Survey at work using the term cis woman

[SuzanneRogers]

So I filled all the survey, very happy at work, public secror.
Note that this survey is outsourced by another survey organisation.

Then I come to the last bit please describe your role in the organisation, did that, and then how would you describe your sex or gender?

( Can’t remember exactly how the question was phrased )but the only option for women was “cis woman.”

Quite cross about this and I’m not sure how to best articulate this to my managers who, to be fair never use this term and will not have had any input to designing the survey. Any input welcome.

I am, if that helps

YES Of course there is!!!!! It’s to distinguish between trans men and men who are not trans.

Men who are not trans are men. Transmen are a subset of women.

It's when you see pish like John Hopkins University defining lesbians as 'non men attracted to non men' that you realise that in intensely regressive gender ideology, women can only be defined in terms of their not being male. Not as humans in their own right.

sorry we’re well past the time when pointing out facts is ‘transphobic’

Yes the obvious solution is to offer trans men and trans women and all the other rainbow terms of which I can’t keep up with.

Plus Male and female

Yes

Because Cis just means "not trans"

"How about instead of “cis” we just say “woman (not trans)” it would mean exactly the same thing. That ok with you?"

No. I am a woman. That's all that's necessary thank you.

Ok but if we write “women” and “trans. Women” it isn’t clear from an analysis perspective because the categories are not mutually exclusive.

Trans women identity as both trans women and as women, so some trans women will select one box and some the other.

I get you don’t like it, but that’s how it is and the reality of how other people fill out surveys.

Because cis just means you subscribe to a belief that ppl have some kind of undefinable gender identity to their biological sex. I think thats bollocks

There is you’ve just used it in your post.

Although gender ideology isn’t the right way to go

So it's not scolding to refer to those with an alternative point of view as handmaidens?

@MartinCrieffsLemon cis means on this side of, on this side of what? It doesn't mean not trans!

It's like complaining about being asked to identify your race and foaming at the mouth because "just because she's a black woman doesn't mean I'm a white woman". It's ludicrous.

No it would be like a white woman identifying as a black woman and enforcing surveys that say ‘cis black woman’ as a category. That sound ok?

Trans identifying male / man (currently trans woman)

Trans identifying female / woman. (currently trans man)

This is more linguistically correct, doesn't erase current sex based language and can't be used to insist the erasure of single sex spaces and sports.

No doubt it will piss some men off, but they weren't great at consent anyway were they. They have no concern, seemingly that many women don't consent to the erasure of our language and spaces.

It’s a pointless term though - as women and men are simply that and then there is transwomen and transmen. It’s simple as that.

I have no idea why some have felt the need for made up terms! We don’t need them. The above does the job perfectly well.

According to you, but that’s unfortunately not how other people use and understand these words.

Some transwomen don't though they just want to be women.

We might be getting a little tired of being told to be ‘be kind.’

Some trans people are male - transwomen. Some are female - transmen.

Transwomen wish to present as feminine; that’s fine. Be as gendered or ungendered as you like, this isn’t Iran.

Sex won’t change, whatever you wear.

Observing facts isn’t imposing a label or identity on anyone. They are also the height and age they are, whether or not they wear heels or have facelifts. They are humans; they are mammals; they breathe in oxygen and exhale carbon dioxide. (Yes, I know that’s a simplified explanation of respiration)

Material reality doesn’t stop existing and being relevant because of personal preferences.

In terms of gender, Cis means not trans

Why? it's factually correct.

Are facts transphobic nowadays? Seems so?

Don’t what? Sorry I’m not sure what you’re referring to.

Then we simply go back to 2 terms, not how you feel or how you identify, but how you were born- man/male, woman/female.

@MartinCrieffsLemon

Yes

Because Cis just means "not trans"

It doesn't just mean "not trans". At all. It presupposes that I share your gender identity belief, which I don't. If it just meant "not trans", and a biological woman is a "cis woman" then a "trans woman" would be a biological female who identifies as a man. But that's not what your ideology says.

It’s simple as that.

This is the problem. As with so much in life, it’s not at all simple. I get that you want life to be black and white and simple for you to understand. It’s not.