To think incompetent hypocrite Starmer has lost the respect of the people and his own party in record time?

[TealTraybake]

An excoriating letter from Rosie Duffield who resigned today..

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/rosie-duffield-resignation-letter-starmer-labour-b2620603.html#comments-area

Been bad enough for her to resign, I wonder what will happen next. Does she know something we don’t?

👏👏👏 Couldn’t have put it better myself.

Bullshit.

https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/success-rates

Success rates for claiming PIP.
Drug Misuse 56.90%
Alcohol Misuse 61.60%

I’d imagine PIP was granted for ill health resulting from alcohol and drug misuse. Not just here’s a few quid, go and buy yourself some cans.

Benefits are out of control in this country. It was never meant to be this way.

That’s from a list of conditions and their success rates for PIP. Most of the disabilities claimed for have similar success rates but unless you know the actual numbers of people applying with those disabilities it doesn’t mean much. If only four people have applied for a certain condition and three have been successful that gives a success rate of 75%. Doesn’t mean that a benefit designed for disabled people is overrun with alcoholics and drug addicts however much you’d like that to be true.

Absolutely spot on. The people I’ve supported in their applications for PIP and other disability/sickness benefits have applied and been successful because of the long term health consequences of their addictions.

If you read the webpage it makes clear that the main condition is listed.

"The DWP record every successful PIP claim under one of over 500 different health conditions, depending on which one they think is your main source of points."

So, for example, alcoholics would claim under 'alcohol misuse' until they've fucked their liver and then they'd claim for:

Liver Failure - Features Of - Other / Features Not Known 68.40%

There are some real beauties in that list:

Writer's Cramp 29.40%
Acne Vulgaris 19.70%
Cleft Lip 52.60%

I'm not doubting that they're unpleasant conditions, but I'm not sure why they would require regular cash payments from the government.

We're going seriously off topic for this thread, but I think it's a bit naïve to think that all PIP payments are essential life sustaining lifelines and there isn't an element of 'free money' being claimed.

In fact, some people are being paid for faking illnesses.
Munchausen Syndrome 57.10%

https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/conditions/munchausen-syndrome/overview/

Writer’s cramp?

You’re talking shite. PIP isn’t paid because illness is unpleasant, it’s paid because of the likelihood of that illness incurring significant extra costs. Munchausen’s Syndrome is not ‘faking illness’, its a serious mental health condition, and if you look up writers cramp you’ll find it’s linked with, and is a common symptom of several severe autoimmune conditions - not just a hurty wrist from writing too much. And as already pointed out unless you know the actual numbers applying the figures mean nothing.

If Autoimmune was the dominant illness, it would be listed under autoimmune.

Autoimmune (Idiopathic) Thrombocytopaenic Purpura (ITP) 42.90%
Autoimmune Disease - Other / Type Not Known 60.70%
Autoimmune Hepatitis 45.50%
Cirrhosis - Autoimmune 54.50%

I’m probably not the right person for you to lecture about PIP.

This thread isn't about PIP and I've already said we're getting off topic, but I was engaging with a previous poster that mentioned an alcoholic claiming mobility PIP and another poster that DECLARED IT TO BE A LIE (in all caps).

It is clear that alcohol and drug misuse does result in successful PIP applications, so perhaps we can leave things there and get back to how crap Keir is?

Anyone who thinks people are awarded PIP because they experience cramp after writing a letter should claim PIP for terminal stupidity.

The disability benefits bashing on MN has been off the scale recently. It is abhorrent that MN allows it.

I’m very familiar with that list thank you - came up almost daily in my work. It was never intended for the type of over simplified extrapolation you’re indulging in here. Giving up now. Can’t be arsed arguing with the lazy and incorrect use of statistics instead of coherent argument based on understanding of the subject at hand.

Enhanced mobility is not awarded simply because a person misuses alcohol or drugs. It is the effect their illness has on them which will determine whether such an award is made.

But as @Rosscameasdoody says, it is pointless arguing with people who have no clue about the PIP system.

Go back and look at the post l disagreed with. It implied that PIP was paid to support the addiction, which is utter nonsense. Hence the capitals. Do you really think that DWP tell claimants ‘yep you’re an alcoholic - here’s a PIP award, get down the off licence and buy yourself a few cans’ ? If you have to invoke a statistical list that gives percentages of successful claims without the actual figures involved or detail about the level of awards and how they were determined, then you really don’t know enough about PIP to be commenting.

Are you Rachel Reeves?

Oh fgs get off your high horse and use your common sense 🙄

Would a drug addict have to stop using to make a successful claim? Would there be any oversight to prevent them spending the money on drugs?

Why do these PIP arguments go round and round in never decreasing circles? Can we get back to the subject of the thread?

Am doing. Have done during 15 years supporting disabled people into work and navigating the benefits system. Worked within the Equality Act every day. And in all that time I’ve never come across anyone, let alone someone with a disabled close relative, who would even think of suggesting a two tier system in which we ignore actual legislation whenever it suits us. The equality Act is there to protect the rights of all disabled people, all the time, not to be disregarded whenever we feel the situation doesn’t warrant that protection.

A bit like WFA. People can argue about pip all they like. Doesn’t matter when the state outgoings are so high and not enough people working to pay for it all. It’s a moot point.

Actually, when it comes to matters of national security where life/death decisions are made - these posts are exempt from the equality act. People have to be fit to hold the position and all that comes with it. Many other professions also have these exemptions such as fit to teach criteria - although not as extreme as vetting. It’s just common sense.

Most of the claimants I’ve been involved with have had outreach workers or other forms of support, and sometimes there is social services support. All have been under medical supervision, both for the addiction itself and for the treatment of the many resulting health conditions. So there is oversight and supervision yes.

Starmer is out his depth and shouldn’t be PM.