Finding it difficult to be friends with a depressed person

[Lamaswithhats]

I feel awful writing this. I have been friends with her for about 5 years and for all of those years she has struggled with mental health problems. I have always been there for her and supported her. I’ve turned up when she’s called me at 1am because she thinks she’s going to hurt herself, I answer every phone call, every text message, and try my best even though I don’t fully understand what she’s going through or what I should do to help.

It’s starting to have a negative impact on me and my life now. I know that she can’t help it, and she’s already lost a friend over it this year. Her friend told her she can’t be friends with her anymore because she’s too negative. She just cut her off. I would never do that to her, but I have to admit that she is draining me. I have to mentally prepare myself to talk to her. She texts me every single day and it’s always about negative or upsetting things. I know as soon as her name comes up on my phone I will have to have a long conversation with her, trying to calm her down. Especially because she has no one else. Many nights I have to take myself upstairs to speak to her for hours while my husband is downstairs. He will shout up and ask me if I’m coming back down to watch the rest of the film (for example) and I have to say no I can’t. She texts or calls me at least three times a week saying she is going to hurt herself. When she first started doing this I panicked, I would call her mum or her friends that live closer to her, I’d drive over to hers myself and find her etc but she’s been doing this 2 or 3 times a week for about 2 years now and I am exhausted with her. I have my own family and friends and my own life and this is really affecting all of those things as well as my friendship with her. I paid for us to go on holiday together this year, I asked her first whether she would like it and be up for it and she said yes, but she was miserable the whole time and moaned and complained about every little thing. We got home and she broke down crying apologising to me. I know that she can’t help it but I can’t carry on like this forever with her. Does anyone have any advice please?

All the best, OP.

I found that talking about new boundaries from the angle of my own feelings and needs helped to avoid it getting heated or turning into a debate. I’m sure you would do that anyway though as you sound really kind and sensitive to her struggles.

She is particularly lucky to have you given the fact this has been going on since pretty much day one of your friendship. I can see what she gets from your friendship but not so much the other way around.

This is not unusual. The problem is that therapy only works when the patient is engaging and taking responsibility for recovery. Calling a therapist at 1am is hugely inappropriate and she needs to contact relevant crisis organisation which are available at that time in the night.
One of the greatest difficulties carers (and yes, you have become her carer) experience is inability to set boundaries. It always seems like too high of a risk to say no or to ignore a phone call. Yes, they threatened suicide for 5 years but what is this time is the time they will carry out the threat... The uncomfortable truth is that, yes, it may happen but it is the person who has capacity to make this decision about their life, not you. I had people screaming on the phone to me saying that if I hang up, they will kill themselves and it will be my fault. My answer is always the same "No, it won't be. You are the only person who can make this decision about your life".
The bottom line is that you are not actually helping her. You can't. Only she can. And by being there on demand you are not giving her any opportunity to develop distress tolerance skills. Pull back. You don't have to go no contact but set boundaries - one call a week, three texts between 8am and 8pm or something. If she needs to speak to someone outside this time frame, there is crisis line and GP.

Sounds more like she had some kind of personality disorder to me tbh.

She enjoys the attention and having everyone walk on eggshells.

It’s not a friendship from how you describe it. She’s using you as an unpaid therapist and has done for the whole time you’ve known her.

You’re quite judgy about her other friend walking away but you’re the one pulling away from your husband and feeling guilty engaging in your normal family life. I’d work out why you’ve allowed yourself to become so involved with someone who’s making you stressed, anxious and guilty. Who is that helping? Not you or your family, not this woman, as it’s not fixing anything.

When does she ask how you are? You must have had ups and downs in the last 5 years, does she celebrate and commiserate with you? Remember your birthday? Ever make you laugh?

Maybe she does all of those things and you feel you’re getting positives from it but it sounds unlikely and the whole thing sounds extremely unhealthy.

If her paid therapist can put down boundaries to protect themselves you can do the same. You are not responsible for her mental or physical health. She thinks she’s got you over a barrel having to answer the phone “or else…” but it’s your choice to jump and you can stop. If she cuts you off she wasn’t your friend anyway. You matter too.

I think it’s a bit like someone with an addiction, they have to want to stop drinking/gambling or whatever, no one can do that for them or help them if they don’t want to really get better. Anything you do in that situation will be pointless if they don’t want to change. There’s a lot of information out there for family and friends of addicts that might help you with the guilt part of this.

Exactly this. She's expecting far more from her therapist than any therapist would give, and she's expecting far more from you than anyone with proper boundaries would. You are actually contributing to the problem, OP, despite your good intentions. You are not responsible for her, and you are actively damaging your own life, and that of your family. As someone whose mother seemed to spend her entire life on the phone to some monologuing family member, what I taught me and my siblings was that we were less important than someone at the end of the phone making threats.

Reread @Catza 's good advice and act on it.

I know what you mean and can see what you’re saying. I don’t mean to be judgy about her friend, because I can totally see her reasoning. It’s just that she’s completely cut her off and said “I’m done with you because you’re negative and won’t be speaking to you again” and I’m just saying I couldn’t do that, yes I am willing to set boundaries, but I don’t feel like I can just tell her I’m not going to be her friend anymore. I love her, I’m close to her, and I want her to be better. I’ve realised that the current situation can’t continue and that’s I’ve allowed this to happen and that it’s a problem and I have come on here for advice on how to fix it.

When I tell her I’m sorry but I don’t know what else I can do or say to help you.. why don’t you call Samaritans or x y and z, she tells me I do help just by being there and that she feels more comforted by me because I actually care about her whereas the professionals don’t and they all just say the same rotobic things apparently. She was in hospital earlier in the year for this, and I hoped that would trigger the help that she needs but she just keeps complaining that no one cares enough to help her and take her seriously.

I would refer her to the Samaritans some nights so you can get a break. It's not fair of her to drown you like this with her problems. The reason people train to deal with mental health issues is because it is so difficult.

I know you feel so much guilt but you can't be the sole reason she doesn't hurt herself, you have done so much already and it doesn't sound like it is getting better. If I were you I would start referring her to the Samaritans on the nights you can't handle it and I would accept that she may not survive her mental health issues, and if she doesn't it is not your fault. Drowning people end up drowning those that try to save them. If you could save her you would have done it already.

Much love to you and your beautiful kind heart that has tried so hard to help. x

She probably won't take it well, but that's no reflection on you. You have to do what's right for you and your family at this point. You've given her a great deal of time and effort and none of it helps. You're just sucked into the cycle of doom. The idea that giving up another evening for her phonecalls or being there at 1am will make a difference is false, proven by the fact you've been doing it all this time and she's no better. You can't fix her and it's not your role as a friend to do so. You're not her parent or a professional. She's not being a good friend to you, and if she kicks off about this and isn't understanding, then she's the one ruining the friendship. You need to be strong and stick to your guns here.

Well, yes, of course she likes having a listening ear that she can guilt-trip and who never asks her to help herself more than she likes dealing with crisis services that have boundaries and who expect her to take a role in her own recovery. That doesn't change the fact that what she's asking of you is both impossible and damaging.

she just keeps complaining that no one cares enough to help her and take her seriously.

This in itself should tell you something, honestly.

You need to ask yourself what you get out of this, because that is what this situation is really about. Why is it so seductive for you to feel that this friend needs you?

When she says you help by being there and caring tell her that being that and caring the whole time is breaking you and you need a break. She needs to understand it's not all roses for you. If I were you I would also look up energy vampires because she seems to be sucking an awful lot of your energy.

An energy vampire is a person who drains the energy of others, either intentionally or unconsciously. The term is often used colloquially to describe someone who leaves others feeling exhausted, stressed, or overwhelmed.
Some signs of an energy vampire include:
Being overly negative: They may complain a lot, criticize others, or act like a martyr
Being a manipulator: They may use guilt, ultimatums, or intimidation to get what they want
Wanting you to be available: They may want you to always be available on their terms
Expecting you to take responsibility: They may expect you to take responsibility for them

Tell your friend you are turning your phone notifications off in the evenings from now on as you need to disconnect (from phones, not her - phrase it as healthy living step you’re taking). If she knows you’re not going to see her messages or answer the phone, she may still try but won’t feel the rejection if she didn’t know about it.

This is really good advice. And the Samaritans are definitely who she should call in the middle of the night, not you. Try and remind yourself that if she is aware of that option and chooses to call you instead, that is unfair. And if she is aware of that option and chooses to harm herself rather than use it, that is also her choice rather than your responsibility- harsh as that may seem.

I'm kind of on the other side of this so hope this is helpful.

I don't do what your friend does and my issues are very prolonged significant health struggles and everything kind of falling apart around me because of that.

I have good friends who have been supportive. They have lives of their own. I completely and totally understand that being around such sadness, depressing circumstances for so long is so difficult and drains ones spirit. I don't think any less of someone for such a natural human reaction. You aren't the problem, the illness your friend has is. And it sounds like you can't do any more.

If it's your friends path in life to eventually take her own life ( which I imagine you're worried about), then this was always always going to happen. It will have nothing to do with you. I think it's cruel to continually threaten suicide on someone. I also feel the girls pain profoundly.

You need a bit of distance, that means you just can't answer every call or text anymore. If you get texts saying I'm going to kill myself, you can only say ' go straight to A and E lovely '. And no more.

I mean this in the best possible way but as someone who has had depression in the past, I truly believe a person will only get better if they accept the help and want to get better. It’s almost like an addiction, you’re addicted to self pity in ways and unless you want to get out of the negative mindset, it doesn’t matter how much people try to help, you just won’t improve.

This is far too much for you to deal with. You have your own life and family to contend with, you can’t take on her suffering and struggles too. I know it’s difficult but you are going to have to pull back and not be so available to her. Mute the chats, switch your phone off in the evening when you’re spending time with your family. You’re going to have to because if you don’t, she’s totally going to drain the life from you until you wind up equally as depressed.

You can't make her better. Trained professionals have tried and if they can't, how can you?

You need to think about yourself and the impact this is having.

I know she's suffering but she's leeching every bit of energy you have and it must stop.

If you try to put boundaries in place you are going to get push back, probably more suicide threats. That's the time to call professionals and let them pick it up from there.

Dont underestimate the impact that this will be having on you or your family.

You cannot stop this very enmeshed dynamic without hurting her feelings, because you have both decided her feelings count more than yours.

You need to step back, not only for your own sanity and wellbeing, but also because- what you are doing is not helping, is it? If anything, having someone to moan about the other health professionals means she's not using their services as much as she could.

I don't know anyone who has a friend who dumps their feelings on someone three times a week, self-harms and sends messages and has done this for five years. She is deeply troubled, but you are not the solution or the cure.

You need to save yourself in this situation. She will either save herself or not. You being there is not saving her and it's not helping her either to rely on those who really need to be the ones helping her, the crisis team, possibly a hospital stay and so on.

Her interfering with your wellbeing has to be the boundary where you stop this unhealthy dynamic. Ask your husband to support you. She will be hurt. It will affect the 'friendship', but it is not an equal friendship anyway, it's one where you are some type of live-out therapy support person for a very troubled individual. That's not a friend's job and by doing it you may even be preventing her getting more help within the system which she is already in.

It's hard OP. I have a family member with MH issues so can't really cut them off!
But everyone is right, you need to have boundaries. One of the things I do is that if say I am watching a film or whatever, I just won't answer any calls or messages in that time. I also won't answer after a certain time in the evening. Early enough that I get time to unwind in peace before bed.

If you want to be gentle about it, you need to reduce her dependence on you. It sounds like every time she messages or calls, you come running. That needs to stop. You have your own life to live. It isn't helping you and it isn't helping her.

The other thing I do is bring in other topics of conversation. Could be anything but something to shift the focus off the other persons problems. Every time they move the conversation back to their problems, I'll be brief in my answers and move it on again. I also had to learn not to try and give any advice whatsoever as it always gets ignored!

It's not easy but I have to keep a level of emotional detachment. Ultimately, we are all responsible for ourselves. If someone doesn't want to help themselves, it's not your job to do it for them.

This is going to sound harsh, but in this kind of relationship there comes a point when you realise you are not actually helping someone recover, you are enabling them to stay unwell.
Its time to repeat what her therapist did. Say 'no I can't do that' and refer her to professional help and online support.

Have you asked her what help does she need? Or what would indicate that she is being taken seriously? Because, in my experience working in a MH setting is when you ask people these questions, they don't actually have an answer. At all.. At best they may reply with "I don't know what's available" . And that is a pretty strong indication that they are not actually motivated to recover. I am sorry if it sounds harsh but this is the reality. Because if you are motivated to recover, not only you have clarity around what helps but you also research what is available and then go and ask for it. And if people tell us talking to us helps, then the follow up question should be "how does it help". If they say "it helps because you care" it's a non-starter. If they say "It helps because, in talking to you, I can think more clearly about the problem and you can offer me a different perspective", then yes, I can work with that.
As clinicians and medics, we are trained to set professional boundaries and we are trained to leave work at work. Because if we all did what you do, we wouldn't be able to practice effectively. One can be empathetic and compassionate and have strong professional and personal boundaries. There is a reason why surgeons are not allowed to operate on family members. It's because when you are emotionally involved, you stop being objective and you can't make the right decision for the patient.
Yes, I may well believe that therapists is repeating the same thing over and over. I would imagine this is because your friend is not actually trying what the therapist suggests.
There won't be a magic thing you can say to make it easier on both of you. I suggest not giving excuse or a reason (I can't help you, I don't know what else to say) because there will always be a counter-argument from her side. You simply lay down the rules: this many phone calls, this many texts etc. and stick to it.

You might find this article useful, it’s based on the Karpman drama triangle and I think it is very reflective of what you have described to us

liminalcounseling.medium.com/identifying-the-drama-triangle-63a87dbe0470

Do you want to be friends with her because there are redeeming qualities in there somewhere? Or do you want to be friends with her out of guilt?

and I hoped that would trigger the help that she needs but she just keeps complaining that no one cares enough to help her and take her seriously

She doesn't want proper care, the care she wants is someone to rescue her. Nobody can do that.
What she really needs though is firm boundaries and someone that doesn't enable her. You think you are supporting her but in the long run you are not.

You could tell her that you're only going to see her once a week for a social meet up where you have a two way chat and some fun. and maybe one supportive phone call a week and then outside of that keep directing her to helplines. That is way more than enough any more than that and you are letting her be dependent on you wich is good for nobody.

OP you're being emotionally used by your "friend " and you can't see it.

You don't have magic powers to cure her MH issues.

You're putting her above the needs of your family.

She's got support workers, medication and still it's not enough.

I'd imagine she's had many friends that have walked away from her...to save their own MH.

I agree with this. Your friend has become dependant on you and the lines between friendship and support worker have become blurred. At this stage you are totally enmeshed - you have expressed a strong sense of responsibility towards her which exceeds normal friendship. You need to understand that you are not able to help her even with your high involvement. She will be getting a lot of advice already and needs to put some of the suggestions (self help cbt perhaps ) into practice as well as taking her meds maybe if you want to continue contact with her decide with your family what you are prepared to offer. It seems that this friendship has totally taken over for you. The realisation that no matter what you do it will never be enough needs to kick in for you though

You’ve had some good advice on here (particularly the drama triangle link).

I suspect (based on a few things that you have said) that your friend has a personality disorder rather than depression. If this is the case it’s very important for you to maintain your boundaries and step back. Explain to her that you are not going to be as available to her because you have to deal with your own things, refer her back to the advice given by professionals ‘what did your therapist say about that?’ She may well be dismissive of this but any support (if she does have a PD) should be coordinated and well planned with a crisis support plan that she has developed with them and she may want to disengage with it at times but that won’t be helpful.

In my experience the most helpful thing you can do is to be there to support them to get a life outside of their mental health - the professionals are dealing with her MH. sometimes that becomes almost an identity so people feel the need to talk about it all the time, which just makes things worse. If you want to help and you want to maintain the friendship, maybe arrange to do things, go for a walk or to a hobby group, help her connect with real life rather than just be absorbed by her mental health.