There’s no way this can work is there?

[Pickledpicklez]

If there is, please advise.

dm is getting elderly, lives in other end of country. Time is coming to think of more long term plans. Not quite yet but in the next 3 years.

as a working theory we’ve said, well both sell our homes and buy a larger house with an annex for her. Perfect, except there seems to be no way to make this actually possible as no one will let us view a house because we’ve got not one but two houses to sell. So 2 chains.

Dh and I would like another child, so our family may expand. And we don’t have enough savings nor is it affordable mortgage wise to take out a second mortgage especially as we’d be looking at a 5 bed house with an annex, either as an out building or side of the house. We’d need it already built and we’d need to close to my kids school (one of the best in the city so seems foolish to move from the catchment area)

we don’t have enough room as is for dm to sell up and move in now. Plus dm isn’t an easy woman, the annex for some separate living conditions is an absolute must.

only thing I can think of is bridging loan (high risk) and moving my house to consent to let on interest only to remove the capital and maxing out affordability, BUT likely no high street lender would touch us because it’s so high risk and even writing down it’s likely not affordable.

one option is that she needs to sell toute suite and move into a cheap rental but who knows how long it would be til we could find a house that ticks all the boxes

anyone had similar and can help me.

@Pickledpicklez : thanks for commenting

The expectations of the older community in Asian cultures can be so unfair: this is one reason so many asian women don’t marry in the community I am sure

With this context: try all you can to NOT have your DM in with you but in a small property close by (ideally 5 min in the car) - you might be there multiple times a day. It avoids a precedent for your MIL

This also allows you to push back to SS on being a carer if need arises in future: you have to refuse for them to provide care

Re your DMIL : if you are in an area with an Asian community, there are now homes with Asian food etc: and it’s becoming more acceptable. The reality is you would not be able to provide serious care (to either DM or DMIL) and maintain a FT job: seeing friends now they are really struggling

You need to make sure you do nothing for your DM that you would not do for your DMIL, or in 10-15 years your DH is likely to be pushing that in your face

I didn’t want an Asian MIL so didn’t marry an Asian man. My own mother expects her son (AND my DSis as my brother isn’t married) to give up their own lives to look after her

The Idea of ‘not being a burden’ is so alien to the culture

But bear in mind, a few generations ago in a joint Asian family you’d have had your MIL and a couple of SILs helping with childcare, chores, and money - and splitting thd elder care lately with the siblings and all your kids

Now you don’t get the help with your kids but are expected to do the caring : and you are right that many act like they are ancient from late 50s - but live to late 90s

Put those boundaries up now or your life will get swallowed up : and zero thanks or appreciation

To add: there may be a 15 year age gap, but life can be unpredictable

a situation where you are caring for both is more likely than not IMO: prepare for that

I’m sorry, I’m not sure about minimum distances but the fact my mum lived so close was used against us. They wouldn’t provide any care whatsoever for my nan & would only give 6 wks care for my nan’s husband as he’s not dad/grandad to us & they deemed our care needs to be for my nan who is biologically related to us. After the 6 weeks we haven’t been able to get any care for either of them & it’s now down to us to look after both of them. If I was the only one, as I live over 60 miles away we would have gotten some care but because my mum is there we can’t. They said in future if my mum passed & I still lived further away then & my nan still needed care then I could apply again at a later date. Sorry I can’t give you more info

The "elderly mindset" is the biggie here

SD did have heart problems and ended up having a heart attack on a flight from Oz, plane diverted to Germany , 2 months there - blah blah - and he put himself in a chair and let mum fetch and carry . When he popped his clogs, she moved into his chair. And now expects me to fetch and carry

Shes 86 and yes she does have age related problems but is as fit as a flea otherwise. Yet she sits seizing up, her life getting smaller and smaller by the year

She isnt poorly enough to get social services and refuses to pay for any "Ive paid my taxes" and I cant afford to. I have POA in place but she is still of sound mind so I cant force her hand ( she can afford ) plus there is the guilt card - "you just want to put me away "

Her parents were dead by their mid 60's, as were all her aunties and uncles so I get that she feels she is old. But Im the age of my grandparents and I feel so young and still want to live a life. Theres me and him fighting to keep ourselves fit and out of the GP's and fit to be caring for our 2 yo grandson and go on fairground rides, play footie in the garden, go to theme parks

Its not easy. Family is family and blood as they say is thicker then water and there is also cultural pressure to care for our elders

I now live in a part of the country where whole families live within the same few roads, daughters living next door to their mummies, sisters and brothers along the road, whole flipping roads taken up with one family , and admitting its pretty shit isnt the done thing so sorry if Ive allowed my own frustrations to overtake your thread

Seriously think about your family, you and dh, your children, they have to come first

Sorry just realised the part you wrote at the end, yes that’s why we got 6 wks care for my nans husband because she was in hospital & SS deemed our priority was her care. So it’s the same situation, whilst she was in hospital they had someone take over her caring responsibilities to him but once she came out of hospital either she needed to resume his care or we needed to do it to support her. We couldn’t get any care for her as we were expected to be her carers if she still needed care. I hope that makes a little more sense lol

How does your MIL manage everyday life when she doesn't speak English?

Certain communities are quite insular and a lot of drs and the like do speak the language because they are from the same ish culture so can muddle through, if not there are interpreters or dh helps. But she’s never worked, guess you could say by choice, if it were me, Id clean, sew clothes etc before I left my child go to school with holes in his shoes and clothes

I guess the big irony here is we asked MIL to help with childcare one day a month and she said she didn’t want to, fine her right, but it’s given and take really. One day a month

and I should say, when a lot of people from your community live where you do, there’s less of an impetus to ‘integrate’ or learn the language, similar to expats in Spain etc

Sure. Not Tory specific - just another way of delivering social / assisted living housing

It doesn't matter what his culture is, you don't have to agree to either his or your Mum living with you

Who won't let you view a house? Why do they need to know you have 2 houses to sell?

I’ve answered this a a few times. The estate agents asked; maybe I could’ve been dishonest but either way would present problems, they wanted first time buyers ideally or people out of the chain.

but I’ve realised the big house now was basically blinding me. I’ve shown DM 2 bed bungalows she can get in the area, she seemed amenable to them. And we’ll likely move to a bigger house if we have another child with the potential if absolutely necessary to convert/ build a small annex which she’d have to pay for

So??

God these threads depress me. OP's mother cared for her as a baby and raised her. Loved her. Worked hard for her. And now she is old and needs caring for. Why shouldnt the kids help? Why not? So what if its hard? Life is sometimes hard!! Newborns are hard!!! Still do it? When mothers have children we say it needs a village... so caring for an elderly parent needs a village too!!

OP can do it IF she wants to but nobody has to care for anyone but their own children.
We don't actually know if OP's Mum did any of those things either

Maybe read the thread.

You don't know what OPs mother did or didn't do for her, and even if she was the best mother in the world it doesn't give her the right to OPs time or home. Do people really have children to hold it over them later? That's depressing to me, your children didn't ask you to have them, that wasn't the deal.

And what we know of OPs MIL is she has never worked, didn't provide for her child and he went hungry and without proper clothes as a child, and she refused to help OPs family with one day of childcare. Why does OP owe her housing or care, under your logic?

Im not talking about MIL. Im taking about her DM

And its not about holding it over your children! But there is give and take. Children have a duty too. And yes, caring for parents is a duty!

But if OP has her mum live with her, her DH will.expect the MIL to too. So it's both or neither. And by your logic MIL isn't owed.

I don't agree children have a duty to care for their parents. I'd never want my children to feel beholden to me to the detriment of their own lives, I want them to be happy and live the lives they choose. OP doesn't want to spend her entire life as a carer, and that's a reasonable thing to not want.

Caring for an elderly parent needs a village too!!

Which is all very well if a "village" is available, @DaringlyDizzy, which TBF can be pretty common among asian families

Unfortunately in OP's it seems this isn't the case and that all the care would fall to her - and her DH's claim that he'd bear the brunt can safely be ignored, since it's almost unthinkable that a man from this culture would carry out intimate tasks for his DM/MIL even if he was around 24/7

This ^

You put your home up for sale and buy somewhere bigger etc if that is what you want to do

Your mother sells her property and buys or rents a property near to you in sheltered accommodation. That way keeps her independence and you stay tolerant of each other. Living with a parent, even in an annex isn't a great idea unless you really really get on very well

In all honesty if I had had to do this for my father - I would have done. We got on like a house on fire and communicated well.

I would have brought a house with land enough to place a static caravan in the garden. Seriously we have a static caravan park nearby to us now and its full of older people 65+ the homes are warm, cosy and easy to make luxury little palaces to live in.

It would solve your problem of having to sell both homes at once
https://www.omar.co.uk/buying-guide/buying-for-your-own-land/buying-for-your-own-land-planning-guidance-residential-annexe/

You can pick up a static caravan from between £25k to £60k

sorry but that’s racist.

you dont know my husband, you can’t assume what he’s like based on what you think you know of cultures similar to his

OK, well looks like your choice is to risk either that or being the one who changes her incontinence pads for years. Your preference. I know you said she doesn't speak English so would be difficult for you to be her carer, but see how much that matters if the need arises.

My mum actually abused me, for years.

but I think this premise is fundamentally flawed because our society exists with a model for raising children, that allows it to be done without having to give up work and basically become impoverished, maternity leave, nursery, funded hrs, school etc and as the child grows the more able they become but it’s not the same for an older relative. We’ve seen on the thread, that as soon as family is around, the state wash their hands of responsibility and refuse to provide much needed support. As people have attested it’s impossible to work ft and care for someone, but carers allowance is peanuts. I don’t think both scenarios there are created equal.

but yes I do feel a moral responsibility, to help my mother, despite her childhood (teen mainly ) treatment of me. But what this thread has helped me understand is that, it shouldn’t be at the detriment of me. I can help, support and be present and maintain my sanity. A small bungalow close ish seems like a good option to me

This is a great point. A 15 year gap isn't sufficient for anyone to assume DM will have no need of care by the time the issue of MIL moving in is raised.