SAHMS ON MN

[UBIA]

This is supposedly a site for mums - all types of mums.

On such a website, why is there so much hate and vitriol against mums who choose to SAH for a while?

The usual excuse for the storm of reactions is about financial vulnerability. Ok, I get that. But what if they're not financially vulnerable? How would you know? Bring a SAHM might have made you financially vulnerable - but you can't extrapolate that onto everyone else.

Why do people give anecdotes about some friend or their mother who was bored / insane / husband had an affair etc? Why? This is like saying "My friend had a job but she got depressed." So what? Also, if men are going to cheat, that's what they'll do anyway. Anyone can cheat in any type of marriage.

Why do people assume SAHMs are there for housework purposes? That depends on where / how they live and if they have cleaners, just like anyone else.

Why di people tell SAHMs their marriages are not 'equal?' Equality is about mutual respect. It has nothing to do with what job you do or money.

Frequently, people will say things like," Well, after my divorce the fact I was working meant I wasn't screwed." Ok, this is good obviously, but also, that's just you. How do you know the financial circumstances of anyone else - working or not? And why do you assume people haven't factored this sort of thing in?

Dime SAHMs will be screwed after divorce, sure. But others will not be. It depends on so many factors. Just like it does for anyone who works - it's all relative and completely circumstantial.

It is very odd that in a site for mums, the only mums that seem acceptable are the ones who don't SAH! MN is not like real life at all in this respect, it's very extreme (as I read it) because I don't know anyone in real life who makes assumptions about SAHMs or who would even care about this for 3 seconds. AIBU to think MN should be more open-minded and just live and let live without all the crazy assumptions.

No, I can understand perfectly. I just don't think it's sensible to hook your entire life and retirement on a partner.

People are cheating on one another all of the time - you're absolutely right. These things go on in all families. Hence why chaining yourself to the house and relying on another person isn't a good idea. Besides, it doesn't have to be a PT job. There are afterschool clubs, WFH options. How else do you think full time working families collect their kids from school?

Do you know the financial plans of all of these housewives? I can't say I do, but I do hear an awful lot about the devastating effects divorce can wreak upon women who stayed at home for years and gave up all working.

People can do what they like. But it's not wrong to point out the pit-falls.

But it’s like the attitude that the only worthy jobs are high paid jobs and that STEM subjects are the only important ones. That really annoys me.

My MiL was a SAHP, it wasn’t until her husband has an affair and left for the OW she had to get a job but only ever would accept PT roles around her son. who went to boarding school I’ve no idea what she did with her days. Even once he was 18 she never really got a job.

The irony is she will tell her son to make sure i don’t take advantage or it’s unfair that he has to pick the kids up ….i work FT we’ve always been equal but his Mum is terrified that i may take advantage of her son. & that is why I’m LC with her :) It’s odd as she was a SAHP but would be terrified if I was because then he would have to support me apparently!

SouthLondonMum22
"It isn’t going to be the best start for a child if the mother is utterly miserable."

I totally agree with this 100%. I also think that the 'SAHM model' is ok if the alternative would make a mother utterly miserable (and they can afford it), Every family has the right to decide this for themselves. I don't know how anyone can think otherwise.

See! Already there are so many posts of these superior feeling working mums with snide jibes about relying on a partner for a few years. So sad. You are in no way superior if you go to work.

I feel very isolated now as I avoid situations and conversations 1) due to my difficulties and 2) due to judgement. It’s lonely on top of everything else

Personally I disagree.
I think the optimum is both parents sharing the care of their children and WOH and being supported to do this.
Children benefit massively from being cared for by their fathers ( assuming M/ F relationship) or by both parents /GPs etc
The family unit benefits from the unity and flexibility of the mutually supportive roles and the way parents are viewed in society.

The man with a big job/ SAHM is not the healthy model its made out to be .

I'm not from the UK and both parents taking an equal part in children's upbringing leads to equality in all areas of life being the norm

It's this kind of attitude that drives a wedge between SAHMs and working Mums.

I can say very safely that me being a SAHM would not have been in the best interests of me or my daughter. Partly because she's very sociable and the choices at that time were nursery or life in lockdown, and partly because she really likes things like having enough to eat and a roof over her head.

Nobody is 'chaining themselves' to anywhere. If individual women decide, in their specific circumstances, that they have enough financial security (short and long term) to be a SAHM, then that's it. Say no more. Nobody is 'living off' anyone, it will be a matter of family wealth and assets and these will be joint, with provisions made for everyone. Families know their own financial business and resilience and it's up to them to plan with all the things you mention in mind, @GiddyRobin.

I had a big fall out over this with my brother. It is just like people don't believe me when really I think they're lucky

Why would you think SAHMs don't get out of bed first thing?! Some of us have children who wake at 5am... my wife (who works) gets to lie in until 6am!

Also, what do you mean by "have a weekend off"? Off work? Surely that's what a weekend is?

Fair and I've seen the sort of comments and they are completely shitty.

I would still argue the the perspective of working mothers are the default on this site and working mothers are the majority in society now. I personally feel working mothers are generally more respected - though I'll see once I'm back in the workforce.

I think the shitty comments about SAHM can sting because you have a slight 'oh fuck, is this what people think?', whereas I think the nasty posters who make comments about kids being raised in nursery represent a diminishing portion of real society - a bit like breastfeeding cranks. So few women breastfeed for an extended time and then of those only a few are that really militant about it, why pay it much mind?

Ahh, you're right. That's why so many women are devastated by the ripples of divorce, and scrabbling to find enough money to keep afloat. Because all men who agree to have their wives stay at home are really nice, play fair, and make sure their future infidelity is financially beneficial to their wives. And that's if they're married.

Gotcha! I must have been speaking to the wrong people whose lives turned upside down. You obviously have more insight into this.

I think people would be wise to realise that every family has differing needs, personalities,support and outlook on life.
Also where are the posters saying SAHD are optimum or WOHD?
Do men get flack all the bloody time ?
No they get praised for going to work or changing a nappy ( big wow)
It's 2024 not 1950

Of course every family has the right to decide for themselves.

But if they bring the decision to somewhere like AIBU, a discussion and debate is always going to happen because it’s AIBU. It would be a very boring place otherwise.

@GiddyRobin - of course there are decent men and families with SAHMs who respect each other and know what they are doing and why and what they are about.

There are decent men in all kinds of family scenarios, as well as nightmare ones in all kinds of family scenarios. There is no model of family life that can avoid this - it's about personality and mutual respect, All I'm saying here is don't assume. Never assume anything about any group of people. Take everybody in an individual basis and if they tell you they are fine, just accept that.

True!

Yes, of course there are. No one is saying that there are no decent men. I trust my husband and honestly don't believe he'd ever betray me, but you know what? I'd still never take that risk. People are strange sometimes. I've seen the absolute perfect marriages fall apart at the seams because of one choice.

People are free to do as they please. You seem quite bent on this idea that there's judgment going on. I'm not judging anyone; I'm making the point that throwing all of your eggs into someone else's basket isn't safe.

Your arguments keep pushing this "live and let live" thing. Most people do just that. But if you come online and ask opinions about a particular topic, people are going to give them to you. The women I know who point out the precarious financial situations don't do it out of judgment, they do it out of concern. Isn't that what women should be doing? Or would you prefer if we all just nodded along?

Everyone is devastated by divorce and most people come out poorer from divorce than they were as a couple.

Ironically the two people I know who have done best financially from divorce, one female one male, were SAHP who never worked. That is a circ in which you can get awarded maintenance.

I'm making the point that throwing all of your eggs into someone else's basket isn't safe

That’s true of marriage itself though.

Personally I think the greatest danger to women in this context is not being financially savvy. It’s financial naivety that kyboshes so many women’s finances whether working mother, sahm or somewhere in between.

Of course they are and of course they do. But a woman who hasn't worked in yonks and has no job prospects or financial fall back, no money for a decent lawyer, and a spiteful STBXH isn't in the best position. And it's worse if they're not married, too.

Obviously, there are going to be outliers. That goes without saying. But it's still a well known issue and people pretending it doesn't happen are being disingenuous.

@ShillyShallySherbet "So you’ve had 40 years of being a parent to young children?"

No.The two roles were sequential, not concurrent. And the children were not young for the whole 20 years.

If individual women decide, in their specific circumstances, that they have enough financial security (short and long term) to be a SAHM, then that's it. Say no more.

But it is a position of extreme privilege to be able to make that choice. Most families will have it dictated to them by circumstance - some parents will want to return to work but cannot, some will want to stay at home but cannot. Choice is available to very few.

Some people don’t choose to be a stay at home mum though do they? For some they don’t earn enough to cover childcare so they would be working at a loss to pay for nursery and they don’t have anyone who can support them with their responsibilities at home to enable them go go back to work.

Other people's marriages or lifestyles don't impact me in any way.

So that's why you posted your OP. LOL