DH and MIL having dinner without me and the kids on holiday

[FussyFusspott]

MIL is on her own and DH is her only child. She has always been overbearing and very demanding of him, financially and emotionally. She isn't a horrible person at all and she is a loving grandparent but is definitely enmeshed with DH and this caused issues when our first DC was born 7 years ago. After having children DH started to prioritise me and the children more, in only a natural way he still cares for his mum a lot, and this caused resentment from her.

Things we did she didn't like - moved 20 miles away (couldn't afford to live where we were previously), he stopped paying a lot of her living expenses but had given her a lot of money we couldn't really afford in the past. I admit I resent how she was/ is with DH - expects to be wined and dined at least once a week and has told him that she prefers time just the two of them. However she is always pleasant when she sees me.

She has wanted to come on holiday with us since the DC we're born (7 and 4) and DH has said he feels he has to do it "before she dies". She's 67 and in good health but tells him often she thinks she may die soon. She openly asks us to take her on holiday but says she can't afford to contribute a single penny to it. DH wants to take her and I feel I can't say no as it's important to him and I've told him it won't be a regular thing just once. I am not happy about it as I feel a bit like the third wheel with them at times as she simpers over him a lot and feel like she just tolerates me.

Sorry finally getting to my point - DH tried to sell it to me as childcare whilst we were on holiday, I don't really want or need it but I guess a dinner together would be nice, but he also said that whilst on this week's holiday one night he would need to have a dinner with just his mum as well whilst I would be with the kids as he would have to take her for dinner the two of them at some point. I feel so uneasy about this for some reason. They go out for dinner the two of them at least twice a month and I don't mind in the slightest but to actively leave me out on holiday (a holiday he and I are paying for) just feels galling.

AIBU?

It’s an old Spanish phrase. From when all pots were burnt and blackened by the fire. Am I missing something? 😵‍💫

It's English as well. Dates from when all cooking was done on open fires which produced a lot of smoke and soot. The soot would cling to the cooking vessels and turn them black (because that's what colour soot is). So if the pot said as an insult to the kettle (leaving aside for a moment that they can't talk) that you're black, meaning you'd lost your copper shine under the soot, well so too would the kettle be so the pot would be justified in turning it straight back on the kettle.

It's not a million miles from 'those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones'.

If the saying has acquired racist overtones then it's through ignorance of the origin. I've never heard it used in any racist sense.

[Back in the room. As you were.....]

Hmm I’d also find this a bit weird, but OP if you do go - make sure your night is first because I could completely see her opting out later on if she’s had her night.

ugh even typing that out sounds weird! Pick a good restaurant for yourself 🤭

Your husband wants to do this OP. He wants to bring his mum on holiday. He wants to go out with her to dinner twice a month and on their own on holiday. Because if he didn't, he wouldn't. Simple as that. He is telling you she doesn't want you there, that she's going to die, that she'll baby sit, because he doesn't want you to give him hassle over it. There is no earthly point in making your MiL the target of your resentment and seeing her as the problem. She's going to carry on the relationship with her son he wants to have with her, and as you admit, she's nice to you. Its your DH you need to tackle of you don't like it.

If my OH told me he had a problem with me going out for dinner alone with my mum for one night on holiday, I'd genuinely, seriously, reconsider the relationship. And probably get the ick.

It's not a bad thing, male or female, to be close to a parent - personally I see it as a positive quality, but you clearly don't and feel it's too close.

There is likely an element of truth to it, but also an element of weird jealousy on your part. He is allowed a close relationship with his folks.

Your mil is not a sociable person and you have a very kind husband who has a lot of empathy. The grass is not greener on the other side. One day you will see you have a good man beside you.

I do think a holiday should be spent together and not apart. I would never leave my children to go out alone with my partner it wouldn't feel right. I would put my foot down and cause a stink in the house and tell him I don't want no bloody childcare. Tell him you want a family holiday together or cancel it or tell him to take his mum on holiday and you will stay at home with the children. Forget what I said in my last post go to war. If he loves his family then he wouldn't allow his mother to manipulate him.

I didn't even know what the phrase was but if it was that one it's absolutely ridiculous to complain about it!!

I still got attacked by that poster over it!

"The likes of me"???

I didn't even know what the phrase was!!! But then your posts aren't coming across as rational...

Not at the expense of the relationship with his wife and children!!!

What expense? OP has her children, alone for that night? So her husband can have quality time alone with his mother for a meal?

Again, if my OH dared tell me he 'didn't want no childcare' and 'raised hell' like another poster suggested she would, for looking after his own children whilst I had a meal with my mother, alone, on holiday, I would legitimately consider LTB.

Utterly ridiculous behaviour. It's no wonder so many women have problems with the MIL, judging by this thread.

It's a family holiday to create memories with the family. Why can't she eat with her grandchildren and enjoy spending quality time with her grandchildren and son. Some people take themselves too serious and the op and her children are second best to his mummy. I have a son as well I wouldn't want candlelit dinner with my son on his own on a family holiday. If that's what you like then you do you but the op is not happy and the children will feel it to.

My mil was never clingy she had other things to do.

Interesting responses. If a woman said she wanted to have some time with her mum and her partner was saying it was weird, all of the responses would be about how controlling he is, yet when a man wants to spend time with his mum he is a freak.

That said, it probably would annoy me to be left out on my own holiday, as if I was the babysitter while my DH and MIL swan off for dinner and drinks. It would mostly bother me that i was missing out on a nice dinner. I don't think id be as fussed about missing a breakfast or a brunch. If you don't want them to go out for dinner, can you compromise or trade for something you want to do, eg. Could they take the kids to the pool one morning so you get a lie in or go for a massage? Or maybe they could go for breakfast/brunch/a cuppa one day instead and then you can still all eat together in the evenings? Or can you swap, so each adult has a night in with the kids while the other 2 go out.

If I was you I’d tell him to take his mum on holiday by himself, no way would I be wasting my one holiday a year going with my mother in law. She’s being very selfish expecting to go on it and also not pay then exclude you from dinner!!! No I’d put my foot down. If he wants to go on holiday, fine he can with his mum , even taken the kids but you’re not going to be treated like a mug. Plus you now get a week to yourself!

This man is prioritising, and has prioritised, his mother over his wife. He has a history of giving her money that they cannot afford. He takes his mother out for dinner once a week, at their expense. She created a fuss when they moved 20 miles away, because they couldn't afford to live in their previous area. So one night a week, the OP is left to mind their children while her DH eats out with his mother.

Her husband is already having "quality time" with his mother once a week when he treats her to dinner.

She is blackmailing him to get to go on a family holiday by saying she is going to die soon, and she is demanding that the holiday is paid for by her son and DIL, and they will even be responsible for her spending money.

Presumably, they also see MIL as a family together. And now she wants to monopolise her son by insisting he take her out to dinner, just the two of them, 1/7th of their nights away, leaving the OP to mind the children.

I don't know why the hell it always has to be going for dinner? Could he not swing by her house for a coffee like normal people?!!

There's something seriously amiss with you if you think that's normal or fair!!

I think that's what's so icky for me? Going for dinner together so frequently seems overly intimate?

Right! I think that's what it is for me too that's giving me enmeshed vibes. Maybe I'm old school but I think of dinner time when you have young children as quality family time that is meant for the immediate family to bond and have that sacred and valuable time together. It's almost like he is splitting that limited time they have as a family between his wife and child and then his mother. I am sorry but if you have a wife and young children at home your wife and child should absolutely be getting the majority of your time a lot more than your mother. I think the other odd thing is he doesn't want his wife and children to come to any of these weekly/biweekly dinners. Like why? Why wouldn't he want his children to bond with their grandmother why wouldn't he want his wife to bond with and build a relationship with her MIL.

You can't do that if they are never invited. I am just picturing myself making small talk with a co worker and talking about what we had for dinner last night and me saying, "yeah the kids and I had steak and potatoes" and my coworker asks, "oh was your husband not home" and me saying, "no he took his mom out to Olive Garden for dinner" anyone I told this too one of their first thoughts would probably be so he left his wife and children on their own for dinner instead of spending dinner time with them to take his mom out to eat and didn't even invite them?

It seems like OP's DH is doing everything in his power to make his mom feel valued and loved and to not hurt her feelings and upset her at the expense of his wife's feelings. What about making his wife's feelings seen and valued? Sorry I don't think it is the wife that should be the one who gets the short end of the stick here and should have to suck it up and get her feelings hurt.

OP your DH is giving me vibes of a typical husband on Mother's Day saying to you, "well you aren't my mother why should I have to acknowledge you on Mother's Day" despite the fact you are the literal mother to his child. Or going big for his mother on mother's day while treating you second best.

See I am reading that a lot differently than you. You word the whole thing as if it's the OP/the wife making DH choose when I see it completely different where it's the MIL in this case making her son choose by excluding his wife every other week from these dinners out to eat. MIL is putting her son in the awful position of having to tell his wife sorry once again she doesn't want to spend time with her GC or her DIL. And then MIL is being demanding of her son's time and finances by asking him to pay for her (which they are married so it's the wife's money as well) and asking him to leave his wife and child and have dinner alone with her and not inviting the rest of his immediate family.

You say no wonder DILs and MILs have friction and you place the onus all on the DIL when the MIL has a huge role (at least this MIL in question does) in this. She is causing friction by excluding her GC and DIL repeatedly. Demanding DIL's money be used on dinner she isn't even inviting to. Then encroaching on their family holiday asking to come and not only asking to come but demanding to be paid for. Yeah that's not a good look for a MIL. She is taking her son away from his child and wife. Then I am not buying the whole I want to spend time with my GC act because why does she want to exclude her GC for these weekly or biweekly dinners? Why does she want to go on this vacation and not eat with her GC one evening? If she really wanted to spend time with her GC you would offer to babysit a couple nights so you can spend quality time with then and so your son and DIL can have a couple nice date nights.

That's a MIL who wouldn't want to put her son in the middle between her and his wife. But repeatedly excluding his wife and GC is not going to endear you to your DIL. She should be helping to make her son's marriage better and tell her son to build his relationship with his child and wife and spend time with them.

I doubt if as a daughter you said "I'm going to take mum out for dinner on our own tonight, so we can have a chat without the kids" anyone would give it a second thought. I also doubt any mum would be accused of 'fawning' over her adult daughter or 'enmeshed' because they went out for two dinners a month. When people stridently insist there's absolutely no difference between being mum to a girl and mum to a boy and you can be 'just as close' if you only raise your son to be a decent man who makes an effort; these threads always spring to mind, and I tend to think they may be in for a surprise.

This^ 100%
It would be my response to him every time. Yes, your MIL behaves weirdly but your DH is enabling her big time. And it’s the problem.

But as a daughter you also probably wouldn’t (if you’re also a reasonable person) go I know you and my mum don’t get along, and she isn’t particularly nice to you, but I’m going to bring her on our family holiday, and I’ll lie about she will help with childcare but actually you will do the childcare on our holiday so I can take her out without you.

that wouldn’t go down particularly well with either sex I expect. Nor has it here.

Yeah that's not a good look for a MIL

That’s not a good look for any decent parent. The amount of posters making out it is ok for a parent to demand and guilt a holiday from their adult child who cannot afford it and continuously asks and takes money from them because they themselves can’t seem to save is crazy.

Surprised there weren’t more LTB when OP mentioned he doesn’t take her out for meals at all but does so for his mum several times a month. Wonder how much family money funds his mother alone.

Yes exactly! If it's a close same sex relationship (mum/daughter, dad/son) it's apparently a god thing and perfectly acceptable but if the same relationship was had by mum/son, dad/daughter, it's then wrong and portrayed as seedy.

Her husband takes his mother out to dinner every week using family money leaving the OP at home to look after the children. Despite his mother working, he will pay for her flights, accommodation and spending money. She is like a dependent child.

You may think that this is all normal but most people on the thread think it is really weird.