To think it’s really hard to keep a child with a large appetite an appropriate weight

[Thedownstream]

I have 3 DCs. DC1 and DC2 have always had massive appetites, ate every single thing I put in front of them from the moment I weaned them, never refused anything at nursery, never lost their appetites even when sick. DC1 didn’t eat anything remotely unhealthy until she was three, but by that time was quite a chunk (99th centile BMI). DC2 we did baby led weaning with due to the health advice that babies will not overeat if they feed themselves (which we found not to be true in her case). Both DC1 and 2 started school overweight, but DC1 has turned out to have quite a talent for sport which she plays twice per day everyday and now aged 9 is a beanpole.

DC2 aged 5 however could not be more different, she’s naturally very inactive and struggles with sport (although reluctantly attends some sports clubs for exercise). She is always hungry and will eat until she is sick if allowed. She would easily eat a adult sized burger and chips at a restaurant if allowed. I think our diet is relatively healthy but she’s evidently eating too much either at home, school or both.

I think she would be fine weight wise however if there wasn’t so much crap food offered / available to her everywhere we go. I’ll give some examples:

• birthday parties - I’m the mum hovering over DC2 as the kind birthday mum and family try to encourage her to take 10 sandwiches, 5 slices of pizza, 50 chocolate fingers and 2 cupcakes at 3 in the afternoon, when half of the other kids are too busy playing to notice the food available.

• The kind parents on the sidelines at DC1’s sports sharing their kids’ sweets and biscuits with her.

• The mum who brings her child over for a play date and brings doughnuts for the kids.

• The portion size and options on kids menus at pubs which always come with an included dessert (we avoid going out for lunch as a result).

• The grandparents who do not listen when we say we’re trying to keep things healthy and please not to bake cakes for the kids.

• The stickers given out at school to children who finish their food. DC2 is a people pleaser who loves a sticker.

I don’t know how to navigate all this without other parents thinking I’m obsessive, or without giving DC2 food issues, but equally she can’t keep eating all this food offered to her.

In DC1’s school year so many of the children who had some puppy fat in reception are now obese (and many who were stick thin in reception are too). I don’t want that for DC2.

DC3 has a much less healthy diet than DC2 as unlike his sisters he is an incredibly fussy eater who lives off about 20 foods and usually refuses lunch entirely at nursery. He also seems to know when to stop eating even if it is a food he loves. He’s really slim (trousers always falling down) and will be one of those children who can eat all the doughnuts in the world and not put on weight (probably because he then won’t eat anything else for the rest of the day).

So AIBU to think DC2 is destined for a life of being overweight or with a complex about food given her appetite and all the unhealthy food thrown at her (by others) on a regular basis?

These threads always concern me a little, because this kind of forum is good for many things, but it isn't a appropriate place for someone to get specific medical advice about their specific child, especially around an issue as sensitive as food/eating/obesity.

Put kindly, we can't see your child. We have no idea whether there is a genuine issue with her weight, or whether (as is really really common in this kind of scenario) the issue lies in your own feelings about weight, which are having an impact on the way you view and raise her.

Either way, you need to make an appointment with an HCP, who can see what your daughter actually weighs, and, if there is indeed an issue, talk to you about actual sensible diet plans. If there is no issue with your daughter they can maybe look at getting you some support for your concerns.

It's dangerous for people on here to weigh in with an opinion when we have no idea about the actual situation.

You are worried OP, you need support. Please contact your GP as a first port of call and explain the situation. And please be open to what they tell you, even if it's difficult to hear. Good luck!

I do agree op that two children can be built quite differently and gain and store with different patterns. It’s a shame people don’t remember this when criticising adults.

That said, you have to work with the child you have and if she’s going to parties etc, that’s fewer treats at home. Can you also try filling her plate as you would then just taking back a forkful of each food type ( except perhaps green veg) before giving it to her until you find the balance? Things like potato mash etc can contribute if her portions are too large.

The other thing I would say is that I think as she slims down, third parties might stop pushing the food at parties or choosing donuts to bring when they visit etc. It’s gross stereotyping, but I do think people subconsciously assume a heavier child loves treats ( and presume they are allowed them) so when trying to thank them / host them/ make them happy, they will perhaps gravitate towards pushing less healthy choices ( or more food) her way than they might otherwise. Just have some rules around party food: maybe no more than four finger sandwiches or savouries and a choice of one type of cake or donut and two small biscuits ( or whatever would be an improvement but still let her join in). It doesn’t hurt for them to learn you can enjoy party food, but within limits. She can also then say “ no thank you, I’ve had my cake” which might get some of the pushy mums off her back.

I get you OP. I have 3 children with very different food attitudes, built quite differently.

One of them has the appetite of a horse, never full, does hours and hours of sport every week but still quite chubby.

Also with having 3 of them, it's not easy to feed them all. The younger two are unbelievably fussy and very much in the cereal/beige/pasta phase. I would end up (and I sometimes do) making multiple meals and multiple adjustments to meals for everyone. It's hard going.

Hi all, thank you to everyone for your comments I am taking them on board.

Drip feed coming now as the OP was already getting very long.

I was quite relaxed about DC2’s weight as DC1 had lost it all by about year 2 (I stressed a lot about DD1) but by age 4 it was clear DC2 was not going to be the active child DC1 is and we needed to think about it a bit more. She was in full time nursery so I asked them if they could just watch the snacks she was having (help yourself) and cut her portions for meals by about 10% (so she wouldn’t notice). They refused without the say so of a medical professional so I phone the HV who took her height and weight measurements over the phone and didn’t want to see her. Said as they were within 2 centiles (height was about 45th and weight 85th) she was ok. Now DD has a slight frame like me so if they’d seen her they’d have seen that was too much for her but they didn’t want to and nothing changed.

She put on quite a bit more weight after starting school (nursery food definitely more nutritious and smaller portions than school and afterschool care) and in the reception weigh in her BMI was on the 96th centile.

We did well as a family in the 6 months since that weigh in, helped by the fact it was spring / summer so much more pleasant for getting out and about, and despite two holiday abroad and copious ice creams and meals out she maintained her weight and actually dropped into a healthy BMI (albeit in the mid 80s).

I’m just feeling a bit down as she’s put weight back on since going back to school and I feel it’s all going to go south again over the winter. Her attendance at the sports she does is hanging by a thread as the weather gets colder (hates going to one of them already) and our garden is already a swamp.

Honestly, if my kids were all like my DC3 I’d be commenting like some of you who think she must have a terrible diet and eat huge amounts as he, due to real food aversions, eats a limited range of things not all of which are healthy (hence the chicken satay as that is literally the only meat he will eat, and it has to be the same brand), and he eats a lot of the things he will eat and I can’t get trousers to fit him.

This all said I’m motivated to do better now. She doesn’t drink nearly enough water (she’s only allowed water, just doesn’t drink much of it) which can’t be helping, and we could definitely do better on the snacks. We could do better than a wrap for lunch too, but often there just isn’t time as weekends are a juggle of clubs.

She won’t eat eggs unfortunately otherwise yes something like scrambled eggs would be a good breakfast.

What is she eating for school dinners? I have yet to see any that are particularly healthy despite Jamie Oliver. It's usually cake or biscuit for pudding and very few 5 yo are going to choose an apple over that.
Most after school clubs only give something like toast and jam for tea too. That's not going to fill a growing child. Of course she's hungry when she gets in. Give her something healthy to eat rather than a snack.

Also, its no good berating OP for school dinners and telling her to go in and challenge them or check them or ask about them etc etc, school dinners are what they are, often beige crap, they wont change

I was like your greedy DD - I grew up in the 70s/80s, with 2 sisters, small age gaps, so similar ages. My Mum would give all 3 of us the same food, but I always felt hungry, whereas my sisters would be happy with what was put in front of them. I can remember crying because I was so desperate for more food, even though I'd eaten the same as my sisters, and then I'd eaten the one spare fish finger available, so I'd actually eaten more than them. (Fortunately?) my parents had no money, so there was literally no spare food in the house & my mother had to be strict with portion sizes. Even then though, I was always the slightly chubbier one of the 3 of us, both my sisters were skinny.

And now as an adult, I'm always hungry, and I always have a tendency to eat more than I should - I have managed to keep within a normal BMI but OMG the hunger.

I'm so relieved that my own 2 DC seem to be able to eat to satiation and then stop, so they just stay within a normal BMI without feeling hungry all the time

My DD is 5, eats like a horse but is a skinny bean (age 2-3 waist but age 5-6 height). She’s also naturally quite lazy.

We control portions of non healthy food and allow unlimited healthy foods. It’s not hard. DD fortunately loves salad veg, fruit, yoghurt so it’s not difficult.

We don’t say no to anything but she’s allowed one doughnut not 4.

Thank you. It is hard with three isn’t it! This doesn’t help the portion size issue either as DC1 needs to eat a lot more than her sister and if DC3 has refused his lunch he also needs more.

To give you an example. I made a chilli con carne (luckily in bulk as it took me hours with all the requirements). None of the DCs will eat an onion or a carrot, and DC2 will not eat a tomato unless it is puréed. I had to cook the onions and carrots separately and blend them, then blend the tomatoes (yes I know chilli doesn’t usually have carrots in but I was trying to pad out the sauce with veg). One of the few veg DC2 will eat is kidney beans, but DC1 won’t eat them, so I had to pick out all kidney beans from DC1’s plate before she would touch it.

DC3 wouldn’t eat it (I knew he wouldn’t but we try) so I put a small about on his plate with some rice (which he didn’t eat) a wrap and some cheese. The other DCs then wanted to put theirs into a wrap and make a burrito so ended up eating a larger portion then intended (yes I could have said no but I’m trying to get the balance with not giving anyone a complex about food).

That's interesting. My youngest is still at primary and only has a school dinner once a week when they do a roast, she doesn't like the other options (worse luck for me as I don't love making packed lunches..! But it is a massive plus in that I can ensure she's eating relatively healthily.) We look at the menu each week in case she changes her mind and they usually seem like quite calorie dense foods especially for families like ours who don't eat meat (pasta bake, pasties etc). Do all schools ensure the meals are a certain number of calories? I guess they must do it through portion sizes - but maybe that is problematic as a friend of my daughter who has school dinner every day has told me that they get the same amount in year 5 as they did in reception, even though I'm sure their nutritional needs must be different? I wonder if that could be part of the problem for the littler ones.

Blimey OP I really wouldnt bother with a chilli if its that much faff, try and find things that you dont need to have so much angst over.

Even if that involves some degree of processed food and I notice many on this thread dont seem to know the difference between processed and UPF

Its become the new scare.

Just give them smaller portions, or portions they need according to their weights. Children also do need carbs, fat and protein, they cant have diets like adults do with very few carbs but make them from lentils/pulses, grains rather than things like bran flakes which are a bit empty.

None of that is too bad for them op; it’s the donuts etc that are the issue.

On that meal I’d be more worried about Dc3! Did he eat cheese and wrap ? It’s fine now and then , but he needs veg and better protein. Are there raw veg sticks he will eat? One of mine used to eat a pile of these rather than cooked veg and the rule was if they didn’t eat the veg served they had to have these. But we did what you do and just served it all up regardless and it didn’t take that long before they kind of joined in. It was helped by an older Dc who used to say “ why do you have such an under-developed palate?!😀”

Give less bread and baked goods and more protein. I think some people have a tendency to overeat wheat based products and put on weight. I noticed this in some members of my family, including dc1.
As soon as I cut out snacks of toast and croissants, the weight dropped.
The odd cake or doughnut makes no difference to dc1's weight now.

I think this too. Bread has very little actual nutrition unless it’s the very grainy versions.

We had an extremely healthy diet as kids in the 80s and 90s -my mum didn't even buy fruit juice. I really appreciate what she was trying to do. But now my sister is morbidly obese and although I'm a healthy bmi, I've had four teeth extracted (because I had eaten so many sweets/drink so much fizzy drinks etc as a teen and young adult). It's so hard to know how to get the balance right as parents!

Ah OP, I so feel your pain. Mine was the skinny kid and the nurse had us doing 7-day food diaries. I used to be "that mum", begging pre-school, school, etc to stop offering sweets and snacks. They had no idea how many extra nutrient-free calories they were handing out. Fancy cake with buttercream and a chocolate on top. Two bourbon biscuits and a cup of hot chocolate. A mini chocolate bar. A carton of pure fruit juice. That could be my child's entire daily intake.
Yep, as the parent you're in control. As the parent, I was known as the one who stopped the birthday sweets and got the snack switched to toast and milk. Big bad meanie me. It's not a comfortable role.
Your kid is unusual, and most parents won't understand.
Breakfast top tips:
Branflakes and milk has a mix of carbs, protein, fat. If I thought there was a blood sugar issue, I'd serve 15-20g branflakes with 100g plain Skyr mixed with 100 ml wholemilk. But cornflakes were my goto cereal - I wouldn't demonise branflakes but they weren't top.
A fried egg takes one minute or less, if your child likes them, but that's only a twice a week thing.
Definitely porridge, which is surprisingly high in both protein and fat, and add a dollop of plain skyr again. Porridge takes a minute in the microwave. A handful of frozen blueberries chucked in for entertainment value.
The 7-day diary is not for the faint-hearted, but it can be useful reality check: yes my kid did attend three birthday parties that week. Yes grandma offered cake, neighbour shared doughnuts, and auntie made smoothies every single day, adding a whopping 700 calories and 150g sugar to the menu. And don't get me started on school fetes, dance class fundraisers, and church charity stalls...

I feel your pain @OP. My eldest is the sane at 6 and has no off button. I batch cook nutritious meals for the week ahead on the weekends that are a good mix of protein, fibre and carbs but give my little one an inch and they'll go the mile until they're sick. I've tried letting them gorge until they're sick so they make a connection with that but it's the same thing again the next day if I allow it. Have you taken your Dd for a blood test?

The portions are tiny.

They get maybe one chipolata sausage, a tablespoon of veg and maybe a scoop of mash.

Then they're given a small cookie or muffin.

I do agree with you OP. It’s really hard. If it wasn’t then there wouldn’t be so many obese adults either. I read ultra processed people this summer and as a result, we have removed almost all ultra processed foods from our household. There are a couple of exceptions - Oat milk as we have a child with a dairy allergy and vegan mayonnaise and spread. The occasional flavored yoghurt. It’s hard to do 100% and of course we accept that our control over school, parties etc is limited.

No more shop bought bread, cereals, biscuits, crisps etc. I think it’s the overconsumption of these nutritionally bereft processed carbs that is one of the problems. We don’t have sweets or chocolate in anyway, but do allow it at a party or special occasion. We do allow sweet treats when out so usually on a weekend we might buy a cake at a cafe or similar. ideally something homemade rather than packaged. My DC are not overweight but you could see that anything processed disrupted their portion control, blood sugar, cravings etc. I would suggest that this might be something to look at?

I thought there was a problem in the UK with lack of fibre in people's diets theses days. My two have bran flakes but they are teenagers. My DD sometimes has it with Greek yogurt but I don't think young children are that impressed by greek yogurt.

Not at ours, portions are good. Not far off what we do at home.
eg on roast dinner day it’s 3 roast pots, mixed veg portion, yorkshire pudding and meat, gravy. With a pudding which can be something like a doughnut (normal size) or serving of Eaton Mess or similar. Not saying that is especially healthy but the portions are not small.

It must vary hugely by supplier, ours are cooked on site and it’s a small school (65 kids roughly).

Yes this is so true about the portion sizes. I think this is part of the problem. My year 5 DC1 says they’re tiny and she’s starving. My DC2 says she didn’t want it all but ate it to get a sticker 🙈. Despite being 4 years apart they get the same amount of food 🤷🏻‍♀️.

A typical week would be pizza, pasta, roast, burger, then fish fingers, plus pudding. It’s not good is it, but she eats a sandwich tea at afterschool club so I’m hesitant for her to have a sandwich packed lunch as well (DH and I are run ragged with 3 kids and work so hot lunch in a thermos will not be an option).

DC3’s staple diet is chicken satay (shop bought one make), cherry tomatoes, sweetcorn (will eat the fresh stuff on the cob thankfully), cheese (this is new and a victory in my book), baked beans, bread, and luckily fruit. He would eat pasta and tomato sauce at one point which I saw as a major move forward but now won’t. I actually saw it as a victory when he decided he liked chips on holiday as that was a completely new texture, but we don’t have them at home. So yes we have food issues with him and cheese and a wrap (with some sweetcorn and tomato on the side) is a typically dinner here!

I also recommend ultra-processed people. There is overwhelming evidence that UPF is the leading cause of obesity, evidence that is deliberately being obfuscated by the huge industry behind these foods. An obesity epidemic arrives in every country where UPF becomes the main source of food. This is not just "the latest scare" - obesity simply did not happen on a large scale before the introduction of these foods. Most of the health advice including food "scares" since then has been manufactured by companies that produce UPF yet are somehow in advisory roles to the UK government when it comes to healthy eating. You couldn't make it up.

UPF is often marketed as healthy: consider flavoured "low fat" yoghurts, cereal bars, "high protein" processed meat sticks of all kinds, "sugar free" options, "healthy eating" ready meals etc. It's all junk food.

UPF doesn't affect everyone equally, some people may be able to eat only UPF and manage their weight much more easily, but genetics mean that in others UPF really interrupts the ability to regulate appetite and weight. We are animals and hunger is a powerful signal we simply can't ignore!

I would work on cutting down UPF, and not worrying about portion control so much so long as your daughter is eating nutritious mostly non-UPF foods. It's almost impossible to exclude UPF entirely but I think cutting down to 20% UPF would be a great target. That may mean replacing the meals she has at school, even though they are portion controlled they could be affecting her appetite / need to snack at different times of day.

I want to repeat, there was no obesity epidemic prior to the introduction of UPF. It is the cause. Nothing about human nature has profoundly changed so that we're all suddenly fat, lazy greedy bastards who can't regulate our appetites. It's UPF. The narrative that we need to "move more" or just will ourselves to eat less can literally be traced back to Nestle, Coca Cola, Unilever who make these foods.

Porridge is the easiest healthy breakfast in my opinion! Very filling.

I've not read the whole thing sorry but as a kid who struggled with weight and exercise was all about competitive sport, could you try and introduce space for activity for its own sake, so no rules or competition or no worries about what anyone else is doing but just the pleasure of a long brisk walk or bike ride, yoga or swim, maybe some weights but not about who can lift the most, just healthy habits with no comparison. Food wise, this has probably been covered but get her learning to cook and keep very limited junk. Long term appreciation of good food over crap, a balanced diet and a curiosity for using fresh ingredients. Obv not an overnight project but if she loves food, focus this in a healthy way