issues with lodger

[lodger]

Hi

Hoping for a bit of clarity and in need of a chat about my lodger. He's only been
here for a few weeks but ive found it challenging having someone in my home space. Tonight he bought back a friend with no prior warning and occupied the kitchen space and cooked for friend and they both ate at the table, chatting away. I found it quite rude to not give me the heads up that he was bringing a guest back and cooking dinner. I had to make my dinner then leave the kitchen as they were clearly chatting and eating and I felt like a third wheel. He is my lodger and I find this quite rude. Am I being unreasonable in expecting him to tell me that he's bringing a friend home? He also makes very loud phone calls alot of the time and hooks his calls up to an external speaker so that I can hear his conversations very clearly. his room is above mine. Again I find this quite disrespectful. Some viewpoints would be handy. Im not used to having people in my home and I lost my husband last year to cancer so its a big deal to have someone living in my space. Its an adjustment

But the OP didn't discuss any of this with him in advance.

Ronomemo. No need to get personal. I came on here for advice not to be told I can't cope having a lodger. That's not very constructive

"there isn't a contract to be honest. I set a few ground rules before he moved in and just told him I don't want loads of people coming over all the time or staying over etc but ok if its now and again"

From this chat it sounds like what he did by having one friend over was within the bounds of what had been discussed. I think communication is key. You need to be very clear about what he can and can't do.

As you only lost your husband in April I think it is very soon to have a stranger in your space. You must still be grieving deeply.

I think people are naive banging on about contracts. Expectations like this aren’t generally those stipulated by contracts but by convention. These sorts of things are dealt with on a case by case basis. OP will know for next time for “house rules” but a contract cannot possibly account for every possible scenario OP might encounter.

But you don’t seem to be able to cope with having a lodger. You told him not to have loads of people round. Fair enough. You can’t cope with him having one friend round. You can’t cope with them ‘chatting’ at the kitchen table. You can’t cope with people describing your house as his ‘home’. Even though it is.

It is a fair assumption that you can’t cope with having a lodger, and the advice the pp gave is perfectly fine.

I would tell him to turn the phone calls down, though but I think you’re a bit beyond that. Just give him notice and come up with another way to get more income if you are as wholly unsuited to sharing your home as you seem to be. That’s understandable - I wouldn’t want to do it either! - but the difference there is that I don’t do it. It is really very simple.

@lodger

more than one person has asked - does he have a table and chairs in his living room so he ( & friend/s ) can eat at the table ?

and have you accepted yet that it is his home too ? it may well be your property however it is his home.

from your replies I don't think you thought having a lodger through properly, however you now have lots of advice.

what is the notice period on each side ?

It's not a flat share he doesn't get the same rights.
He's a lodger,the rent he pays reflects that.
He's basically renting a room with the use of a kitchen.

Maybe it’s a case of OP adjusting her expectations and some compromise from both parties rather than condemning her to failure at the first hurdle?

As an experienced lodger-haver I agree with this. The vast majority of our lodgers were naturally more considerate than this without me having to impose rules. They have all been women though. Get a woman next time.

If it's where he lives, it's his home. It isn't any less his home because he pays less than you do. It's a natural part of being at home that you expect to be able to invite friends round. Yes, if you share it as a lodger you must be considerate, but chatting to one friend in the kitchen is hardly inconsiderate.

I echo everyone else in saying you need to discuss some ground rules which include recognising that his payment includes a payment for reasonable use of the kitchen and you need to be prepared to share it.

You posted on the internet asking for advice. Not all the advice you will receive will be what you want to hear. That's the nature of forums.

You don't sound like you can cope with a lodger, to be honest. And for really understandable reasons - you're still grieving and struggling to share your space - that can become more difficult as we get older. You haven't thought it through or set proper expectations or terms, and you are not willing for a lodger to consider your house their home. That tells me that emotionally this isn't really something you want, you need the money (understand that) but really don't want to share your space (also understand that - I also wouldn't want to share my space with a stranger or occasionally their friends).

I don't want to be unkind - I just don't think you're being honest with yourself, or your lodger, and I think this will cause you more anxiety and stress, which it sounds like you don't need or want. There are other options financially if this doesn't work for you.

You are in a difficult time OP. After I lost my husband I had a longish time when it was difficult to see anybody let alone a stranger and my rage at everything knew no bounds. If you don't absolutely need to take in a lodger then can I suggest that you give yourself a break from peopleing for a while?

I think you need to think about your attitude. It IS his home - or if not then where is his home? He’s not homelessness . the fact you own it and it’s your home doesn’t make it not his home. You seem to think you’re better than him and I think adapting that whole attitude is very…counterproductive when you want respect, which should be mutual.
I think it’s perfectly reasonable to have rules . Given your setup why don’t you stay to keep guests to his own area. I lodged several times and I never brought guests around. Once it was in contract, other times to me it would have just felt uncomfortable. Re the speakerphone I’d just ask him about that and discuss noise generally. I think you should get a contract and formalise things asap.

She won’t even accept that it’s his (current) home.

Sorry that I’m not here to hand hold her through the concept that if you pay money to live somewhere it’s a home and that chatting to a friend at the kitchen table once when you’ve been told ‘don’t have lots of friends round’ is not that big a deal.

Sharing your home for money suits a very small number of people in my opinion. You have to be open to the concept that you’re sharing with a human with a rich inner life, not just an ATM. Like I said I would rather boil myself in oil. So I don’t do it. It is really very simple.

Asking him to turn the noise down/use headphones is not unreasonable at all. He might not even be aware that the noise is travelling.

Yes, if you share it as a lodger you must be considerate, but chatting to one friend in the kitchen is hardly inconsiderate

It can be or not be, depending on how you do it: are you stretching out, pushing chairs back so nobody can get past, leaving your stuff spread out so nobody else can use the space, talking loudly regardless of who else is there? Or are you occupying the space in a considerate way, making sure people can get past, being aware they might need to be there too?
I have always encouraged our lodgers to have friends round and eat in the kitchen but they have always been naturally considerate when it came to sharing space so it has never been difficult, but I can see how it might be.

I said YABU, as he's not doing anything unusual or anything you hadn't specifically told him not to before he moved in. It is his home/where he lives and, assuming he's an adult, probably isn't used to having to inform anyone or ask permission before seeing friends.

But...you're not unreasonable to not be enjoying it. And maybe he's not the right lodger for you. Not everyone will be the same (some might be worse!), but it's OK if you don't quite gel with this one. Give it a little while if you can, work out what you can and can't live with. You also shouldn't have to feel uncomfortable in your own home.

This can’t be serious. I genuinely can’t tell anymore if you’re being serious with your responses.

I agree with this

Sorry about your husband. I can understand this is all unsettling and you never asked for any of it.

However, Im glad you're reframing and reconsidering your stance as well as laying out some rules more clearly.

Have you considered Air BnB? Depends on area etc but this might be good money for shorter stays. So definitely not someone else's home. It is definitely your lodger's home if he's there full time. He isn't homeless, can have his post delivered there etc. Obv he doesn't have any claim on your house or anything but whilst he's paying to stay there on an ongoing basis, it is his home. It seems like semantics but I think accepting that point is quite key. If you really find that hard to swallow, maybe air BnB.

Let him know you can hear his conversations and ask him to use headphones or the handset. He probably didn't realise and will be glad to know. He doesn't know how sound travels in your house.

You said he could have occasional visitors. This is exactly what he has done. They weren't stopping you using the kitchen. If you want to limit the number, ensure prior agreement or for him to eat in his room when visitors do come, you need to tell him. Where we currently standing, he has followed rules. He isn't a mind reader.

To give the other side as the have been a few lodger stories, as a PP noted, people with lodgers often don't want lodgers, they want the money but not the person in their house. That isn't the lodger's fault. I lodged with a woman like that once. I wasn't perfect, I was very young ) generally respectful quiet and tidy) but christ, it was non stop and really quite depressing how much she scrutinised and complained and made up new rules. Random petty things like one day I couldn't keep my shampoo in the bathroom when I had been told that was fine, or I had to ring if I was going to be back after 10pm (I worked in a pub which she knew before accepting me). All the while, the stories I could tell about her. Christ.

First find some fair boundaries and express them. Then either accept you need to do this for financial reasons and try to feel more relaxed about having someone around (believe me, I know it isn't what you would have chosen) or find an alternative such as downsizing.

One way to cope with the situation might be to build some rapport/friendship with the lodger. If you establish a connection, the feeling of being invaded may not feel as overwhelming. I've had lodgers and some became great friends over the years.
Otherwise, it can feel quite unsettling having two strangers in your kitchen, chatting and drinking, which can really make it feel like an invasion of your space. If you don't like them as a person, or don't like their general vibe, than that's another matter.

Oh no! this reminded me of when my adult son came to stay over with GF - they were here for one night to go to a gig or something- they'd bought pizza which came in those massive boxes, which he rashly laid on his bed.

Whippet puppy about 10 weeks old was so delighted to see DS that she leapt on his bed and ran straight across the pizza surface together to him. 😂

Not funny at the time, but pure ''student'' vibe.

It's early days and it can't be easy to share a space that was once you and your DH's home. He should be able to have friends round but maybe no overnight guests and no dinner guests without some notice as it affects your access to kitchen/dining area. Maybe it was a spur of the moment thing but he could have been more sensitive about taking over that space. It sounds like he has somewhere to take guests anyway.

You need to think through all the rules and expectations you want to be in place, write them down in the form of a 'contract' then discuss with him. Some compromise may be required but he must understand if you can't agree then he'll have to find somewhere else to live. How old is he?

Unfortunately you have been naive and are now paying the price.

I think he isn't going to work out so give him notice.
He is not considerate.
He is a lodger, not a house share.
He doesn't get to bring people back to cook for.
He needs to house share if he wants that.
The loud calls are bloody rude.
Don't waste your time trying to fix him.
Give him notice.
Then, before you look for a new person, you make a list of rules that make it very clear what you expect.
Lodging is miles cheaper that sharing a house.
Your lodger needs to be very clear on your expectations.
Do not allow this to drag on.

That's adorable!! Love whippets!