DC and their GF, alarm bells, how much to intervene.

[sauvignongone]

DC has a GF who they have been in a relationship with for the last few years.

It’s not a relationship we have encouraged for various reasons but have kept things amicable and polite as aware DC is almost 18 and there is very little we can do in terms of it fizzling out and mostly I really don’t want to alienate them.

I won’t go into the in’s and out’s as we would be here all day but as far as we (and everybody else who has met her) are concerned there are a lot of red flags, control, putting DC down in front of people, attention seeking behaviour, love bombing, booking things in which are months/years ahead, mild stalking worries, negative reactions of DC spending time with siblings friends etc, as far as I’m concerned it couldn’t really get any worse.

Both GF and DC are sitting A levels this year and considering universities. Different fields but I know GF is considering her options to be closer to DC which is huge worry for us as really hopeful it might have been the break DC needed to have a bit of clarity.

GF sent me message last week it went something like this..

Dear Sauv.

I have booked something really expensive and amazing for us both next year (for context marginally ahead of A levels)

We will be leaving on this date and returning on this date

I’m just letting you know so you don’t book/organise anything within this time.

dick GF

Its really got my back up and I’m trying to work out if that’s quite unreasonable behaviour for a 17 year old or if I’m just triggered by the fact that I don’t like her and that a teenage girl is telling me what will be happening within my family.

I haven’t replied yet as wanted to be measured but even a week later still feel quite pissed off about it.

As it is we are away as a family for a few night the week after which I really considered not booking due to A Levels but as it was for a family members big birthday decided to go ahead, so she is lucky as it definitely would have been a no regardless of it already been booked and paid for!

I guess how do I get a handle on this? Has anyone been in a similar situation with their own child?

DC, myself and DH are all very close and talk a lot but DC is quite defensive by nature and so I’m really not sure the best way to proceed without causing conflict and pushing them further together.

I can see how this GF is controlling her relationship with OP's son or daughter (sorry OP didn't clarify what gender her child is) but not how she is controlling the relationship with OP's child? She planned a surprise get away with her BF or GF to surprise them and reached out to OP to let her know out of a courtesy so nothing was planned. People like to surprise their partner that's perfectly normal. When I was 24 and my BF and I have been living together for 2 years I planned a surprise vacation to a spot I knew my BF would love and sent a group chat to his family to let them know. Given our ages I would think it would be crazy for his mom to still be arranging his social calendar or to check with her about planning surprise for my own BF. Then again to be fair my BF (now husband) and I already had the marriage discussion and I knew a proposal was soon coming which it did a little less than a year later.

Also the posts reads that she is love bombing him because she treats him to dinner and buys him gifts? If I am reading the OP correctly it reads they been together a few years not a few weeks and the OP's child is almost an adult so I think it is perfectly normal to treat your SO to dinner and gifts especially after being together a few years it sounds like it's a serious relationship. I definitely would not have liked my MIL interfering in my relationship with my serious bf now husband.

You have forgotten to mention the bizarre and repeated stalking of the DC, the belittling, humiliation/putting of DC down in front of people, isolation from friends and siblings that the OP outlined in her first post - why?

The above clearly indicates a toxic relationship which throws a totally different light on the 'surprise' holiday and the gifts after rows with criptic messages (ie sabotage and love bombing).

You're mixing several things up here.
She's putting him down in front of you? Not Ok.
negatively reacting to him spending time with friends/family - not OK either.
What's wrong with her letting you know that she's booking something in advance for him?
I'd rather know so I didn't double book if it was mine.
Don't be "that" MIL.

My friends and I have been speaking about this recently.
Mobile phones weren't thing back when we were teenagers but we wouldn't have dreamed of speaking to our BF's parents like this is at all! Or organising things for them or thinking we would necessarily take priority over family, as teenagers.

Maybe because the GF knows that the son forgets or won't mention it to his mother? I know plenty of men like that they forget to mention important things to their family so the GF/fiances/wives have to step in and do it. It shouldn't fall on the woman in the relationship but sadly oftentimes they bare the burden of it. I a lot of times have to relay messages to my MIL like not to plan certain things on certain times or whatnot bc hubby and I will be away. I had to do this since hubby and I moved in together bc he would often forget to mention it. Besides I'm not sure why it matters who it came from. I read it more like the GF was being considerate by letting them know ahead of time. They are adults yes young adults but still adults none the less and in the OP she states they been together a few years so clearly serious. She has a right to plan a surprise trip with her own BF. When I texted my MIL about family happenings it never one occurred to me that she would be mad it came from her DIL and not her son I just figured as long as she was kept in the loop and given enough advance notice why would she care who it came from? To me there are things that the OP states that are much more concerning about a thoughtful heads up. Also wasn't aware it was an issue to plan a surprise for your own partner??

Maybe the two PP should read the thread properly, you're referring to a boy but the OP's child is a girl.

The Ops daughter doesn't know about the trip, it's something the girlfriend has planned and booked for just before her Alevel exams. It's a strange thing to do given the timing imo

No nothing is being mixed up here.

You have identified the obvious abusive, controlling, coercive behaviours on face value which therefore categorise this as a toxic relationship - these intentions/traits run through the core of the relationship and these other actions (gifts/holiday) need to be seen through that motivation. Its part of the well documented 'nasty/nice' cycle highlighted by the experts of domestic abuse.

The GF also likely has an undiagnosed PD/MH issue that is not being supported given the behaviours outlined but is actually being enabled by her own parents who are likely scared of her and attempting to palm her off on to the OPs DC.

I think focus on this. She was courteous to let you know that she'd booked something but I'd simply write back and say that is not good timing given exams so prob best she finds another suitable date for their trip

Its an attempt to sabotage the OPs DCs exams at a vulnerable time dressed up as a 'gift'.

Even if they dont go expect the GF to have a crisis/break up with OPs DC during revision/exams time as the attention wont be on her 24/7 and she wants to cause mayhem, get the spotlight and attntion back on her and derail the OPs DC from what she could achieve.

This character is needy and toxic and nothing will satisfy her control needs - as with any abusive relationship it will progressively get worse.

there are a lot of red flags, control, putting DC down in front of people, attention seeking behaviour, love bombing, booking things in which are months/years ahead, mild stalking worries, negative reactions of DC spending time with siblings friends etc

Hmm. On one hand, everyone knows how intense teenage relationships can be, and how they soon fizzle out.

However, whether or not this GF is ND or not (although this might be the case) the behaviour is simply not acceptable.

So, whilst wanting to support your child's independence, I think you need to intervene as sensitively but as effectively as possible.

@ElatedPlumBeaker it sounds like we're in agreement then as I stated I thought the girlfriend had done nothing wrong and it was polite to let her know.

Hmm. On one hand, everyone knows how intense teenage relationships can be, and how they soon fizzle out.

IME its these type of obsessive and controlling relationships that do not fizzle out.

It seems like there are two distinct groups of people on this forum. The first group is fortunate enough to have never encountered the truly toxic kind of person—those who can bring long-lasting, life-altering consequences. And they don’t see what the fuss is all about. The second group, however, has had the misfortune of dealing with these types of individuals and fully understands why the mum in this situation is worried. The abuse is so insidious that it’s extremely difficult to spot, even for the victim.

Regarding the text message from the GF about the surprise getaway, I’d suggest approaching your DC directly. You could tell her that you received a message about the surprise getaway and are concerned, especially considering the timing. With A-level exams coming up and the added family birthday, will it be overwhelming for her?

Ask her how she wants you to respond. If she still wants to go, at least she can plan her revision around. This way, she won’t be caught off guard last minute. If she chooses to go, she can still act surprised but at least her exams are not jeopardised. It’s also important that she’s aware of the situation, as it feels like she’s been left out of the decision-making process and A levels are so important. Your loyalty is to her, and her well-being should come first.

If needed, you could reach out to the GF again and say something like: “Sorry, I’ve changed my mind. I initially said it was fine, but after thinking about it, there’s just too much going on before the exams. What you’re planning is really lovely, but would it be possible to plan this trip after the exams instead?”

Finally, to those who say “just put your foot down and say “you’re not allowed to go”. That’s exactly what the GF wants - to cause a massive rift between the mum and the daughter just before the latter goes off to university, with the distance between them it will be much harder to repair the relationship.

No idea and no experience as parent, but have been in a toxic relationship and reacted with full anger and defensiveness when my best friend would point out the obvious. So from that perspective I would have had a chance of getting it sooner if she didn't start out judgemental, but ask neutral questions that would slowly show me where this is going. Like "what do you think of this behavior of his" or "interesting, do you know any other couple where this would be going on, maybe you can ask them for advice?", "I see he made plans with you, I hope this time he doesn't cancel last minute, I personally would hate it", "why do you think was he yelling at you in such a way?", "what do you think, why he doesn't have friends?" ... Just ideas.. can't think of meet questionst.. he defense mechanisms were huge, I would find excuses for his behavior in my head, but I think having to say them out loud could make me realize.. but again, I was an adult..

Sorry for the late reply it’s been a busy weekend for us.

To confirm a few things DC is actually a DD, it is a same sex relationship, to add we have absolutely no problem with her being gay, she was very open with us from a very early age and this is 2nd girl friend.

The trip that GF booked isn’t a holiday, it’s two nights in February, so not exactly in the midst of exams but definitely in the realms of study timetables and knuckling down.

I have messaged GF and said that it’s fine, luckily it doesn’t fall with in another special date but in future can she let me or DD know before booking anything else, especially with A Levels looming. TBF I do think DD will love what GF had planned, but she does love most things she organises as they are always quite big and expensive gestures.

I am though honestly quite surprised how many posters would be happy with a 17 year old child, (and they are still children as far as I’m concerned) messaging an adult and basically saying, I have already booked this trip for your daughter, I expect you adhere to theses dates, keep it a secret and make sure you, or anyone else doesn’t book at the same time as opposed to I’m thinking of booking this trip, I think she will like would that be ok…

especially with it being in a college holiday period and ahead of A levels.

We have actually had a chat with DD this weekend, off the back of comments GF has made on her social media posts. I tried to stay on topic and not go too deep with our thoughts but my normally very passive husband did say we and people around her were concerned and noted a few of the behaviours that were ringing alarm bells for us. It wasn’t the worst chat, no storming off and slamming doors and ended in a hug.
DD was defensive, she disagreed with most of what we were saying however the said comments did disappear from her page so maybe she is listening.

DH did say to DD that one of behaviours he was concerned about was GF always having that next big thing booked in 6 months down the line, making sure there is no chance of an out for her if she did ever want to take it.

He didn’t tell DD what GF had organised but did say there was something which was totally off script to what we had discussed prior to having a chat with her!

As I said in a previous post DH is the most gentlest, and most laid back person unless he feels concern for myself and DC so for him to be worried and feeling like we need to intervene is telling.

That’s good communication open with her. You don’t know what sinks in.
February yr 13 I’d be ok with and a good opportunity to look reasonable but set line that that’s it. Just be aware offer days are often Match then revision so I wouldn’t ok any other trips.

You've done a great job with that conversation.

I would give her lots of space now for that to settle and things to play out.

But keep note of DD mood and any GF stuff.

This a really hard, slow and painful thing to navigate.

Concentrate on building/preserving your one to one relationship with your DD - it doesnt have to be big gestures / days out etc ... its the little day to day moments that matter and accumulate.

That's good to hear OP, the main thing is to focus on keeping your relationship with DD at a good level.
I know it must be very hard, but criticism of their relationship or the GF will definitely go the wrong way.
I think PPs idea of forming remarks as questions is a very good idea, hopefully putting ideas in her head to mull over rather than an immediate rebuttal of your views.

One thing I would say is to try and get her to Uni whatever Gf springs in the meantime.
For context I got into an unhealthy, intense relationship with bf at 16/17. Both sets of parents tried to push us apart, which just made us push harder the other way of course! He failed his A levels because of spending all his time with me, I got decent results but decided not to go to Uni because I'd rather be with him.
Spent 30 years together before I managed to get out. Often look back and wish I had been pushed to go to uni and that would have broken the spell. Having spent mmost of that time estranged at some level from family it has been very hard to build normal relations back up.

Sounds as if you are more able to talk as a family than we were, so fingers crossed she will come out of this with a stronger relationship with you all.

How are things a year on @sauvignongone ? X