To hope that Donald Trump doesn’t win the election

[RosaMoline]

….it’s getting closer.
I was hoping that Kamala would be a shoo-in for the presidency, but looking at the betting odds, I’m feeling quite pessimistic.
It’s incomprehensible to me that a convicted felon, racist, rapist, liar and misogynist who spurred on an insurrection - after everything that’s happened - is running for office again and may very well win.
It’s comforting to read though that fellow Brits DON’T support him.
Apart from Reform. Obviously.
yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/50752-who-did-britons-want-to-win-the-2024-us-presidential-election

Has it fuck gone to ruin under the current administration. Where they have got things wrong, e.g. the Israel/Gaza conflict, Trump would be even worse. Harris would cut taxes for the low paid, Trump would carry on with his former policy of cutting taxes for billionaires.

As for Labour under Keir Starmer, Labour has been in power for nearly 4 months. Some of the unpopular stuff they have done, e.g. releasing prisoners early, was also done under the previous Conservative government and was due to their failure to provide more prison places during their 14 years in power, while jailing more people for offences where a non-custodial sentence would have been more appropriate.

I would imagine that the things you hate about this Labour government e.g. VAT on private school fees, possibility that some taxes, e.g. inheritance tax, CGT will go up in the budget, more rights for workers and tenants, punishing racist thugs for trying to burn down hotels containing asylum seekers, are things that Labour voters will like.

I don't like Keir Starmer's authoritarian instincts but, in my opinion, the worst Labour government is always better than the best Conservative government.

What's ironic is that the things this government has done that right wingers would like, they're unlikely to make much of because of the effect on their own vote. And the billionaires' scandal sheets that we used to call newspapers in this country aren't going to publicise them. Like the fact that Yvette Cooper's Home Office has deported far more people in 4 months than Braverman's useless regime managed.

"Trump is actually pro choice and has said he has no interest and will not sign any legislation banning abortion at at a federal level. He made no effort to to do anything with Roe V. Wade in his first term."

Trump is 'pro' or anti whatever he needs to be to get himself elected. He harnessed the support of the Heritage Foundation and the evangelicals by promising to reduce women's access to abortion via the overturning Roe Vs Wade. He's said he thinks women who have abortions should be punished under the law.

Yes he's said he wouldn't sign a 'federal abortion ban' but he'll know that a federal ban will not be necessary to severely restrict abortion access in blue states - they can use the Comstock Act to stop hospitals and clinics across the US accessing abortion medication and Plan B. He's only signified that he doesn't support a federal ban because he knows it's a massive vote loser.

"Abortions are still legal in the majority of states although there are restrictions in some https://www.guttmacher.org/state-policy/explore/state-policies-abortion-bans"

Abortions have become significantly more difficult to access for women in red states - particularly for very poor women or those who have difficult personal circumstances that make it hard for them to travel. To suggest that this isn't impacting negatively on women's health is very dishonest.

Are you joking? It's become an absolute laughing stock.

I do thanks.

Hope that helps.

Biden accomplishments? That's hilarious. The guy can barely say his own name!

14 years!? A tad ambitious, don't you think? I'm not convinced he'll last 14 months!

I mean, Trump is a laughing stock, yes.

So, since you claim to understand the role of the vice president, I assume you also understand presidential powers. Exactly what do you think Harris could have done to change the administration's policies and action?

It's hard to reconcile the polls showing a close race with the footage of campaign appearances isn't it?

You've got 30k people raising the roof at Kamala Harris' events. Whereas at Donald Trump speeches there seem to be empty seats and people streaming out midway. Or before it starts because he is late again.

Of course it could be his organisation is poor or he won't spend the money - but will still do well on the day. Just looks like a shambles.

It is quite obvious I am talking about Labour in power for 14 years, not Keir Starmer... yet you are rubbishing what they have done in 14 weeks!

14 years in case you don't know, refers to the Tories in power and running the country into the ground.

Hahaha on Biden not saying his name. Have you ever seen Trump talk? He muddles up countries names and misprononounces them, he can't say the simplest words, he calls the POTUS Obama, and not Biden, he calls Hungary's PM Orban the leader of Turkey, he mixes up dates, countries, words continually

Never mind.... person, woman, man, camera, TV 🤣

A key part of that role is to be an adviser to the president. So, that being the case, what you're basically saying is that she remained part of an administration who's policies she didn't believe in?

Or are you saying she did believe in it/them, in which case she's partly responsible for its many failings?

Which one is it? Because it will be one of those things.

Biden is a laughing stock with whom? Trump supporters in the US and UK obviously, but who else?

He is definitely too old to run again for President, and was persuaded to step down by the Democratic Party. There were certainly questions about his cognitive abilities.

However, anybody with working eyes and ears who isn't totally delusional can see that by any metric Trump is worse. He is old, he is demented, he is unhealthy, his already feeble cognitive powers are waning. His only super powers are spite and a complete lack of self awareness. His motivations for running for President are to stay out of jail, punish his enemies/settle a load of scores, personally enrich himself and his family and remove the checks and balances that currently prevent fascism and dictatorships being
implemented in the USA. He will enable the worst people in the world if they flatter him. He is a security risk as his previous conduct will leave him open to blackmail.

He is a laughing stock, but it's hollow laughter as he is so dangerous.

Apologies @Wallaw , my reply was intended for @Jumpingthruhoops

Rude.
My main point is, that people in the 1930s were comparing the new wave of demagogues to people that were historically familiar to them like Napoleon, Caesar, Phillip II of Macedon. While in hindsight what happened in Germany, Italy, Spain seems almost obvious/inevitable people had difficulty conceiving what it would look like at the time and looked back for historic examples. This was a mistake and, if anything, increased the aura of mystique around admittedly dangerous figureheads. Or made critics look unhinged. People like Hitler were also able to play on people's natural yearning for simpler/better times by evoking figures/glories from the past themselves, even if those past figures were dodgy to say the least. Hitler frequently compared himself to Caesar. He wasn't anything like Caesar, but the fact he choose to evoke someone who challenged the existing political order and helped bring about the downfall of the Roman Republic tells you a lot about him just like Trump talking about Hitler tells you something about him. Just not that he is like Hitler.
The word "fascism" brings up a sort of man in the high castle image of America. Which is obviously not good, but not as off putting as you would think if you feel completely overwhelmed by the quite chaotic world we are in now and want more order/hierarchy. Its a trap.

You have summed it up so well.

I just do not understand how someone who flagrantly took classified documents to his home, showing them there to anyone and everyone, and refusing to return them... can run for President.
the FBI recovered over 13,000 government documents, over 300 of which were classified, with some relating to national defense secrets covered under the Espionage Act
Oh, and ditto the 34 felonies.
It's beyond me. How does this happen?
I thought the US was all about checks and balances, yet someone who deliberately took classified docs and refused to return them, can run for high office.

Horrifying to think that Trump is the acceptable public face of his backers. He is what they'll happily admit to so they don't have to show themselves. God help USA if they're collectively stupid enough to vote him in. And God help them if they don't. Nothing good can come of this.

"Are you joking? It's become an absolute laughing stock.
I do thanks.
Hope that helps."

How?

Violent crime is lower now than it was in 2018 after two years of a Trump presidency.

GDP per capita is significantly higher than in 2018

Inflation has fallen faster and further than most of the G7 countries since the big upsurge in inflation during and after the pandemic.

So what's your metric?

You say the US is a 'laughing stock'. I'm assuming you spend your life of MAGA social media and watching Fox and OAN. But then you don't offer any evidence to back up your view that the US is in a terrible state.

So what's your metric?

Trump - privately - said that Hitler 'did some good things'. He praised him in full knowledge that he engineered the largest genocide in human history. In living memory. The only thing this tells me about Trump is something I and most people with their heads screwed on the right way already know: that the man is completely amoral.

My family member wants him to win and she is an immigrant in the usa waiting on her spouse visa (she overstayed her esta, but is married to an American so it is a route though one with long waiting times and theoretically anything can happen).

She really likes vance and thinks kamala is a disaster. Her dh earns barely anything as a realtor and they have a young child (so need to pay nursery fees). She works remotely but can't drive or find a us job because of the visa situation.

If she and her family can support trump (she can't vote but her dh can and the whole family is voting trump despite presumably wanting her to stay in the usa), I don't see why anyone else wouldn't vote trump if they got it in their heads.

I think trump will win. It's not about facts anymore, ifs about the vibes

I completely agree! I was not defending Trump - as I said, comparing yourself to Hitler is not a good thing (unless its to say "I am nothing like Hitler") I just think that people using what he said to argue he is therefore Hitler/or like Hitler, are falling into a sort of trap.

Then you very much assume wrong. I literally said in my first post that a Trump admin would be awful both domestically and globally.

My 'metric' is based on what I've seen with my own two eyes and from what UK friends, who had made the US their home, have told me about why they so desperately want to leave. Or indeed have left already.

See, I'm not sure he will. For the simple fact that there are so many people in very high places who will make damn sure it doesn't happen.

Someone posted on Twitter that Trump has the character flaws of all the children who were ejected from the ride and punished in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory.

How would people 'in very high places' 'make damn sure it doesn't happen'?

Hmm?

Who are these people?

Don't just hint at a conspiracy.

The issue being stoked about abortion in the States right now is about the election. It's not about abortion, womens' rights, or babies' rights. It's about power.

Overturning Roe v Wade was about state sovereignty versus overreach by the Federal courts, and in particular, overreach by the US Supreme Court.

Overturning Roe returned the right to make decisions on the abortion issue to individual states. In other words, through a democratic process, individual states are now able to vote on what their position on abortion is. It was not about outlawing abortion. It's aligned with the US constitution as it was written, not as it was interpreted in the 1970's.

Potentially, overturning Roe could expand abortion rights, if that's what people want.

Roe set a baseline for abortion services and their availability across the US. Striking it down has created many areas where abortion is not available at all - and women have died because of it. You can whinge about federal overreach all you like - women are dead because Trump stacked the Supreme Court with judges who would strike down Roe and the blood of those dead women is on his hands.

There are no standards because his base is made up of fundamentally amoral people. As long as they feel he speaks for them, he can do anything. He was right when he said he could literally kill somebody in full public view and his cult of morons would still support him. I believe they would worship him even more rabidly, as long as he killed a visible minority, a Democrat, or a woman.
If he killed a straight white male they would give lip service to it being wrong, but would claim the guy must have done something to deserve it.
Those are the kind of people who make up his fanatical base.