Kids not wanting to attend SILs wedding after argument

[comfortablynumber]

My sister in law is getting married in 3 weeks. My daughter is a bridesmaid and my son is an usher. However we’ve all just had a huge row and now my children don’t particularly want to go either. Looking for advice.

Both my kids are in private school. Daughter year 10, son year 11. SIL very much disapproves of our choice. She also has a child in year 11. Over a family Sunday lunch we were discussing plans for post GCSE education. We’re not pulling the kids out of school during GCSEs but the fee increase is too much long term. The plan therefore is for them to complete their GCSEs in their current school and hopefully then get a place at the excellent local state school for 6th form. The local school is C of E which is why we couldn’t get in for senior school (I have some thoughts about that, but that’s another thread!) However for 6th form current pupils just have to achieve high GCSEs and new pupils very high GCSEs. They make offers to new pupils based on school predicted grades and the number of applicants etc. Last year for example to get in for A level maths you needed to be predicted a min 7 as well as scoring highly in an exam the school set.

I thought SIL would be happy, but she lost her mind. It was triggered by a comment my son made- he said he was looking forward to going because it would be nice to go somewhere bigger, meet new people and because most of his friends from his current school were also applying. His current school is selective and high achieving. Son is predicted 7-9 in almost everything and most of his friends are the same. We’re talking a year group of 150 kids with at least 50+% now applying to the local school (previously I’d say 10-20% went after GCSEs). This will obviously massively increase the competition for the places they can offer to people who aren’t already pupils.

SIL went off. It’s not fair apparently that her son and his friends may not be offered a place because of competition from kids who had the benefit of private education. She genuinely said that there should be a sort of tier system - like university contextual offers. The thing is, that other than the great C of E school the other school options aren’t good at all (hence us going private.) Son asked SIL if she was saying that because he’d been privately educated she thought he should go somewhere not great for A levels, and she said yes! Apparently he’ll do fine anywhere. Son said he didn’t want to do “fine”- he was aiming for better, and some of the other local schools don’t even offer things like further maths or A levels other than the basics.

DH (her brother) pointed out that the levelling up of state schools she thinks will happen when private schools lose pupils would take some time and there were bound to be issues initially, especially when lots more kids look to go to state schools for A levels in a few years. He’s been pissed off with her for years and pointed out that this is what she wanted. My son and daughter are very upset that their aunt seemingly doesn’t care that much about them.

I’m more sympathetic. Nephew has struggled in the school he’s currently in (also not able to get into C of E school) with low level bullying. He’s had 3 maths teachers in 18 months and his science teachers have been dreadful. The drama teacher is currently filling in in GCSE English lit for unknown reasons and it’s not going well. It’s all been a bit shit and I know they are hugely keen for him to go somewhere different for A level. However his predicted grades aren’t brilliant and he was always borderline as to whether he’d get in based on last years offers- the additional competition may well mess things up for him. SIL has been really upset about his school for a long time which is one of the reasons she’s been so cross about us going private. Apparently the local schools would have been better if the private school and the Cof E didn’t cream off the better pupils. She’s not wrong (don’t want this to be a thread about educational policy though) However my son and daughter are I think rightfully annoyed that she’d be happy to send them there!

It all got very fraught until my MIL nearly burst into tears and people calmed down. However the children are now saying they don’t want to be in her wedding. This is my problem- do I tell them to suck it up (outfits bought, far to late in the day to drop out, not doing it would cause possibly unrecoverable family strife, they love their cousin and my SIL when she’s not upset and speaking without thinking) or do I let them chose not to? They’re young and cross and I’m know they haven’t thought through the long term ramifications.

DH says we should leave them tonight but he’s not exactly impartial. I actually like SIL (despite being often and vocally judged) and think that everyone will end up regretting not going. I also think she’s a worried mother who is seeing the possibility of her child not getting a place somewhere he really wants to go. I’d be upset -and I am upset for nephew.
What do I do?

Yes i was saying that pressure on a level places is a likely consequence of this VAT policy.

I can see SIL pov and you should too. Perhaps they cant afford to pay. They have suffered through state not great school. Get to gcse and potentially ok resukts for state local schools. Then to have to compete with extra private kids who likely will all have 7-9s.
Because the oarents now choose not to pay. So local state kids cant go and some will end up not doing alevels some parents will be forced to pay for 6th form.
However this is exactly what happens with university places.

I think sil needs to suck up the cost and pay for tutoring in maths /eng and whatever he wants to do alevels in.

We need to raise state schools and expectations - homework etc.
Weve had covering books in y7. Very often revision.
I would say 1 piece of homework so far y8 thats not vocab/revision etc.
And nothing is ever marked returned or rechecked.

Do you think nephew is as clever as your dc?

My neices go private abroad and the uk started reading etc much earlier but the difference is growing with neices now loving readong, doing music etc.

I think your children need to show some maturity and accept you can have differences of opinion without fracturing the relationship. Your SIL is obviously still happy to have them at the wedding. Clearly this shows that she can look past this. Your kids need to do the same.

Tell the kids to suck it up.

This is exactly what being the bigger person entails. Your kids will be more than fine- it isn’t like they have to go to whichever sink comprehensive is allocated to them.

You like SIL, she is obviously very very sensitive about this, and it could well be mixed up with her childhood too.
Honestly, I think a hefty dose of compassion is appropriate.

Yes I agree with this.

Your post is very balanced - I can see both your son's point and your SIL's point! I think when your kids have calmed down you could have an interesting conversation with your kids as this is a really complex issue.

You could also point out that it's very unlikely that SIL actually wants your kids to have a crap sixth form experience. She was most likely lashing out after years of sadness and frustration about her son struggling with bullying and academics at a not-great school. Plus wedding stress on top. Obviously it wasn't great to lash out but it's a good lesson that adults are not perfect either and sometimes life stress gets on top of us.

I think it's unfair to say nephew has a lack of ability. He's clever, just had time off because of fear and bullying, plus less than stellar teaching. Would he be getting better grades had he gone to my kids school- almost certainly. That's the problem.
She's very stressed organising a wedding and worried about her child and she's always spoken without thinking. She loves my kids I know.

Would seem like a good opportunity for everyone to remember that you don’t allow politics to affect family relationships. The adults should have refrained from having that discussion in front of kids who are unlikely to be able to see the bigger picture, especially as they are directly affected.
I’d apologise to them for that, and ask your SiL to do the same. And then tell them that attending the wedding is non-negotiable.

Think you've had some great advice here and just wanted to say that you sound lovely. If you can teach your kids to be like you, and realise that you don't need to agree with people about everything and yet still love them, then you'll need doing them a great service.

They are children, they do as they are told.

Keeping commitments is an important concept that parents need to enforce.

She was very wrong to get into an argument with kids, though.

The main thing is the adults need to clear the air and make it clear to the kids that this has been done.

Modelling moving on from this is far more productive than just letting minors vote with their feet.

She didn’t say that though. She made the very fair point that it’s a bad thing if the private school cohort disproportionately push out clever state pupils at the A-level stage. She’s right. That’s exactly what contextual offers at uni aim to balance. It’s potentially even worse for the country as a whole if it’s happening at the sixth form level, as it’s at sixth form/college that a fair few of the pupils who have got the grades to get in despite woeful schooling get to achieve in time for uni. It’s a very bad thing if those pupils are pushed out by decidedly less clever public school kids who have the same or better GCSE grades. Contextual offers will indeed start to come into play at 6th form I’d imagine.

Yes - this is a brilliant opportunity to teach your (very privileged) kids some very important lessons - about empathy, equal opportunity, and also understanding that how people react is very often not personal but based on their own fears.

This is a great chance for him to choose to forgive and rise above things.

It’s not fair apparently that her son and his friends may not be offered a place because of competition from kids who had the benefit of private education. She genuinely said that there should be a sort of tier system - like university contextual offers.
Why have you added the "apparently" and the "genuinely". If her comments are to be criticised, surely that's only for how banal they are.

I wouldn't pull out of the wedding.

Your SIL is completely correct but should never have brought it up in front of your kids - that was bang out of order.

However - it sounds like you might need to have a chat with your kids about how their privilege absolutely does negatively impact less privileged people. They are absolutely old enough to understand that & they should learn to be a little more humble & accepting of that situation. It's not them she is criticising but the system that hugely benefits them but does the opposite for her son as a direct result.

She's also correct that the private school kids will succeed wherever they go because of the huge advantage they've already had assuming the courses they want to do are available.

Again - your kids need to be made to understand it's not about them as individuals, it's not personal and of COURSE she doesn't want them to do badly! She knows they won't.

Exactly. She sees that her son is as clever - he doesn’t lack ability. She can see that their playing field is not at all level. I can guarantee you’d be pissed off too if this was you and you’d just heard your child’s cousin speak comfortably and totally unthinkingly about how that privilege was probably going to carry him right through in direct competition to him and he just couldn’t see it.

Yes this.

Of course you should all be going to the wedding, and you need to speak with your kids.

Just explain this all rationally to your kids, even that she has a point but her emotions made it poorly articulated due to worrying about their cousin. Your children are actually coming from a very privileged position and it's important they understand that. The system isn't fair for everyone and they aren't too young to learn that and be empathetic to it. Of course their aunt doesn't want them to have less of a good chance but is rightfully worried about the kids who had less opportunity and are trying to get by being further less behind

asked SIL if she was saying that because he’d been privately educated she thought he should go somewhere not great for A levels. That is a nasty characterisation of what she was saying, which was very reasonable and moderate. Tell DS he's spoilt and really, he was the one that started it.

I'd ask your children to attend the wedding, be polite and smile in all the right places, but be clear this doesn't mean any of you are happy with her comments/behaviour.

Nor does it mean they can't decide on the relationship with SIL going forward...but short term, they need to keep their powder dry and just attend the wedding.

A reactive response to hurtful comments and behaviour can make it escalate beyond redemption, something they may regret in the future. This way at least they can retain the moral high ground and know that their actions were not at fault if the relationships breakdown.

The timing is really shitty though, ideally your family would have time to process this properly and decide how to manage the relationship going forward without the pressure of a wedding and not being seen as the ones who 'ruined the whole day' rather than the fact that your SIL resents your children.

It's not your kids' fault that they're going to a comprehensive school thanks to VAT on school fees. You SIL needs to calm down, and your kids need to suck it up and go to the wedding.

I think op you sound very reasonable, I agree kids should go, three weeks before wedding i dont think id be telling her your kids dont want to go, id just say they were a bit upset. Id also obviously explain to your kids that sil is just upset re her concern for son.

She was very unreasonable tbh to be essentially accusing your kids of damaging her son's future and if that arises post wedding I'd be forthright with her about that. At the end of the day, your kids aren't doing anything wrong.

I agree - Private School is very divisive (and I say that as someone who had a private school education to 16 before leaving to go to State) and it isn’t always something I will admit to friends because of it

I did exactly what your son said he was looking forward to - small classes enable me to get the best grades and then I spread my wings at sixth form

it is a good opportunity to explain though exactly how privileged that has been for him and the opportunities it has afforded him and the chances that it has opened and how difficult it can be for people to accept that - because it is a paid for thing that not everyone can afford

I think letting them throw hissy fits and not go would have far wider ramifications than a row about private school.Thing is, she’s not wrong-it would seem hugely unfair to have privately educated kids swan in and hoover up all the places because their parents have been able to pay for their education. But either she’s made it personal or they’ve taken it personally. Can you speak to your teens and explain that she’s very stressed about her dc and that’s why she talked as she did. But withdrawing from a wedding over a pretty row is insane.

@Gcsunnyside23 her emotions made it poorly articulated due to worrying about their cousin. Well no. Her emotions came out because of OP's DS mocking her beliefs and concerns as being nothing more than wanting him to go to a bad school. Ask a silly question, get a silly answer.

Your SIL has a point, so do you.
Your children need to understand that it's ok to have a different opinion to someone but still respect and like them.
I think it's too late to back out of the wedding now and it would be very petty to do so. They need to go!

This👆 I would have nipped that argument in the bud as it was totally inappropriate in front of the kids. OP have a polite chat with Sil about how your kids are not responsible for the issues her DC is having. Whether she feels they have no right to state 6th form or not is irrelevant, it's not their fault. She made it personal. Then tell the kids you've had a word and they must go to the wedding and put the whole argument behind them.