Time for a new PM and Chancellor?

[Whenwillitgetwarm]

I wrote this on another thread but feel it should have its own thread.

Although I voted Labour (the current Tory’s are too insane), I think it may be time to swap out Starmer and Reeves. If this is done early, there’s enough parliament time left to bed a new PM and Chancellor in.

They both lack ideas, seem confused, no vision etc. They had 14 years to think up workable plans. Coming in and throwing their hands up saying there’s no money so they can’t do anything is very poor. They want to continue austerity on the sly. They indulge in stupid culture wars like VAT to rob Peter to pay Paul (and Paul won’t see a penny anyway). They have bad advisors and are arrogant. It looks like they are just excited to have the job titles and don’t know what to do.

Get a top two who will come up with a bold plan. We’re in the gutter so there’s opportunities to deliver quick wins. They don’t always need funding, simple policy changes can make big and quick differences. If they gave each department a target to deliver one quick legislative win by Christmas, we’d start 2025 differently.

Unfortunately we’re stuck with two people who can’t believe their luck, and who are afraid of the Daily Mail, Murdoch, some loud Redwall types and bots on X who wish our country economic harm. They are weak.

If Labour were a football team, there would be fans screaming for Starmer to be sacked now.

This is not about getting rid of Labour. I believe there is talent in the wider party, much more than in the Conservatives who hollowed out their party under Johnson. Nevertheless I just don’t think Starmer and Reeves should have their roles.

So you agree with the fees going up?

It’s like the last 14 years never happened 😆
I’m getting to the point where I think most Brits just love drama. We’ve had 10 years of it since Brexit, what with proroguing of Parliament etc. They think it’s Love Island.

We don't know whether student fees will be going up yet. But if they do, I will disagree with that policy.

You do know a person can be a Labour voter and disagree with some of their policies and actions?

I am not sure what you mean about that. You obviously bear a grudge against the last government, and are in favour of the withdrawal of WFP. You obviously won't object to helping your grandparents pay their winter fuel. The train drivers do not show much gratitude to the elderly, either.

The disabled received the winter fuel payment and the cold weather payment. The pensions were increased; the Disability Living Allowance was increased. The disabled who received the DLA automatically received the WFP.

Neither the DLA nor the WFP were means tested. Now Sir Kier, with all his luxuries labour voters only dream of, paid for by a Peer, has made the WFP means tested. MPs get their energy bills paid. The oldest pensioners bore the privations of war so that you have freedom. They should not be allowed to lay wreaths to the fallen in two world wars when now, they could well be responsible for the pensioners dying from hypothermia.

To means test the disabled, who cannot work, is wicked. To means test the elderly who cannot work is wicked. The WFP was tax free. There may be some very rich pensioners and some very rich disabled(you never know).

The means test level is low. The pension credit is payable to those receiving less than £218 a week. The new state pension is £221 a week. That is £3 over the limit for pension credit.

The pension credit makes it up to £218 a week, but recipients can then receive free dental treatment and teeth, free glasses, free travel, and a lot more benefits. It is grossly unfair anyway, because those benefits can add up to more than £221 a week. Those with that cannot have pension credit or the tax free fuel allowance now. That means people on benefits receive far more than the oldest pensioners.

You think that is right?

The disabled received the winter fuel payment and the cold weather payment. The pensions were increased; the Disability Living Allowance was increased. The disabled who received the DLA automatically received the WFP

You don't know what you are talking about.

Disabled people under pension age have never received the winter fuel payment.

Disabled people on certain means tested benefits are eligible for the cold weather payment, same as always.

DLA did not increase under the Tories. It was in fact abolished for adults and replaced with PIP, which is notorious for being a cruel and complex benefit.

Eta:I do agree the threshold for the winter fuel payment is too low. But the rest of your post is very much full of errors.

They should not be allowed to lay wreaths to the fallen in two world wars when now, they could well be responsible for the pensioners dying from hypothermia

You trotted out that line earlier? 🤔

It has been fully debunked @llizzie

there is talk about student fees going up!! Poor parents having to stump up even more.

This is quite telling as the vast majority of students get student loans to cover the fees.

The problem with unis is that the Tories left them in a mess (shock). They either close through lack of funding, increase international students to subsidise British students even more (but people don’t like immigration) or put up tuition fees. Those are the choices.

It looks like voting intention polling is shifting anyway

Just one point between the two in the latest

Perhaps the media is in step

Link if you would be so kind?

@EasternStandard didn't you say just yesterday that a voting intention poll is pointless at this stage and you didn’t really know why anyone would take any notice?

Here you go. By More in Common polling, which on looking at their site is legit.

Labour might want to hold off on the if a GE were held tomorrow thought

Yes please

There was no trend yesterday on any of the poll aggregators

A change of voting intention over a 24 hour period does not make a trend

Suspect it's like the DM leading the way in exposing partygate

Well, firstly, a broken promise and a lie are two different things. If I promise to pick my friend up to go somewhere tonight, then when I get in the car it won’t start I have to break my promise. I didn’t lie when I made it though, did I?

Secondly, which broken promises are you referring to here?

That’s a screenshot. Link?
Im not suggesting it’s not legit, I’d just like a look at the methodology.

That's one poll - one poll in isolation means nothing and doesn't indicate a 'shifting away'

Labour aren't doing too well at the moment.

They are basically spending money like water, but rolling back on taxation increases because of the unpopularity.

This is causing gilt yields to spike. 10 year gilts are now 0.5% above their mid September minimum.

This is exactly what happened with Truss. Spending, but no plan on how to fund.

No doubt the usual suspects will be all "but Truss, but Truss" relying on the fact that the general public's understanding of macroeconomics and the gilt markets is poor to essentially gloss over what is exactly the same situation.

People in the know are getting their popcorn ready because Labour are between the markets demanding fiscal responsibility and Labour supporters demanding unfunded spending.

I’ve has a look myself @EasternStandard
Its one of those where they eliminate ‘don’t knows’ by allocating a notional vote based on others with similar background. I think this far from an election that’s a flawed methodology as most floating voters will be ‘done know’ because the6 don’t yet know what the Labour government will do and they don’t have to decide for another 4 years or so.
I’ll concede that in the raw data there was only a point between Labour and Tory. The Don’t Knows outnumbered both. I think it shows people withholding judgement rather than ‘shifting away’.

The6 are neither spending not rolling back tax rises until there’s a budget.

Looks like you misread, I didn’t use the word away, so your quote isn’t my post

The whole Susan Gray drama and drip feeding of glasses that cost more than a term of education at a private school they want to get VAT for has made me really dislike them. It seems like a misogynistic work environment with people who want scandals and flashy stories to be forefront rather than getting on with doing anything to actually help people.

The people wanting scandals are the right wing press. They can’t find any, so they’ve made a few up. Maybe you should dislike them instead?

i misread it too. ‘Anyway’ or ‘away’ after ‘shifting’ doesn’t change the basic meaning. The word ‘shifting’ is the one which shows what you are hoping.

Can you show me a poll near the GE that has those figures?

If not then there’s been a shift.

I mean I get it’s not welcome on this thread but More in Common did a poll and there’s the result.

The pp asked for evidence, nicely which was a bonus, so there it is.

Apologies

You are correct you said 'shifting anyway' - tho' it's difficult to imagine you mentioning it if the alleged 'shift' were towards incr labour

All my other points stand

Well, no. One poll is a result, not a shift. You need a pattern to call it a shift. And as I pointed out, more people didn’t know than chose either. I don’t think any methodology can accurately predict their eventual choice just yet.
Im not surprised - there have been actual errors (WFA cut off too low for eg) and a lot of confected nonsense. If you tell everyone loudly from every media outlet that the government is crap, a lot of people will start to wonder if it’s true. You know really that these ‘scandals’ are nothing of the sort though, surely? And that any sensible government does the unpopular stuff straight away so people forget about it/feel the benefit of it before the election?