To think having children isn’t an accomplishment?

[RealGreyLemur]

It feels like society places so much emphasis on having kids as if it’s some grand achievement, but I don’t see it that way. AIBU to think that having kids shouldn’t be treated as an accomplishment in itself?

It feels that way to me too. I no longer have them in my life (the will was the final straw) and it’s definitely better that way. Even if I’ll never achieve the greatest accomplishment.

There also wouldn't be any human suffering but I don't suppose any parents would like to take the blame for that, only interested in taking credit for the good stuff apparently.

Any fertile person can have children, that in itself is not an accomplishment. Putting time and effort into bringing them up well is an accomplishment.

‘Bad stuff’ is part of human nature, so it would be an odd thing to take responsibility for. A little like why would a human need to eat/breathe etc.

Human beings are incredible - creating life is exactly that. It is not a guarantee that the journey will only be positive but a life nonetheless! A life.
Its bloody amazing when you think about it.

Completely agree - who are these people who glorify mothers or motherhood?

I agree that sadly some people make women feel they've somehow failed if they have no kids. And that's not right but I just think women get criticised whatever they do really. As you only have to look at this thread to see that's often by other women.

I glorify both mothers and motherhood - do you have any questions about that?

I salute all mothers - and women in general.

Humans only exist because of people procreating though, if I don't have kids then nothing bad is going to happen to them, fact.

I don’t understand your point. Good things happen all of the time.

Surely you agree mothers are pretty damn incredible? Having sex is one thing - creating life. Sustaining life and then nurturing them for decades is another. You would not be here to post my friend without that kind of love and commitment.

Some humans are incredible but most aren't. I think it's amazing what the body can endure in terms of pregnancy and birth but that's it. How is it amazing to create life even if that person suffers? I just don't get this comment.

Exactly the same as what animals do. My point was both good and bad things happen in life but parents never seem to acknowledge the bad parts or take responsibility for them.

..and many are not good at raising them, sadly.

Are you saying animals don’t accomplish things?

I think she's just saying that humans aren't unique/special in that we can reproduce.

In your eyes. For some people, being able to find a partner and procreate with them is a real accomplishment. Maybe careers havnt worked out shit for them. Let them have it. There is still importance in them creating life. Don’t dismiss it. I personally see having my kids as something I’ve accomplished. More than my uni degree and careers I’ve had. For others, they may see it differently. That’s ok. They are all accomplishments.

I don’t dismiss it. It’s amazing. But I think it is a bit dismissive of the pain of infertility to compare it to another achievement and say “meh, my friend did X and I didn’t and I’m ok with that, so you should be ok with not being able to have children while other women can.’” Do you get that?

No. Not really. People talk of space exploration as an achievement. They don’t think of the people in the command center doing the math or the people in the shop making the vessel or the person in the office designing the vessel or the science teacher encouraging the children who will work for the NASA. And they certainly don’t think of their parents who conceived, delivered and raised these people. This kind of talk is anti woman. So much for feminism. This kind of talk is anti disabled. So much for kindness and enlightenment. I surely would think most liberal minded people would consider a panda having a baby and that baby surviving to be an achievement. We have almost 10 billion people on the planet. And some will not be satisfied until there are less than a billion. Even China realizes that you can’t restrict fertility for more than a generation without really serious consequences. South Korea is finding out the same thing. It used to be mot everyone could reproduce not because of medical reasons but because of station in life. That is why Russia was legalizing abortion in the 20’s and then back and forth restricting, letting. It started with the restricting cause of the Bolshevik’s. China was restricting family size some decades later. Cause suddenly everyone could have a baby. They got rid of the stations in life nonsense. But they didn’t want too many undesirables having large families. Let us look at Germany in history. Some races (do not forget Poles and gypsies considered different race) and certain religions and the disabled encouraged and German Christian women banned from it. In this case you see how it was blatantly used to control. As a form of genocide. All the ideas put into the heads of the population to go along with the policy. Same thing for Russia, China and South Korea. Not just the government issuing the policy but they would get media to plant the goal in the minds of the people. It’s not just through posters put up by some government office. And just like all conflict does not come from governments, some come from terror groups, there are also separate groups that exert ideology onto people. It’s not all from the government. Some want only 1 billion humans. Not 10 billion. You believe what you are conditioned to believe. Not just a religion thing.

Having kids isn’t a notable accomplishment but raising them well is.

This is

Why are people thinking everyone can only have one achievement? Or only one type of achievement?

It's not dismissive. I'm sorry you've had to deal with such a painful situation, but your argument on this thread seems to be that having children isn't allowed to be an achievement simply because some people are unable to. By that logic, we shouldn't be celebrating anything. I'm not married, is it insensitive for other people to have big weddings or be proud of celebrating their golden anniversaries? Of course not.

@HVfan I have no idea where you came up with anything being anti disabled. Think you are reading a little bit too much into everything whilst managing to keep missing the point I'm trying to make entirely.

I’m struggling to see your point. You’ve said that having a child shouldn’t be seen as an achievement because some people can’t do it it. How does that make sense? I went through ivf and infertility so for me it definitely is an achievement. It doesn’t mean I’m ’better’ for having achieved it. Not at all! I’m just saying it feels like an achievement for me.

Love this. The creation of life occurs frequently , that doesn't make it any less extraordinary.
I'm amazed when anyone thinks otherwise. Your allowed to be amazed by the ordinary