

So saddened by the news a 10 year old girl has been killed by what sounds to be an XL Bully.

I'm shocked that any family would keep one after so many attacks. There are worse things than kindly being PTS.

It seems like the same line every time "loving family dog, never done anything like this".

How many do there have to be before people realise any XL Bully has it in them. It's not their fault, they're not bad dogs, it's just genetic the same way a dachshund barks or a spaniel's tail wags the dog.

I presume the owners are her parents?

I think they've already started serving their sentence? What do you think could be worse than their child dying?

Would you say that to parents who, as an example, drove drunk with their child in the car and ended up in a crash that killed the child?

Their relationship to the child should be irrelevant to any criminal charges.

My friend's dog bit an idiot who had repeatedly bothered the dog despite being told to leave her alone because she would bite him - this was at the vets, so already a stressful situation for the dog. And he was warned more than once to back off and leave her alone because she was stressed. The dog bit him on the hand.

I don't see why a dog should die because a random idiot decides he knows the dog better than her owner, and ignores the warnings.

Report them to SS, no kids should be around these dogs

They probably don’t read the news or they believe it’s a conspiracy

Many people are not listening to the ban of this breed and common sense needs to prevail to prevent further deaths.

Would you feel the same way if your 10 year old child was just mauled to death ?

Report it!

You are correct that if the dogs owners are the parents there can be no greater consequence than the tragic loss of their child, yet surely they and others would agree on culling to protect others from such horrible and unnecessary deaths

You re right, i mis read the article, its 16 in England/Wales NOT 38.

Nothing about Scotland, where have been some deaths as well.

The 38 was number of Police forces that responded to a FOI request, sorry for my mistake.

I don't think we have a government that will take action. If you look at the latest budget, social problems such as gambling and drinking are not tackled at all. It doesn't seem to be that kind of government, so far at least.

The law needs changing.

If your dog kills someone, then you should be charged with murder / manslaughter.

If your dog hurts someone, then you should be charged with assault / GBH / assault with a weapon.

People need to be held accountable for their actions.

Yes, but that doesn't mean there shouldn't be a prosecution too. The message needs to be clear to everyone who choose to own one of these things. If it hurts someone then it is your fault and you should he treated the same as anyone else who causes death or injury through their actions.

Is there anything you can legally carry to try to stop a dog attack?

That's awful!

We don’t know that the parents love or give a shit about their child though do we. Parents can abuse, neglect and kill their children.

That's not an unpopular opinion

I don't think the optics of a country-wide cull are either achievable or palatable (although, as a dog lover who would not want to meet any of them when out with my dogs, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it).

I do think that any transgression against the laws in place should result in seizing and destruction though, including:

• Illegal change of ownership
• Failure to muzzle/keep on lead when out walking
• Escaping in to the community
• ANY biting incident, whether people or dogs.

I think these dogs in houses with children should also result in attention, but it's not just the children in these houses - it's grown adults in the house (not all of whom will have made an active choice to own the dogs), and anyone in public if the dog is not properly contained.

The current law in this country does not put any focus on dog on dog attacks, but these things are killing dogs all over the country, and when a dog is ripping your dog apart this is going to result in owners getting hurt too.

The things is though that people can survive a Jack Russell bite or even a Labrador or German Shepherd and its also possible to intervene and pull any other breed off the victim but with these huge and frenzied dogs, survival is far less likely and would you step in and try and stop an attack from a dog that may weigh over half what you do?

My DH is a six footer and (in the course of his job) had to ram the full length of a biro into the eye of a GSD that had a child in it's grip and was going blue. He said anything bigger than that dog and he would likely not have been successful. Even as it was dying it wasn't letting go and he was astonished to hear the kiddie survived. She had many surgeries and skin grafts and thanked him some years later.

It's all very well owning these things in the USA. There are guns to finish them freely available. Over here, people are forced to stand and watch as people die in utter terror.

This country is as weak at dealing with this as it is with everything else. It's bloody pathetic.

If you would like to go back and read my comment again, perhaps taking in the second sentence?

I did not say people should not be punished.

I can’t believe the amount of people who know of an XL bully local to them who appears aggressive, not properly muzzled etc and haven’t thought to report it. People are so worried about saying anything these days - if it saves a life isn’t it worth it?

Is it 101?

I think people think there's no point. Especially if they don't actually know the person, so can only give a description. The police aren't going to spend time trying to track them down.

There was someone on one of these threads who said they saw an unmuzzled one, and there were police nearby. They told the police, who wandered over, told the owner to put a muzzle on, and walked off. I think dogs should be removed for any breach of the rules but it won't happen.

It's also false. Most true xl bullies in the UK often come from imported bloodlines.

In most senses there is no real breed of an xl bully. All the things posted about blood tests are false. The current xl description is based on physical attributes only nothing to do with actual genetics.

Most xl bullies don't come from far back xl bully blood lines, but are often mixes of big breeds such as canecorsos, mastiffs with smaller bull breeds

Hence the fact that quite quickly people were producing micro bullies, exotic bullies or whatever they want to call them because they just changed the mix

It's why the ban on breeding is difficult. There is a ban on xl bully breeding (they have to be neutered) but....

You could breed 2 perfectly legal parents and create a xl (by the legal definition), eg by mixing American bull dogs, corso mixes, staffs with mastiffs, rotties etc

You'll find that some of the dogs that clearly look like xls are maybe 2 cm short of the legal definition so fall outside of the definition. A neighbour close to me had her clearly xl bully seized but then returned as it didnt meet the definition. Someone could legally breed two of those and produce a dog that's easily in the criteria.

The legislation mostly relies on owners following a law. For example all the people that registered there's got slightly hasseled to make sure they were neutered and got checked up on, but all the people who ignored the law in the first place are out there breeding

The problem with anything like having to have registered breeders of all dogs, dog licencing etc is that mostly it's the decent owners who do it, and the dodgy ones continue on doing what they are doing

It's the same with all current dog laws eg not being able to sell pups without seeing their mum, not being able to sell xls, microchipping pups, ear cropping being banned. All 100% the right laws but never followed. The sensible people were doing it anyway, and the people it was aimed at are the People who still ignore it because they aren't bothered about the law. A quick search on pets4homes and you can find hundreds of illegal things happening in plain sight because until there's proper enforcement people aren't bothered.

How often have you reported her? If not you're responsible for anything that happens too.

I'm not sure what happens elsewhere, but I'm in NI and I mentioned upthread that a woman on our Facebook community group complained because she had had a visit from the dog warden about the lack of a muzzle on her XL bully puppy. Fat lot of use it did as she continued to walk the dog with no muzzle. She said very authoritatively that a muzzle wasn't yet required for such a young dog. A quick google tells me that all XL bullies should be muzzled, regardless of age. But this woman was extremely aggressive to anyone who challenged her knowledge.